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The Remarkable Progress of Renewable Energy

Well, that's five* more fatalities than Fukushima and Three Mile Island combined.











*Four more, if you take the Japanese legal system's view that a lifelong smoker's lung cancer was due to Fukushima - if it was, it was one of the most rapid onset radiation induced lung cancers in history, but the law is, as they say, an ass.
 
Building on Disaster: Four Construction Accidents that Shook the World - Amerisure
Willow Island, West Virginia

One of the worst construction accidents in U.S. history took place at Willow Island, West Virginia in 1978. While dozens worked on a cooling tower, the scaffolding they stood on suddenly collapsed, causing 51 workers to fall to their deaths. Subsequent OSHA investigations proved that a series of errors, short cuts and accidents was responsible for the scaffolding’s collapse. In their haste to finish the project, contractors attached the scaffold to concrete that hadn’t had time to cure. Bolts were missing and the existing bolts were of poor quality. Only one access ladder was available, restricting the worker’s ability to escape. And an elaborate concrete hoisting system was modified without proper engineering review. As a result of this wholly preventable accident, a renewed emphasis was placed on safety within the nuclear construction industry, unfortunately too late for the men working that day.
 Willow Island disaster - a cooling tower of a coal-powered powerplant
 
Building on Disaster: Four Construction Accidents that Shook the World - Amerisure
Willow Island, West Virginia

One of the worst construction accidents in U.S. history took place at Willow Island, West Virginia in 1978. While dozens worked on a cooling tower, the scaffolding they stood on suddenly collapsed, causing 51 workers to fall to their deaths. Subsequent OSHA investigations proved that a series of errors, short cuts and accidents was responsible for the scaffolding’s collapse. In their haste to finish the project, contractors attached the scaffold to concrete that hadn’t had time to cure. Bolts were missing and the existing bolts were of poor quality. Only one access ladder was available, restricting the worker’s ability to escape. And an elaborate concrete hoisting system was modified without proper engineering review. As a result of this wholly preventable accident, a renewed emphasis was placed on safety within the nuclear construction industry, unfortunately too late for the men working that day.
 Willow Island disaster - a cooling tower of a coal-powered powerplant
Yeah, construction is a very dangerous industry; As is mining.

That's one reason why low energy density power generation (such as wind and solar), or power generated using bulk mineral fuels (such as coal or gas), are fundamentally more hazardous to life than high energy density generation with high energy density fuel (such as nuclear fission).

Of course, it's not the only reason why nuclear fission is far safer than any other way of making electricity; But it is a major contributor.
 
And the remarkable progress of renewable energy comes to a screeching halt.
Republicans propose gutting Biden climate bill for Trump tax cuts
80% of these tax credits have been used in Republican districts. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face. And the loss of these credits would also hit nuclear and geothermal.
At a time when we need to crank up energy production, that these assclowns would engage in such political fuckery. Why would anyone start a business in a nascent technology dependent upon a government subsidy even in the best of times knowing in less than four years the rug could be pulled out from under them? And that's where we're at.
 

Interesting. I don't recall ever reading about this limitation (lack of turbine inertia to stabilize frequency) before.
There was not enough inertia to contain the frequency shift and inverters dropped out, widening the gap between supply and demand and worsening the frequency deviation. This caused other equipment to disconnect, quickly leading to a cascading blackout. The process was too fast for grid operators to take action to contain it, due to the lack of inertia.
 

Interesting. I don't recall ever reading about this limitation (lack of turbine inertia to stabilize frequency) before.
There was not enough inertia to contain the frequency shift and inverters dropped out, widening the gap between supply and demand and worsening the frequency deviation. This caused other equipment to disconnect, quickly leading to a cascading blackout. The process was too fast for grid operators to take action to contain it, due to the lack of inertia.
It's really not been a problem before, when almost all electricity was made with big, constant speed, spinning turbines.

I have raised the issue previously in this thread, many times, and as far back as June 2018; My first mention of grid stability as a problem for renewables on this forum was in a thread about Solar Power in California, back in July 2017.

Grid stability services provided as a byproduct of constant speed turbine generators, need to be separately (and expensively) provided by other means in high wind and/or solar grids.

Most of the much hyped battery "storage" facilities are incapable of storing any worthwhile amount of energy, but are useful for increasing the stability of the grid.

