Why do people believe in hell?

[southernhybrid]

While I agree that it's likely that most Christians today do believe in a literal hell, I appreciate Politesse giving us some historical evidence that this wasn't always the case. Plus, to be perfectly honest, I'm not sure that most Christians today really do believe in hell. Sure, the fundamentalists do, but there are many moderate and liberal Christians who don't believe in a literal hell or if they do, it's reserved for people like Hitler and Trump. And Tigers, I'm not comparing the two. I'm just using them as example of two leaders who have done horrible things that don't jive with Christian morality. How about I add Jeffrey Dahmer to those who deserve some time in hell?

But, unlike that nasty paternalistic god who condemns anyone who doesn't feed his ego to hell forever, if I was the ruling goddess, I'd only put them there for a specific time. Hitler would get a few thousand years. Dalmer would get a thousand. years. Trump wouldn't get as long since he could use the insanity plea, but I'd at least put him in a cage for awhile to see what it feels like. I'm being facetious because the entire concept of a literal hell where most people end up is simply stupid. My husband told me at lunch today that if he were god, he'd send Trump to hell forever. See that. Women tend to be more compassionate than men. .

Anyone remember the movie "Bedazzled". In the movie, Satan says that he lost Mussolini at the last minute because he confessed his sins to god, and up he went to heaven. So, the fundamentalist concept of hell allows a terrible person to ask forgiveness at the last minute and they will be sent to heaven. Nice job God. A person can live a highly moral life but believe in the wrong god, so she goes to hell. A person can be a real asshole and be sent to heaven if he asks forgiveness at the last minute. At least that's what I was taught as a child. Maybe it's more like an old "Twilight Zone" episode, where a bad ass biker is sent tot he same place as two boring farmers. "One man's heaven is another man's hell". To be honest, spending eternity with nobody but fundamentalist Christians would be like hell for me. And, now, we have the Rainbow Bridge that allows our pets to cross over with us into heaven. Seriously. Dog lovers don't want to be without our beloved companions. That would be hell too. ( this thread needed some levity )

The concept of an afterlife is absurd too, but I guess some people feel the need to believe in it. Imo, it's because we humans have a tendency to deny our own mortality. My neighbor, who has no specific religion, just a bunch of assorted woo, has a really hard time believing that she won't be in some other existence after she dies. That is, as long as her dogs will be there too. It doesn't make sense because as Neil deGrasse has said, "All lives are matter". That's it. When the living matter dies, so does the rest of us. Dust to dust baby. Or to be a little more poetic...we are stardust.

 

[ruby sparks]

So if, after you die, you find that you are experiencing an endless orgasm, would you conclude that you were in heaven or in hell?

 

[funinspace]

While I agree that it's likely that most Christians today do believe in a literal hell, I appreciate Politesse giving us some historical evidence that this wasn't always the case. Plus, to be perfectly honest, I'm not sure that most Christians today really do believe in hell. Sure, the fundamentalists do, but there are many moderate and liberal Christians who don't believe in a literal hell or if they do, it's reserved for people like Hitler and Trump. And Tigers, I'm not comparing the two. I'm just using them as example of two leaders who have done horrible things that don't jive with Christian morality. How about I add Jeffrey Dahmer to those who deserve some time in hell?

And one will not find many bread crumbs in the OT to argue the modern Godly eternal Auschwitz for the masses...

But, unlike that nasty paternalistic god who condemns anyone who doesn't feed his ego to hell forever, if I was the ruling goddess, I'd only put them there for a specific time. Hitler would get a few thousand years. Dalmer would get a thousand. years. Trump wouldn't get as long since he could use the insanity plea, but I'd at least put him in a cage for awhile to see what it feels like. I'm being facetious because the entire concept of a literal hell where most people end up is simply stupid. My husband told me at lunch today that if he were god, he'd send Trump to hell forever. See that. Women tend to be more compassionate than men. .

I once read a comment somewhere that I found pretty funny/ironic, in that: the only people that should go to hell (eternal torment), are the ones who think it exists and that billions are headed there.

