Here Comes The Left

[Jimmy Higgins]

I very much believe in excellent universal health care, my biggest concern being government intrusion into dictating medical decisions that must be left to patients and their doctors.

But you definitely believe us males don't deserve healthcare, right?

If someone can drag a male to the doctor, his medical care decisions should be determined by doctor and patient, even if he is a male*

* obviously a joke to play off of GN’s post. Also a play off of the well established among wives difficulty in convincing men they need to see a doctor ‘fact.’

Competent adults get to make their own medical decisions along with their doctors.

But then you lose all of the fun in being able to judge people! We need to know what these people are doing with their doctors so we can judge them!

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Y'all make is sound like socialism would be worse than what we have right now.

As somebody who grew up under actually existing socialism: yes, it would be worse. Much worse.

As the guy with the handle of Jimmy Higgins, I think I have at least a small understanding that the world socialism is the United States, particularly regarding economics and businesses practices is not the the Iron Curtain. The Socialist Democrat Party in 1900 had things in their platform like publicly held utility companies, unemployment insurance, workplace injury insurance, minimum wages, etc...

Most of the safety nets we have today were in some for part of the SDP platform back at the turn of the century were put into the system in one way or another over the next 60 years (SSI, OSHA).

This fear of big S socialism is immature and honestly "fucking stupid". How in the heck does anyone think the uber wealthy and powerful that own the Government will allow that to happen? Heck one of the reasons people fear the Big S is because of big business making with the Under God bullshit to help keep the expansion of protections seen in Europe into the US. It worked marvelously.

While I get nervous whenever any populist movement gains traction (populism is too easily exploited), the rise of the far left in the Democrat Party via isolated elections in Democrat strongholds seems a bit overstated. The Democrats could never win a national election with big S socialism on the platform. The suburbs are the firewall against crazy in the Democrat Party. Sadly, the same can't be said for the GOP.

 

[laughing dog]

Y'all make is sound like socialism would be worse than what we have right now.

As somebody who grew up under actually existing socialism: yes, it would be worse. Much worse.

Since there seems to be a dispute over what "real socialism" entails, in order to understand your point more clearly, which "actually existing socialism" do you mean?

 

[GenesisNemesis]

That's funny because I grew up in the evil "SOCIALIST!!!!11" state of California, doing pretty well personally.

 

[Tigers!]

That's funny because I grew up in the evil "SOCIALIST!!!!11" state of California, doing pretty well personally.

That might explain a few things then.

 

[thebeave]

That's funny because I grew up in the evil "SOCIALIST!!!!11" state of California, doing pretty well personally.

That might explain a few things then.

Hey, I grew up in California too! Don't lump us all together!

 

[ZiprHead]

What the hell is "Here Cokes The Left" supposed to mean?

 

[Tigers!]

I tend to think of myself as a centrist. My adult kids see me as fairly conservative and at least some on this board and some of my conservative friends see me as a far left radical. So I figure I’m a centrist.

That said: I believe in:

Subsidized daycare ( probably means tested) universally available. I don’t think parents ts should be compelled to put their kids in daycare but it needs to be much more accessible and affordable and frankly, for at least most people, free of charge.

I believe in free education for all from preschool through university and perhaps graduate school/professional schools. States have pulled back funding from state universities. This is a significant factor in the rising cost of college and enormous crippling student debt. The biggest concern I have is that government tend to want to control what they fund. I absolutely believe 100% in academic freedom just as I believe 100% in free speech, and freedom of/from religion.

I further believe that the government must not fund private or religious schools at any level.

I very much believe in excellent universal health care, my biggest concern being government intrusion into dictating medical decisions that must be left to patients and their doctors.

If the government is funding healthcare, which is what the universal means (I presume), then the government is already intruding. You are just arguing about where it should, or should not, intrude more.
Remember the golden rule - "Whoever has the gold makes the rules".

I believe in affordable and excellent services for disabled and elderly—including housing and nutrition support, with a focus on helping older adults age in place but also having excellent options if staying at home is no longer desirable or possible.