Inertia is one of the best stability providers, particularly as it comes along for free with nuclear, hydro, gas, and coal power plants. But in its absence, someone has to supply stability services as an add-on.

Alternating current at grid scale is not just a matter of "Gigawatts in = Gigawatts out", And is even further from being a case of "Energy Generated in a given week = Energy Used in that week", but that's the highest level of electrical engineering "understanding" that most politicians and lobbyists can bring to the debate.

The advocates of high renewables (and even 100% renewables) grids have been warned of this issue, and have been ignoring it, for decades.

They also ignore the fact that a kWh isn't a fixed value commodity, but is rather a time dependent service. If you use 1kW every hour, and you generate 24kWh of solar electricity every day, the 3kW you generate between noon and 1pm are worth far fewer ¢ than the 1kW you consume between midnight and 1am. Indeed, the kWhs you generate are likely of negative value if you live in a place with lots of solar power. This is concealed by retail contracts that pay a price that is decoupled from the wholesale price of electricity.

Solar power generating householders here in Queensland often feel ripped off because they sell for 4¢/kWh, but buy for 35¢/kWh (for example); But the reality is that this price difference is probably unfair in the opposite direction*, and represents a subsidy of solar panel owners by consumers without solar panels. That is, the better off people, who own a house, are being subsidised by the less well off people who rent, and/or live in an apartment.

And claims of "this facility/city/factory/home/etc. uses 100% renewable electricity" are almost certainly an exaggeration, a misapprehension (or to be blunt, a lie) in almost every case - unless the system is entirely disconnected from any other generation technology for the duration of the period being claimed.

My house has 10kW of solar panels on the roof, and I generate slightly more power per year than I consume, but even if I had a home battery (there's an entire thread worth of good reasons why I don't, shouldn't and wouldn't), my power will go out if the mains trips in the middle of a sunny day, simply because the inverter cannot generate 50Hz AC without a mains connection providing a frequency to map to. Totally off-grid solar power systems do exist, but are FAR more expensive than the ones installed in most domestic suburban settings.







* Whether those prices are acually "fair", or how "unfair" they actually are, depends on exact generation and useage patterns compared to wholesale prices, and are (I suspect deliberately) hard to get a handle on.
 
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Domestic heating can be made considerably more efficient by the use of heat pumps, which can bring in significantly more heat energy than they use in electrical energy. This is achieved by scavenging energy from an external source, and many varieties exist, including air-source, ground-source (using buried pipes), water-source, and now, for the ultimate in power bill reductions, this idea from XKCD's Randall Monroe:


 
Fervo Energy Drills 15,000-FT, 500°F Geothermal Well, Pushing the Envelope for EGS Deployment
The well was drilled to a true vertical depth of 15,765 feet and is projected to reach a bottomhole temperature of 520 °F after full thermal equilibration. Fervo completed the Sugarloaf well in just 16 drilling days, representing a 79% reduction in drilling time compared to the US Department of Energy baseline for ultradeep geothermal wells.

The report confirms that the Cape Station project area can support over 5 GW of development at depths of up to 13,000 feet. The new Sugarloaf drilling results are expected to increase Cape’s resource potential even further.

Various geothermal resource evaluation and grid modeling studies – including recent reports by the US Geological Survey, Princeton University, and National Renewable Energy Laboratory – have now aligned that there are hundreds of gigawatts of opportunity for geothermal deployment in the range of 10,000 to 20,000 feet and 400 to 600 °F.

And the money is flowing.
Investors feel that enhanced geothermal has passed through the commercial valley of death and is ready for widespread commercial adoption.
Wish I had some venture capital. All I got is a checking account.
 
Building on Disaster: Four Construction Accidents that Shook the World - Amerisure
Willow Island, West Virginia

One of the worst construction accidents in U.S. history took place at Willow Island, West Virginia in 1978. While dozens worked on a cooling tower, the scaffolding they stood on suddenly collapsed, causing 51 workers to fall to their deaths. Subsequent OSHA investigations proved that a series of errors, short cuts and accidents was responsible for the scaffolding’s collapse. In their haste to finish the project, contractors attached the scaffold to concrete that hadn’t had time to cure. Bolts were missing and the existing bolts were of poor quality. Only one access ladder was available, restricting the worker’s ability to escape. And an elaborate concrete hoisting system was modified without proper engineering review. As a result of this wholly preventable accident, a renewed emphasis was placed on safety within the nuclear construction industry, unfortunately too late for the men working that day.
 Willow Island disaster - a cooling tower of a coal-powered powerplant
Yeah, construction is a very dangerous industry; As is mining.