 

[steve_bank]

In the RCC as I remember it there is also Limbo and Purgatory.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limbo
In Catholic theology, Limbo (Latin limbus, edge or boundary, referring to the edge of Hell) is a postulated viewpoint concerning the afterlife condition of those who die in original sin without being assigned to the Hell of the Damned. Medieval theologians of western Europe described the underworld ("hell", "hades", "infernum") as divided into four distinct parts: Hell of the Damned,[2] Purgatory, Limbo of the Fathers or Patriarchs, and Limbo of the Infants. However, Limbo of the Infants is not an official doctrine of the Catholic Church.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory

Purgatory (Latin: purgatorium, via Anglo-Norman and Old French)[1] is, according to the belief of some Christians, an intermediate state after physical death for expiatory purification.[2] There is disagreement among Christians whether such a state exists. Some forms of Western Christianity, particularly within Protestantism, deny its existence. Other strands of Western Christianity see purgatory as a place, perhaps filled with fire. Some concepts of Gehenna in Judaism are similar to that of purgatory. The word "purgatory" has come to refer also to a wide range of historical and modern conceptions of postmortem suffering short of everlasting damnation[3] and is used, in a non-specific sense, to mean any place or condition of suffering or torment, especially one that is temporary.[4]
The Catholic Church holds that "all who die in God's grace and friendship but still imperfectly purified" undergo the process of purification which the Church calls purgatory, "so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven". It has formulated this doctrine by reference to biblical verses that speak of purifying fire (1 Corinthians 3:15 and 1 Peter 1:7) and to the mention by Jesus of forgiveness in the age to come (Matthew 12:32). It bases its teaching also on the practice of praying for the dead in use within the Church ever since the Church began and which is mentioned even earlier in 2 Macc 12:46.[5][6]
According to Jacques Le Goff, the conception of purgatory as a physical place came into existence in Western Europe towards the end of the twelfth century.[7] According to him, the conception involves the idea of a purgatorial fire, which he suggests "is expiatory and purifying not punitive like hell fire".[8] At the Second Council of Lyon in 1247, strong Eastern Orthodox opposition to the idea of a third place in the afterlife containing fire was one of the differences that prevented reunification with the Catholic Church. That council's teaching on purgatory made no mention of these notions,[9] which are absent also in the declarations by the Councils of Florence and Trent at which especially the Catholic Church formulated its doctrine on purgatory.[10] Popes John Paul II and Benedict XVI have declared that the term does not indicate a place, but a condition of existence.[11][12]
The Church of England, mother church of the Anglican Communion, officially denounces what it calls "the Romish Doctrine concerning Purgatory",[13] but the Eastern Orthodox Church, Oriental Orthodox Churches, and elements of the Anglican, Lutheran and Methodist traditions hold that for some there is cleansing after death and pray for the dead.[14][15][16][17][18] The Reformed Churches teach that the departed are delivered from their sins through the process of glorification.[19] Rabbinical Judaism also believes in the possibility of after-death purification and may even use the word "purgatory" to describe the similar rabbinical concept of Gehenna, though Gehenna is also sometimes described as more similar to hell or Hades.[20]

 

[Learner]

I do get a little bemused TBH (as some theists also see it) with what I would call "old mis-understandings" when Hell is thought of as a one-fits-all everlasting punishment, regardless of 'how' much one is exposed and seen to be doing bad things across the scale - i.e. from the lesser evil to the utmost extreme evil, the notion that these various levels of sins are treated and "judged exactly the the same", just as one would take to a comparison of a mere car-thief being EQUALLY piunished and marked as the same level of sin/ wickedness as a serial child killer (woe betide to the sacrificers of men, women and children to the false gods or for their cruel personal gratifications etc. & etc...).

All sinners of course are destined for death or second death as its known. Some sins are forgivable and some are not. Some will spend eternity with the most wicked (with the fallen) and some will be extinguished like a puff of smoke. The realization ( imo and sorry to say) that if God was/ is real after all, seeing for themselves .... that would itself be terrifying or perhaps there'd be such a grief with a real sense of loss....to be existing no more, after seeing all the things that was promised and written... revealed on judgement day (or there abouts).

 

[ruby sparks]

Limbo of the Infants is not an official doctrine of the Catholic Church.