I believe in strong infrastructure ( all of what I mentioned is infrastructure) including water, transportation, power. Good government services, support for mental health and addiction, law enforcement, social workers/mental health professionals, etc.

American workers NEED more time off. I think that perhaps a 4 day/32hr work week would help but so would having at least 30 vacation days plus holidays plus generous medical and family leave. A year leave ( minimum) after the birth or adoption of a child, plus expanded family leave for ill, injured or disabled or elderly family members).

We also need to more more forcefully away from consumerism and focus more on enjoying our lives rather than the small jolts of endorphins that come from making online purchases.

All of them sound so wonderful. Has to be funded somehow though.

 

[Tigers!]

Y'all make is sound like socialism would be worse than what we have right now.

What socialist countries, past or present, would you say is/was better off than the US with regard to the economy, freedom, opportunities and human rights then ours right now?

Norway, Sweden, Denmark......hell even the UK and France are BETTER than what we have here in the US.

Sweden? Hmm
EU? Hmm

How you ever seen soccer fans rioting in Europe?

 

[laughing dog]

What the hell is "Here Cokes The Left" supposed to mean?

I wager it is supposed to be the porno sounding " Here Comes the Left".

 

[GenesisNemesis]

That's funny because I grew up in the evil "SOCIALIST!!!!11" state of California, doing pretty well personally.

That might explain a few things then.

You just don't like that I actually think critically about stuff and you don't.

 

[Toni]

I very much believe in excellent universal health care, my biggest concern being government intrusion into dictating medical decisions that must be left to patients and their doctors.

But you definitely believe us males don't deserve healthcare, right?

If someone can drag a male to the doctor, his medical care decisions should be determined by doctor and patient, even if he is a male*

* obviously a joke to play off of GN’s post. Also a play off of the well established among wives difficulty in convincing men they need to see a doctor ‘fact.’

Competent adults get to make their own medical decisions along with their doctors.

But then you lose all of the fun in being able to judge people! We need to know what these people are doing with their doctors so we can judge them!

We still get to do that when people overshare re: medical conditions

Insurance companies have no business doing it .

 

[thebeave]

I tend to think of myself as a centrist. My adult kids see me as fairly conservative and at least some on this board and some of my conservative friends see me as a far left radical. So I figure I’m a centrist.

That said: I believe in:

Subsidized daycare ( probably means tested) universally available. I don’t think parents ts should be compelled to put their kids in daycare but it needs to be much more accessible and affordable and frankly, for at least most people, free of charge.

I believe in free education for all from preschool through university and perhaps graduate school/professional schools. States have pulled back funding from state universities. This is a significant factor in the rising cost of college and enormous crippling student debt. The biggest concern I have is that government tend to want to control what they fund. I absolutely believe 100% in academic freedom just as I believe 100% in free speech, and freedom of/from religion.

I further believe that the government must not fund private or religious schools at any level.

I very much believe in excellent universal health care, my biggest concern being government intrusion into dictating medical decisions that must be left to patients and their doctors.

If the government is funding healthcare, which is what the universal means (I presume), then the government is already intruding. You are just arguing about where it should, or should not, intrude more.
Remember the golden rule - "Whoever has the gold makes the rules".

I believe in affordable and excellent services for disabled and elderly—including housing and nutrition support, with a focus on helping older adults age in place but also having excellent options if staying at home is no longer desirable or possible.

I believe in strong infrastructure ( all of what I mentioned is infrastructure) including water, transportation, power. Good government services, support for mental health and addiction, law enforcement, social workers/mental health professionals, etc.

American workers NEED more time off. I think that perhaps a 4 day/32hr work week would help but so would having at least 30 vacation days plus holidays plus generous medical and family leave. A year leave ( minimum) after the birth or adoption of a child, plus expanded family leave for ill, injured or disabled or elderly family members).

We also need to more more forcefully away from consumerism and focus more on enjoying our lives rather than the small jolts of endorphins that come from making online purchases.

All of them sound so wonderful. Has to be funded somehow though.

She left out free ice cream.

 

[Toni]

I tend to think of myself as a centrist. My adult kids see me as fairly conservative and at least some on this board and some of my conservative friends see me as a far left radical. So I figure I’m a centrist.