That's one reason why low energy density power generation (such as wind and solar), or power generated using bulk mineral fuels (such as coal or gas), are fundamentally more hazardous to life than high energy density generation with high energy density fuel (such as nuclear fission).

Of course, it's not the only reason why nuclear fission is far safer than any other way of making electricity; But it is a major contributor.

I see SMRs as the bridge between two sides of the power debates. Where renewable meets reliable.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/rolls-royce-smr-selected-to-build-small-modular-nuclear-reactors

https://www.reuters.com/business/en...r-fleet-using-learnings-palisades-2025-06-05/
 

Interesting. I don't recall ever reading about this limitation (lack of turbine inertia to stabilize frequency) before.
There was not enough inertia to contain the frequency shift and inverters dropped out, widening the gap between supply and demand and worsening the frequency deviation. This caused other equipment to disconnect, quickly leading to a cascading blackout. The process was too fast for grid operators to take action to contain it, due to the lack of inertia.
The power grid is 5% science, 95% magic. ;)
 
Fervo Energy Drills 15,000-FT, 500°F Geothermal Well, Pushing the Envelope for EGS Deployment
The well was drilled to a true vertical depth of 15,765 feet and is projected to reach a bottomhole temperature of 520 °F after full thermal equilibration. Fervo completed the Sugarloaf well in just 16 drilling days, representing a 79% reduction in drilling time compared to the US Department of Energy baseline for ultradeep geothermal wells.

The report confirms that the Cape Station project area can support over 5 GW of development at depths of up to 13,000 feet. The new Sugarloaf drilling results are expected to increase Cape’s resource potential even further.

Various geothermal resource evaluation and grid modeling studies – including recent reports by the US Geological Survey, Princeton University, and National Renewable Energy Laboratory – have now aligned that there are hundreds of gigawatts of opportunity for geothermal deployment in the range of 10,000 to 20,000 feet and 400 to 600 °F.

And the money is flowing.
Investors feel that enhanced geothermal has passed through the commercial valley of death and is ready for widespread commercial adoption.
Wish I had some venture capital. All I got is a checking account.
I still don't understand how the fluid dynamics work for such a deep well. How do we use the energy that is that deep up top? IE / casing / fluids / etc...
 
Fervo Energy Drills 15,000-FT, 500°F Geothermal Well, Pushing the Envelope for EGS Deployment
The well was drilled to a true vertical depth of 15,765 feet and is projected to reach a bottomhole temperature of 520 °F after full thermal equilibration. Fervo completed the Sugarloaf well in just 16 drilling days, representing a 79% reduction in drilling time compared to the US Department of Energy baseline for ultradeep geothermal wells.

The report confirms that the Cape Station project area can support over 5 GW of development at depths of up to 13,000 feet. The new Sugarloaf drilling results are expected to increase Cape’s resource potential even further.

Various geothermal resource evaluation and grid modeling studies – including recent reports by the US Geological Survey, Princeton University, and National Renewable Energy Laboratory – have now aligned that there are hundreds of gigawatts of opportunity for geothermal deployment in the range of 10,000 to 20,000 feet and 400 to 600 °F.

And the money is flowing.
Investors feel that enhanced geothermal has passed through the commercial valley of death and is ready for widespread commercial adoption.
Wish I had some venture capital. All I got is a checking account.
I still don't understand how t, creating a heat exchangerhe fluid dynamics work for such a deep well. How do we use the energy that is that deep up top? IE / casing / fluids / etc...
Horizontal drilling, fracking, creating a heat exchanger, and a recovery well for the heated water.
 
For those that poo-poo solar and wind, did the Republicans get this one right?
Senate GOP bill spares nuclear and geothermal energy while hammering wind and solar
The Senate Finance Committee’s language would take a sledgehammer to some parts of the renewable-friendly Inflation Reduction Act (IRA) while sparing others.
Solar, wind, and hydrogen bear the brunt of the impact. On the other side of the ledger, geothermal, nuclear, hydropower, and long-duration energy storage emerge relatively unscathed. Carbon capture ended up somewhere in the middle.
 
