Knife of peace in Arras, France

[Loren Pechtel]

Maybe. Then again did it even occur to you that the questioning may have prompted the attack?

Typical leftist victim-blaming.

You blamed the security service for failing to prevent the attack. Was that also typical leftists victim blaming or just plain knee jerk stupidity?

Suggesting that the questioning prompted the attack is a form of victim blaming. (The victim being France in this case.)

That is pure nonsense.

So you also have no defense to it being victim blaming.

 

[bilby]

Suggesting that the questioning prompted the attack is a form of victim blaming. (The victim being France in this case.)

Did France get stabbed?

When your accusations depend upon a category error, they're probably unjust.

The claim is the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person. I see no category here, I just see victim blaming.

Your original post said that France was the victim. The crime was a stabbing; France is not the kind of thing that can be a victim of a stabbing.

Your new claim is that "the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person".

Unless the French person who was stabbed was also the member of the security services that questioned someone, the victim and the person being blamed are different individuals.

Victim blaming requires that the person being blamed is the victim; That is clearly and obviously not the case here.

 

[ZiprHead]

Knife of peace in Chicago USA

CHICAGO (AP) — An Illinois landlord accused of fatally stabbing a 6-year-old Muslim boy and seriously wounding his mother was charged with a hate crime after police and relatives said he singled out the victims because of their faith and as a response to the war between Israel and Hamas.

 

[Swammerdami]

MUSLIM killed CHRISTIAN, and with a KNIFE, not a gun.
Derec got three hits on his Bingo card: He had to post this news item.
Maybe four hits. The killing happened in France, whose President was once a member of the Communist Paerty. (Well, maybe it was called the Socialist Party, but Derec is on record condoning the treatment of the two words as synonyms.)

Knife of peace in Chicago USA

CHICAGO (AP) — An Illinois landlord accused of fatally stabbing a 6-year-old Muslim boy and seriously wounding his mother was charged with a hate crime after police and relatives said he singled out the victims because of their faith and as a response to the war between Israel and Hamas.

Nope. No bingo hits here. Dog bites man is NOT news.
You'll need very different, less common-place, news if you want to help the Ilk with their Bingo solitaires.

 

[laughing dog]

Maybe. Then again did it even occur to you that the questioning may have prompted the attack?

Typical leftist victim-blaming.

You blamed the security service for failing to prevent the attack. Was that also typical leftists victim blaming or just plain knee jerk stupidity?

Suggesting that the questioning prompted the attack is a form of victim blaming. (The victim being France in this case.)

That is pure nonsense.

So you also have no defense to it being victim blaming.

It is called basic reasoning. As bilby pointed out, I am not blaming the stabbing victim. The French security is not a victim. Hence your claim is ABSURD.

Furthermore, you are taking my post out of context. It was a suggestion that is was possible that this killer was not planning an attack at that time, so that the french security was not negligent in letting him go. On the otherhand, if the questioning did prompt him to attack afterwards, I guess the security was negligent.

 

[TSwizzle]

In Belgium, a moped of peace, two dead;

The Euro 2024 qualifier between Belgium and Sweden was abandoned at half-time after "the players decided they do not want to continue the game, because of what happened earlier today". A UEFA spokesperson said: "Following a suspected terrorist attack in Brussels this evening, it has been decided, after consultation with the two teams and the local police authorities, that the qualifying match between Belgium and Sweden is abandoned." The shooting took place about three miles (5km) from the 35,000-seater King Baudouin Stadium shortly after 7pm - around 45 minutes before kick-off. Shortly after the shooting, a man who claimed to be the gunman released a video on social media in which he claimed to be a member of Islamic State (IS) and a "fighter for Allah". He also claimed he had carried out the attack in "revenge in the name of Muslims". One Belgium newspaper said a witness heard the shooter shout "Allahu Akbar" - "God is great" in Arabic - before the shots were fired. Belgium's National Crisis Centre raised the terror alert in the city to the highest level on Monday night. It was also moved to the second highest for the rest of Belgium.

Sky News

Europe is well fucked.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Suggesting that the questioning prompted the attack is a form of victim blaming. (The victim being France in this case.)

Did France get stabbed?

When your accusations depend upon a category error, they're probably unjust.