That said: I believe in:

Subsidized daycare ( probably means tested) universally available. I don’t think parents ts should be compelled to put their kids in daycare but it needs to be much more accessible and affordable and frankly, for at least most people, free of charge.

I believe in free education for all from preschool through university and perhaps graduate school/professional schools. States have pulled back funding from state universities. This is a significant factor in the rising cost of college and enormous crippling student debt. The biggest concern I have is that government tend to want to control what they fund. I absolutely believe 100% in academic freedom just as I believe 100% in free speech, and freedom of/from religion.

I further believe that the government must not fund private or religious schools at any level.

I very much believe in excellent universal health care, my biggest concern being government intrusion into dictating medical decisions that must be left to patients and their doctors.

If the government is funding healthcare, which is what the universal means (I presume), then the government is already intruding. You are just arguing about where it should, or should not, intrude more.
Remember the golden rule - "Whoever has the gold makes the rules".

I believe in affordable and excellent services for disabled and elderly—including housing and nutrition support, with a focus on helping older adults age in place but also having excellent options if staying at home is no longer desirable or possible.

I believe in strong infrastructure ( all of what I mentioned is infrastructure) including water, transportation, power. Good government services, support for mental health and addiction, law enforcement, social workers/mental health professionals, etc.

American workers NEED more time off. I think that perhaps a 4 day/32hr work week would help but so would having at least 30 vacation days plus holidays plus generous medical and family leave. A year leave ( minimum) after the birth or adoption of a child, plus expanded family leave for ill, injured or disabled or elderly family members).

We also need to more more forcefully away from consumerism and focus more on enjoying our lives rather than the small jolts of endorphins that come from making online purchases.

All of them sound so wonderful. Has to be funded somehow though.

The government should require that medical professionals are appropriately credentialed, hold appropriate licensure and belong to the appropriate professional associations and adhere to accepted courses of treatment t and practice in licensed facilities.

You bring up my only concern: politically motivated overreach.

 

[Tigers!]

Y'all make is sound like socialism would be worse than what we have right now.

What socialist countries, past or present, would you say is/was better off than the US with regard to the economy, freedom, opportunities and human rights then ours right now?

Freedom and opportunities are such vague terms. I certainly value the freedom and opportunity to be shot by an ICE Agent who will never face any consequences. Does that count as a human right for me, or the ICE agent? If rights were really an issue, I would have become President and become above the law which the rest of us are subject to, but that's a very limited opportunity. I have a better chance of becoming and ICE agent.

As for the economy, I have no complaints, especially since I'm not one of the 4 out of a 1000 infants who died before my first birthday. Having made it past that hurdle, I've managed to avoid medical expense related bankruptcy.

I consider myself one of the fortunate ones to have been born in a place, time and circumstances which allowed me to prosper, and when problems arose, I could afford the insurance to pay the hospital and doctors who kept me alive. It wasn't because of any economy, freedom, opportunities, or human rights. I just got lucky.

Nobody, including me is saying the US doesn't have its share of problems. Always have, always will. You did not answer the question I asked, though (see bold). Do you have even just one in mind?

Since you have declared Norway, Sweden, and Finland off limits for answers, I'm at a loss to counter your straw man argument.

It seems like being the biggest economy on the planet, while losing 4 out of 1000 babies is more than our share, but if it's one of those "have and always will have" problems, there's no point in looking at the countries that are doing socialism wrong, but have fewer dead babies.

Do you have a link for the US maternal deaths of 4 per 1000? That does seem awful high. Though I have read that the US rate is increasing.
The WHO has the US at 21.1/100,000

 

[Tigers!]

I tend to think of myself as a centrist. My adult kids see me as fairly conservative and at least some on this board and some of my conservative friends see me as a far left radical. So I figure I’m a centrist.

That said: I believe in:

Subsidized daycare ( probably means tested) universally available. I don’t think parents ts should be compelled to put their kids in daycare but it needs to be much more accessible and affordable and frankly, for at least most people, free of charge.

