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How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

War Porn Warning: Korean and Russian soldiers being attacked by FPV drones.



Sorry about your comrades, Barbos. I suppose they meant well.
 
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DrZoidberg said:
As I understand it, in most Russians minds the Ukraine war is a civil war, where some Ukrainians have been misled to believe they are a separate nation. And Putin is now acting to unify the nation again.
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Close, but not quite. Most russians who follow this subject seriously now hate so-called "ukrainians".
We could only take certain amount of ukro-nazi BS after which we said to ourselves - these people deserve serious beating before we can start calling them "brothers" again.
The fact is, a lot of ukrainians who are above 100 IQ actually agree and hate what Ukraine has become over the course of 30 years of independence and openly mock "ukrainian" "culture". They are not represented in western media but they exist and they are quite prominent and have tons of youtube subscribers from .... Ukraine.

I think Ukrainians as people failed to build a sensible national idea and country. Hatred of your neighbor is not a good basis for building a nation. In fact it's deadly when your neighbor is way more powerful than you and when 20% of your own population is flat out associated with said neighbor, with another 30% associated slightly less.
People here get annoyed when I call that regime nazi. But these people don't have anything else. If you take away Bandera, Ukraine literally has nothing which is not related to Russia. You think these assholes would not love to add anything not nazi to their history? They willfully cancelled everyone of any prominence who wrote or spoke in Russian or who said something slightly favorable about Russia and left themselves with Bandera&Co.

I blame Russian inaction when we saw the rise on nazism in Ukraine and did nothing, hoping that if we give them more money people choose to like Russia and ignore these western funded banderites and their influence.
We should have acted way earlier in the 1990s.
 
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steve_bank said:
DR Z

Would you have been part of the appease Hitler crowd?

Hitler threatened war over the issue of the Sudetenland. On 29 – 30 September 1938 the British, Italian, French and German leaders met in Munich to discuss the issue. The Allies agreed to concede the Sudetenland to Germany in exchange for a pledge of peace. This agreement was known as the Munich Pact.
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Putin got away with Crimea, nobody wanted to make trouble over an inconsequential territory. Puyin began small incursions into Ukraine and massed troops. It was obvious what was coming. Fearing a larger war Biden appeased. He said repeatedly we have the back of Ukraine, but gave just enough weapons to stall Russia. Europe followed suit.

Biden kept saying Putin's war is an existential threat to democracies yet did little to stop the war.

If Europe along with the USA said cross the border and it will be war I doubt the war would have happened. Combined air power of the western alliance would have made short work of the Russian army.
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Ukraine had just before 2014 discovered large natural gas deposits in the sea outside Crimea. That's not inconsequential. Putin obviously attacked to prevent Ukraine exploiting that. Natural gas was also found in Donbas and Luhansk. What a coincidence that these are the regions Putin wants.
 
DrZoidberg said:
Ukraine had just before 2014 discovered large natural gas deposits in the sea outside Crimea. That's not inconsequential. Putin obviously attacked to prevent Ukraine exploiting that
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Large? you must be joking. What's next? large deposits of rare earth elements?
And he calls me conspiracy theorist.
 
It comes down to what kind of system you want to live in.

1. Austrian systems where speech and media is controlled and there are little individual rights. A police state with arbitrary arrest.

2. Liberal democracy that maximizes freedoms and attempts to limit abuse of power by government.

Barbos defends #1 and defends Putin's actions.
 
crazyfingers said:
steve_bank said:
1. Austrian systems where speech and media is controlled and there are little individual rights. A police state with arbitrary arrest.
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Austria? Austria isn't perfect but I don't think that describing Austria that way is accurate.
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It was in the late 1930s and early '40s. But I suspect that is an autocorrect corruption of "authoritarian".
 
bilby said:
crazyfingers said:
steve_bank said:
1. Austrian systems where speech and media is controlled and there are little individual rights. A police state with arbitrary arrest.
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Austria? Austria isn't perfect but I don't think that describing Austria that way is accurate.
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It was in the late 1930s and early '40s. But I suspect that is an autocorrect corruption of "authoritarian".
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Ya well, in the late '30's and early '40's Nazi Germany took it over though most people didn't mind at first.
 
crazyfingers said:
Nazi Germany took it over though most people didn't mind at first.
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It's a bit more complex than that, but yes that's what I was getting at.

The Austrians were the Nazis who were never made to apologise for their (non-trivial) part in the whole Nazi business. Hitler was Austrian...
 
steve_bank said:
It comes down to what kind of system you want to live in.

1. Austrian systems where speech and media is controlled and there are little individual rights. A police state with arbitrary arrest.

2. Liberal democracy that maximizes freedoms and attempts to limit abuse of power by government.

Barbos defends #1 and defends Putin's actions.
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Oh,I see, that's why you are supporting islamic terrorists everywhere and deaths squads in Central America.
This is all for liberal democracy.
 
Sharij is an ukrainian, comments on western Ukraine "ukrainians"
I see no way for Ukraine to coexist within one Ukraine.
I think Western Ukraine should be separated and designated for nazis. EU can have it, the rest should be in Russia

 
barbos said:
steve_bank said:
About as mature as repeatedly calling Europeans Nazis.
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First of all, you started first, second of all, I am no wrong, they ARE nazis. Third of all, not as much, way more.
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Negative. You’ve been the one on this thread throwing out the silly names. You want me to find the first post? It’s on this thread!
 
Meanwhile, US-Ukraine meeting is going on in Saudi Arabia. And the word is, americans basically relayed Russian ultimatum to Khohol delegation.
 
barbos said:
Meanwhile, US-Ukraine meeting is going on in Saudi Arabia. And the word is, americans basically relayed Russian ultimatum to Khohol delegation.
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barbos said:
Harry Bosch said:
barbos said:
steve_bank said:
About as mature as repeatedly calling Europeans Nazis.
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First of all, you started first, second of all, I am no wrong, they ARE nazis. Third of all, not as much, way more.
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Negative. You’ve been the one on this thread throwing out the silly names. You want me to find the first post? It’s on this thread!
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Nope. You started it first.
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Post #9 is when you first started calling Ukrainians and the west “Nazis”. You started your childish names for President Zelensky a few post later.
 
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