The claim is the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person. I see no category here, I just see victim blaming.

Your original post said that France was the victim. The crime was a stabbing; France is not the kind of thing that can be a victim of a stabbing.

Your new claim is that "the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person".

Unless the French person who was stabbed was also the member of the security services that questioned someone, the victim and the person being blamed are different individuals.

Victim blaming requires that the person being blamed is the victim; That is clearly and obviously not the case here.

Weaseling doesn't change the fact that blaming the questioning is victim blaming.

 

[laughing dog]

Suggesting that the questioning prompted the attack is a form of victim blaming. (The victim being France in this case.)

Did France get stabbed?

When your accusations depend upon a category error, they're probably unjust.

The claim is the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person. I see no category here, I just see victim blaming.

Your original post said that France was the victim. The crime was a stabbing; France is not the kind of thing that can be a victim of a stabbing.

Your new claim is that "the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person".

Unless the French person who was stabbed was also the member of the security services that questioned someone, the victim and the person being blamed are different individuals.

Victim blaming requires that the person being blamed is the victim; That is clearly and obviously not the case here.

Weaseling doesn't change the fact that blaming the questioning is victim blaming.

No one blamed the questioning.

And, if blaming the questioning is victim blaming then isn’t blaming the failure to hold or deport the perpetrator also victim blaming?

 

[Derec]

Another Islamic terrorist attack in Europe. This time, two Swedes were shot to death in Brussels.
Brussels shooting: Police shoot dead attacker who killed Swedes

The 45-year-old man, named in Belgian media as Abdesalem, was shot in a café in the Schaerbeek neighbourhood.
A third Swedish citizen was seriously injured in the attack, which took place 5km (3 miles) from the stadium where Belgium was playing Sweden to qualify for the Euro 2024 football tournament.
The victims are all men in their 60s and 70s, Swedish officials said.
The attack began at 19:00 (17:00 GMT) on Monday, when a man opened fire with an automatic rifle on the Boulevard d'Ypres - north of the city centre.
[...]
He is believed to be a Tunisian man who was in Belgium illegally, after his asylum application was rejected in 2020. Sweden's prosecutor's office said it believes he was inspired to commit the killings by the Islamic State (IS) group.
Belgian Interior Minister Annelies Verlinden said the automatic weapon found on him was the same as the one used in the attack.

The terrorist was a Tunisian fake asylum seeker whose application was rejected in 2020 but had not been deported these three years.
Europe really needs to seriously reform its migration system.

 

[laughing dog]

Another Islamic terrorist attack in Europe. This time, two Swedes were shot to death in Brussels.
Brussels shooting: Police shoot dead attacker who killed Swedes

The 45-year-old man, named in Belgian media as Abdesalem, was shot in a café in the Schaerbeek neighbourhood.
A third Swedish citizen was seriously injured in the attack, which took place 5km (3 miles) from the stadium where Belgium was playing Sweden to qualify for the Euro 2024 football tournament.
The victims are all men in their 60s and 70s, Swedish officials said.
The attack began at 19:00 (17:00 GMT) on Monday, when a man opened fire with an automatic rifle on the Boulevard d'Ypres - north of the city centre.
[...]
He is believed to be a Tunisian man who was in Belgium illegally, after his asylum application was rejected in 2020. Sweden's prosecutor's office said it believes he was inspired to commit the killings by the Islamic State (IS) group.
Belgian Interior Minister Annelies Verlinden said the automatic weapon found on him was the same as the one used in the attack.

The terrorist was a Tunisian fake asylum seeker whose application was rejected in 2020 but had not been deported these three years.
Europe really needs to seriously reform its migration system.

And you know this person was a fake asylum seeker because.....?

 

[bilby]

Another Islamic terrorist attack in Europe.

Not really "another"; It's the exact same incident that was mentioned 22 hours ago in this very thread.

A cynical person might imagine you're reporting it again in an attempt to further overinflate the issue.

Terrorism isn't a big risk in Europe, any more than gang crime is a big risk in the USA. Both are made out to be far larger than their real importance, because that's what sells "news". Particularly to people like yourself who are very obviously primed to jump all over every shred of support for your prejudices and biases.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Suggesting that the questioning prompted the attack is a form of victim blaming. (The victim being France in this case.)