I believe in free education for all from preschool through university and perhaps graduate school/professional schools. States have pulled back funding from state universities. This is a significant factor in the rising cost of college and enormous crippling student debt. The biggest concern I have is that government tend to want to control what they fund. I absolutely believe 100% in academic freedom just as I believe 100% in free speech, and freedom of/from religion.

I further believe that the government must not fund private or religious schools at any level.

I very much believe in excellent universal health care, my biggest concern being government intrusion into dictating medical decisions that must be left to patients and their doctors.

If the government is funding healthcare, which is what the universal means (I presume), then the government is already intruding. You are just arguing about where it should, or should not, intrude more.
Remember the golden rule - "Whoever has the gold makes the rules".

I believe in affordable and excellent services for disabled and elderly—including housing and nutrition support, with a focus on helping older adults age in place but also having excellent options if staying at home is no longer desirable or possible.

I believe in strong infrastructure ( all of what I mentioned is infrastructure) including water, transportation, power. Good government services, support for mental health and addiction, law enforcement, social workers/mental health professionals, etc.

American workers NEED more time off. I think that perhaps a 4 day/32hr work week would help but so would having at least 30 vacation days plus holidays plus generous medical and family leave. A year leave ( minimum) after the birth or adoption of a child, plus expanded family leave for ill, injured or disabled or elderly family members).

We also need to more more forcefully away from consumerism and focus more on enjoying our lives rather than the small jolts of endorphins that come from making online purchases.

All of them sound so wonderful. Has to be funded somehow though.

The government should require that medical professionals are appropriately credentialed, hold appropriate licensure and belong to the appropriate professional associations and adhere to accepted courses of treatment t and practice in licensed facilities.

Who provides the money for the hospitals, wages, medicine etc?

You bring up my only concern: politically motivated overreach.

Politically motivated overreach is like beauty: Always in the eye of the beholder.

 

[Toni]

I tend to think of myself as a centrist. My adult kids see me as fairly conservative and at least some on this board and some of my conservative friends see me as a far left radical. So I figure I’m a centrist.

That said: I believe in:

Subsidized daycare ( probably means tested) universally available. I don’t think parents ts should be compelled to put their kids in daycare but it needs to be much more accessible and affordable and frankly, for at least most people, free of charge.

I believe in free education for all from preschool through university and perhaps graduate school/professional schools. States have pulled back funding from state universities. This is a significant factor in the rising cost of college and enormous crippling student debt. The biggest concern I have is that government tend to want to control what they fund. I absolutely believe 100% in academic freedom just as I believe 100% in free speech, and freedom of/from religion.

I further believe that the government must not fund private or religious schools at any level.

I very much believe in excellent universal health care, my biggest concern being government intrusion into dictating medical decisions that must be left to patients and their doctors.

If the government is funding healthcare, which is what the universal means (I presume), then the government is already intruding. You are just arguing about where it should, or should not, intrude more.
Remember the golden rule - "Whoever has the gold makes the rules".

I believe in affordable and excellent services for disabled and elderly—including housing and nutrition support, with a focus on helping older adults age in place but also having excellent options if staying at home is no longer desirable or possible.

I believe in strong infrastructure ( all of what I mentioned is infrastructure) including water, transportation, power. Good government services, support for mental health and addiction, law enforcement, social workers/mental health professionals, etc.

American workers NEED more time off. I think that perhaps a 4 day/32hr work week would help but so would having at least 30 vacation days plus holidays plus generous medical and family leave. A year leave ( minimum) after the birth or adoption of a child, plus expanded family leave for ill, injured or disabled or elderly family members).

We also need to more more forcefully away from consumerism and focus more on enjoying our lives rather than the small jolts of endorphins that come from making online purchases.

All of them sound so wonderful. Has to be funded somehow though.

The government should require that medical professionals are appropriately credentialed, hold appropriate licensure and belong to the appropriate professional associations and adhere to accepted courses of treatment t and practice in licensed facilities.

Who provides the money for the hospitals, wages, medicine etc?

You bring up my only concern: politically motivated overreach.

Politically motivated overreach is like beauty: Always in the eye of the beholder.