Well it should be, because it definitely exists:

 

[DBT]

Whatever the early Christians happened to believe about Hell, it remains that the NT does describe judgment and punishment in terms of eternal glory for some and eternal damnation and torment for others.

 

[Learner]

Well yes, each person is judged accordingly.

 

[DBT]

Accordingly to what?

 

[Learner]

Certainly not according to your (plural) interpretation of the bible (versus mine or other theists).

 

[DBT]

Certainly not according to your (plural) interpretation of the bible (versus mine or other theists).

I don't have an interpretation. The verses describing judgment and punishment are clearly there, the verses say what they say. Anyone can read what they say.

 

[Learner]

Certainly not according to your (plural) interpretation of the bible (versus mine or other theists).

I don't have an interpretation. The verses describing judgment and punishment are clearly there, the verses say what they say. Anyone can read what they say.

We read the same book but we disagree with whats being said. Sure, anyone like you and me for instance.

 

[steve_bank]

People believe in hell because it feels good to think they are going to heaven. Without the duality heaven has no meaning.

 

[excreationist]

People believe in hell because it feels good to think they are going to heaven. Without the duality heaven has no meaning.

There is still eternal life vs annihilationism.

 

[DBT]

Certainly not according to your (plural) interpretation of the bible (versus mine or other theists).

I don't have an interpretation. The verses describing judgment and punishment are clearly there, the verses say what they say. Anyone can read what they say.

We read the same book but we disagree with whats being said. Sure, anyone like you and me for instance.

What do you believe these verses are saying;

"Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt." - Daniel 12:2

''And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.'' - Revelation 20:15


“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. - Matthew 25:41

''And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.” - Revelation 14:11

''But I will warn you whom to fear: fear him who, after he has killed, has authority to cast into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him! '' - Luke 12:5

 

[excreationist]

BTW about eternal vs limited hell, this is a good look at the "conditional immortality" side:
https://www.jewishnotgreek.com/

For a very indepth look at it:
https://edwardfudge.com/written-ministry/books/the-fire-that-consumes/

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

We read the same book but we disagree with whats being said. Sure, anyone like you and me for instance.

What do you believe these verses are saying;

"Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt." - Daniel 12:2

''And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.'' - Revelation 20:15


“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. - Matthew 25:41

''And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.” - Revelation 14:11

''But I will warn you whom to fear: fear him who, after he has killed, has authority to cast into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him! '' - Luke 12:5

I'm pretty certain it can mean whatever anyone wants it to mean, regardless of what it actually says. That's how religion works.

 

[Horatio Parker]

We read the same book but we disagree with whats being said. Sure, anyone like you and me for instance.

What do you believe these verses are saying;

"Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt." - Daniel 12:2

''And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.'' - Revelation 20:15


“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. - Matthew 25:41

''And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night, these worshipers of the beast and its image, and whoever receives the mark of its name.” - Revelation 14:11

''But I will warn you whom to fear: fear him who, after he has killed, has authority to cast into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear him! '' - Luke 12:5

I'm pretty certain it can mean whatever anyone wants it to mean, regardless of what it actually says. That's how religion works.

Yes. The point is to induce contemplation.

 

[abaddon]

I'm pretty certain it can mean whatever anyone wants it to mean, regardless of what it actually says. That's how religion works.

Yes. The point is to induce contemplation.

They're like Zen koans. The Bible's one big koan. The point of contemplating the Bible is to achieve enlightenment and give up religion.

And there it is, the BEST interpretation.

 

[Lion IRC]

So, when I read an article recently that asked why people believe in hell, I found it intriguing and disturbing. I'd like to know the thoughts of others, especially any Christian conservatives that dare to explain why they believe in hell.

I take the Bible seriously, even the parts that horrify, baffle, confound me.
That means that cherry picking is not really acceptable.
That means that hell is pack of the package, notwithstanding whatever I may feel about it.The Bible treats it seriously so I must too.

Agreed.

Also, hell is logically consistent with (theological) morality.

A God who didn't punish unrepentant evil wouldn't deserve to be called God. A law which isn't enforced isn't really a law at all.