Fervo Energy Drills 15,000-FT, 500°F Geothermal Well, Pushing the Envelope for EGS Deployment
The well was drilled to a true vertical depth of 15,765 feet and is projected to reach a bottomhole temperature of 520 °F after full thermal equilibration. Fervo completed the Sugarloaf well in just 16 drilling days, representing a 79% reduction in drilling time compared to the US Department of Energy baseline for ultradeep geothermal wells.

The report confirms that the Cape Station project area can support over 5 GW of development at depths of up to 13,000 feet. The new Sugarloaf drilling results are expected to increase Cape’s resource potential even further.

Various geothermal resource evaluation and grid modeling studies – including recent reports by the US Geological Survey, Princeton University, and National Renewable Energy Laboratory – have now aligned that there are hundreds of gigawatts of opportunity for geothermal deployment in the range of 10,000 to 20,000 feet and 400 to 600 °F.

And the money is flowing.
Investors feel that enhanced geothermal has passed through the commercial valley of death and is ready for widespread commercial adoption.
Wish I had some venture capital. All I got is a checking account.
I still don't understand how t, creating a heat exchangerhe fluid dynamics work for such a deep well. How do we use the energy that is that deep up top? IE / casing / fluids / etc...
Horizontal drilling, fracking, creating a heat exchanger, and a recovery well for the heated water.
But we are talking 15,000 feet of head, incredibly high temperatures (what is being used for casing?), and pressures.
 
Con Edison's Steam Operations is a district heating system which carries steam from generating stations under the streets to heat and cool buildings and businesses in Manhattan. Some New York City businesses and facilities also use steam for cleaning and disinfection.[1]

The New York Steam Company began providing service in lower Manhattan on March 3, 1882. By 1932, the company supplied steam to over 2,500 buildings from six steam plants, including its massive Kips Bay Station on the East River near Midtown Manhattan. It also had an agreement to obtain steam from the New York Edison Company's Waterside and Fourteenth Street electric power plants during periods of peak demand for steam, such as in the morning on days with cold temperatures.[2]

The New York Steam Company merged with Consolidated Edison on March 8, 1954.[2][3] Today, Con Edison operates the largest commercial steam system in the world (larger than the next nine combined).[4] The organization within Con Edison responsible for the system's operation, known as Steam Operations, provides steam service to over 1,700 commercial and residential customers in Manhattan from Battery Park to 96th Street uptown on the west side, and 89th Street on the east side of Manhattan. Roughly 27 billion pounds (12,000,000 t) of steam flow through the system every year.[5] The steam is produced at four plants in Manhattan and one each in Brooklyn and Queens; the primary plant is between 14th and 15th streets on Manhattan's east side. These plants boil water from the New York City water supply system, making Con Edison one of the largest users of the municipal water supply system.[1]
Steam vapor being vented through a typical Con Edison orange and white stack on Seventh Avenue at 20th Street

Steam vapor can be caused by a leak in Con Ed's steam system or by cooler water contacting the outside of a steam pipe.[6] The vapor is often vented out through 10-foot (3.0 m) orange-and-white funnels in the street, known as stacks. Over the years, the stacks have been depicted in numerous TV shows and films.[1]

Steam is a form of energy. Chemical energy in coal, natural gas, or nuclear energy in uranium goes to heat energy that goes to steam energy that does work turning a turbine that converts steam energy to electrical energy. A heat exchanger may bused to isolate the fluid circulating underground.

A simple nuclear heat exchanger could be a big block of concrete or steel. Circulate radioactive water through one side of the block and uncontaminated water on the other side.

Heat, work, and energy have the same SI units the Joule.

The Laws Of Thermodynamics apply. At every point of energy conversion losses occur. Losses multiply.

Steam tables are used to find how much work can be done with a given amount of steam at a pressure.


Pump water through a pipe underground and it heats up higher than the boiling point. Put the water trough an expansion, pressure goes down, water goes to steam.

The steam has to be cooled(condensed) back to water before being circulated down underground.

Back in the 70s I knew somebody who was buildng a DYI solar water heater. He opened a valve and the water flashed to steam giving him serious burns.
 
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