Same as now except that there is only a single payer.

And herein lies the other problem: In the US, Medicaid and increasingly Medicare reimbursements don’t cover the cost of service provided. Private insurers follow Medicare for their reimbursement fee schedule

 

[Tigers!]

And herein lies the other problem: In the US, Medicaid and increasingly Medicare reimbursements don’t cover the cost of service provided. Private insurers follow Medicare for their reimbursement fee schedule

Same problem in Oz with our Medicare.

 

[scombrid]

The left scares me far more than the right. Mao's Cultural Revolution' comes to mind.

Tear everything down without any idea of a working system to replace it. And no experience to make it work.

Obviously changes have to e made, the income disparity that is getting worse. Social democracy lokng l[ke a slppery slope to Marxism, at least for some of hte left.

Trump and the wacky right is obviouisly attmping a kind of coup. The far left won't be any better, maybe worse given the chance..

There has been similar rhetoric from progressives here in Seattle.

A no experience PHD student endorsed by the mayor of NYC based on ideology. There is a slippery slope for you. Endorsed by a mayor whose only experience is activism, not management. Just like Trump is doing on the right.

Are we headed to full blown third world armed civil war?

https://www.cnn.com/2026/06/29/politics/darializa-avila-chevalier-communism-tweets

Deleted tweets on Darializa Avila Chevalier’s account had favorable references to communist leaders and Marxism


Darializa Avila Chevalier, the Democratic congressional nominee endorsed by New York City Mayor Zohran Mamdani, who ousted longtime Rep. Adriano Espaillat in Tuesday’s primary, maintained a since-deleted Twitter account with repeated sympathetic references to communism, Marxist ideology and Soviet figures, including Vladimir Lenin.

Avila Chevalier, a sociology PhD student whose victory sent shockwaves throughout the Democratic establishment, has been under fire for a since-deleted Twitter account, previously reported by CNN, that included phrases such as “seize the means of production,” along with calls to abolish police, prisons and borders. Other controversial tweets include one that said Black and Arab men are both “Fetishizing ugly colonizer women” and another that described wiping her dirty hands on the American flag in lieu of a napkin.

https://www.cnn.com/2026/06/01/politics/kfile-ny-13-darializa-avila-chevalier-deleted-tweets-defund-abolish-police-prisons-deportations

Mamdani-backed congressional candidate deleted posts calling to seize private property, abolish police, borders, prisons

, a democratic socialist congressional candidate endorsed by New York City Mayor Zohran Mamdani, deleted a previous Twitter account that included thousands of posts and reposts expressing support for abolishing police, prisons and borders, as well as seizing private property and nationalizing major industries and calling into question Israel’s right to exist.

Avila Chevalier, a 32-year-old investigator at a public defender’s office in New York City and doctoral student, has emerged as one of the most prominent left-wing challengers in the country after Mamdani endorsed her bid to unseat longtime Democratic Rep. Adriano Espaillat in New York’s 13th Congressional District.

But the posts from her since-deleted account from over the last decade have drawn scrutiny amid her high-profile challenge of Espaillat, a five-term incumbent and chair of the Congressional Hispanic Caucus. That primary, scheduled for June 23, has become a closely watched proxy battle between the Democratic Party’s establishment and its ascendant democratic-socialist wing, with Mamdani’s endorsement last week elevating the race’s national profile.

Darializa Avila Chevalier - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Of course you see anything left of the Heritage Foundation as radical left so of course you prefer the GOP and project 2025. That’s why you people pretend to dislike Trump but the wring your hands and clutch pearls over every little scary strawman and exaggeration fed to you by the algorithm and/or FOX news.

For you people the FTC and CFPB deserved to die because those are right there with the Great Leap Forward on the scale of leftist atrocities. Of course the left scares you when you think it is all Mao

 

[laughing dog]

Do you have a link for the US maternal deaths of 4 per 1000? That does seem awful high. Though I have read that the US rate is increasing.
The WHO has the US at 21.1/100,000

The US infant mortality rate was than 5.07 deaths per 1,000 (US Infant Mortality Rates 1950-2025)