Did France get stabbed?

When your accusations depend upon a category error, they're probably unjust.

The claim is the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person. I see no category here, I just see victim blaming.

Your original post said that France was the victim. The crime was a stabbing; France is not the kind of thing that can be a victim of a stabbing.

Your new claim is that "the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person".

Unless the French person who was stabbed was also the member of the security services that questioned someone, the victim and the person being blamed are different individuals.

Victim blaming requires that the person being blamed is the victim; That is clearly and obviously not the case here.

Weaseling doesn't change the fact that blaming the questioning is victim blaming.

No one blamed the questioning.

And, if blaming the questioning is victim blaming then isn’t blaming the failure to hold or deport the perpetrator also victim blaming?

Look up the quote chain. I was addressing the suggestion that the questioning caused him to attack. Now you deny that the suggestion was made.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The terrorist was a Tunisian fake asylum seeker whose application was rejected in 2020 but had not been deported these three years.
Europe really needs to seriously reform its migration system.

And you know this person was a fake asylum seeker because.....?

Note his words: "whose application was rejected in 2020".

 

[laughing dog]

Suggesting that the questioning prompted the attack is a form of victim blaming. (The victim being France in this case.)

Did France get stabbed?

When your accusations depend upon a category error, they're probably unjust.

The claim is the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person. I see no category here, I just see victim blaming.

Your original post said that France was the victim. The crime was a stabbing; France is not the kind of thing that can be a victim of a stabbing.

Your new claim is that "the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person".

Unless the French person who was stabbed was also the member of the security services that questioned someone, the victim and the person being blamed are different individuals.

Victim blaming requires that the person being blamed is the victim; That is clearly and obviously not the case here.

Weaseling doesn't change the fact that blaming the questioning is victim blaming.

No one blamed the questioning.

And, if blaming the questioning is victim blaming then isn’t blaming the failure to hold or deport the perpetrator also victim blaming?

Look up the quote chain. I was addressing the suggestion that the questioning caused him to attack. Now you deny that the suggestion was made.

Reading comprehension fail "Then again did it even occur to you that the questioning may have prompted the attack" suggests a POSSIBLE alternative, not a direct causative effect. To any quasi-literate disinterested reader, it was bleeding obvious that it was a failed attempt to show that there was a lack of information about the motive in this instance.

I noticed you did not answer my question, so I will repeat it

If blaming the questioning is victim blaming then isn’t blaming the failure to hold or deport the perpetrator also victim blaming?

 

[laughing dog]

The terrorist was a Tunisian fake asylum seeker whose application was rejected in 2020 but had not been deported these three years.
Europe really needs to seriously reform its migration system.

And you know this person was a fake asylum seeker because.....?

Note his words: "whose application was rejected in 2020".

Reasoning fail - Applications can be rejected for all sorts of reasons. A rejection does not mean the seeker was faking asylum, it means the seeker failed to make a convincing case. Without knowing the reasons for the rejection, one can speculate it this man was a fake asylum seeker but one cannot know whether he was or not.

 

[bilby]

The terrorist was a Tunisian fake asylum seeker whose application was rejected in 2020 but had not been deported these three years.
Europe really needs to seriously reform its migration system.

And you know this person was a fake asylum seeker because.....?

Note his words: "whose application was rejected in 2020".

Reasoning fail - Applications can be rejected for all sorts of reasons. A rejection does not mean the seeker was faking asylum, it means the seeker failed to make a convincing case. Without knowing the reasons for the rejection, one can speculate it this man was a fake asylum seeker but one cannot know whether he was or not.

Indeed. And the fact that he wasn't deported at that point suggests that he was appealing that decision.

It's a fundamental principle of law in a free country that everyone is entitled to appeal a decision that is manifestly unjust, or that didn't take into account all of the evidence, or that was made without due consideration for all relevant law.

I know that it pains some people to think that the law might apply equally to immigrants and asylum seekers as it does to natural born citizens, but that's actually an essential part of the same national character that those people are allegedly seeking to defend in their desire to block immigration.

There are no fake asylum seekers. If someone says they want asylum, they're an asylum seeker; The question is whether they're a qualified asylum seeker or not, and that determination is (necessarily) sometimes a long and difficult process.

You might as well talk about "fake defendants" in a bank robbery trial - people accused of robbing a bank aren't faking a defence, even if they're actually guilty - they're entitled to defend themselves, and (in many cases) to appeal if convicted. To suggest that they're only pretending to be innocent is both prejudicial and fallacious - the entire point of the legal system is to determine who is pretending, and who isn't.

 

[jab]

I never said "detained indefinitely". I said that he should have been deported once authorities found out about his Islamist extremism.
There is no absolute right to migrating into the EU, and authorities should not want until he actually commits a violent crime to spring into action.

WTF - deport people because of their ideology?

Nothing is "fool proof". But not letting Islamist migrants stay would be a good start.

Again you need to develop a fool proof method of distinguishing between “acceptable” and “ unacceptable”,

Not all immigrants are alike. Not all immigrants benefit the countries they immigrate into. EU (as well as US, Canada etc.) need to be more selective in what immigrants they accept. "Showed up at the border" should not be the chief selection criterion.

It is a necessary criterion.

but not a sufficient criterion, so what is your point?

 

[jab]

Suggesting that the questioning prompted the attack is a form of victim blaming. (The victim being France in this case.)

Did France get stabbed?

When your accusations depend upon a category error, they're probably unjust.

The claim is the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person. I see no category here, I just see victim blaming.

Your original post said that France was the victim. The crime was a stabbing; France is not the kind of thing that can be a victim of a stabbing.

Your new claim is that "the French security services questioned someone which caused him to stab a French person".

Unless the French person who was stabbed was also the member of the security services that questioned someone, the victim and the person being blamed are different individuals.

Victim blaming requires that the person being blamed is the victim; That is clearly and obviously not the case here.

Was the French govt or "France" involved in the school. Or was it a purely private, totally uncertified one. You don't seem to understand that terrorism doesn't just have individual victims; it is mean to terrorize, even "punish" society or significant segments, institutions, or identifiable groups in a society.

 

[jab]

MUSLIM killed CHRISTIAN, and with a KNIFE, not a gun.
Derec got three hits on his Bingo card: He had to post this news item.
Maybe four hits. The killing happened in France, whose President was once a member of the Communist Paerty. (Well, maybe it was called the Socialist Party, but Derec is on record condoning the treatment of the two words as synonyms.)

Knife of peace in Chicago USA

CHICAGO (AP) — An Illinois landlord accused of fatally stabbing a 6-year-old Muslim boy and seriously wounding his mother was charged with a hate crime after police and relatives said he singled out the victims because of their faith and as a response to the war between Israel and Hamas.

Nope. No bingo hits here. Dog bites man is NOT news.
You'll need very different, less common-place, news if you want to help the Ilk with their Bingo solitaires.

What are you trying to say here? Please clarify.

 

[jab]

Another Islamic terrorist attack in Europe. This time, two Swedes were shot to death in Brussels.
Brussels shooting: Police shoot dead attacker who killed Swedes

The 45-year-old man, named in Belgian media as Abdesalem, was shot in a café in the Schaerbeek neighbourhood.
A third Swedish citizen was seriously injured in the attack, which took place 5km (3 miles) from the stadium where Belgium was playing Sweden to qualify for the Euro 2024 football tournament.
The victims are all men in their 60s and 70s, Swedish officials said.
The attack began at 19:00 (17:00 GMT) on Monday, when a man opened fire with an automatic rifle on the Boulevard d'Ypres - north of the city centre.
[...]
He is believed to be a Tunisian man who was in Belgium illegally, after his asylum application was rejected in 2020. Sweden's prosecutor's office said it believes he was inspired to commit the killings by the Islamic State (IS) group.
Belgian Interior Minister Annelies Verlinden said the automatic weapon found on him was the same as the one used in the attack.

The terrorist was a Tunisian fake asylum seeker whose application was rejected in 2020 but had not been deported these three years.
Europe really needs to seriously reform its migration system.

And you know this person was a fake asylum seeker because.....?

Let me requote: "He is believed to be a Tunisian man who was in Belgium illegally, after his asylum application was rejected in 2020. Sweden's prosecutor's office said it believes he was inspired to commit the killings by the Islamic State (IS) group."