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How should west respond to Russian invasion of Ukraine?

 
 
 
barbos said:
Yes, the corrupt clown Company denied termination of flamingo. Does not mean it was not utter failure militarily.

Speaking of its engine

Ukrainian company Fire Point had obtained a large number of Ivchenko AI-25, purchased from various stockpiles and found in landfills and dumps, for powering the FP-5 Flamingo cruise missile. Many had a remaining flight time of some 10 hours. As the engines will not be used for multiple flights by jet aircraft, Fire Point restores them just enough for a Flamingo missile's flight time of three and a half hours. Media reports had said that the engines were made by Motor Sich, but Fire Point said that they had found "thousands of such engines" at various landfills in Ukraine.
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And that's supposed to be a problem?

Putting stuff that won't last on something on a one-way mission is entirely sensible.

The way your propaganda keeps spinning good as bad shows they don't actually have real things to talk about.
 
barbos said:
Loren Pechtel said:
Russia has made it clear they intend genocide. Thus you have put them in a position where the only choices are fight or die.
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Azov are free to leave Ukraine. But yeah I think nazis should be genocided.
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You have demonstrated genocidal intent towards the population at large.

Military age males are killed. Children are taken.
 
bilby said:
It's not being ignored by the media. It's just that "Russian military attacks defenceless civilians" isn't unusual enough to make the front page headlines.
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Exactly. News does not report the ordinary. The absence of something in the news can mean it's simply routine. Be especially alert to news reported after the fact--you see a lot of that with attacks on Israel. The news reports an Israeli reaction to an incident that wasn't originally reported--this means the incident is common, the reaction uncommon.
 
bilby said:
Loren Pechtel said:
And that's why the military has elephant walks.
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For ballistic missiles?

The Russian nuclear deterrent depends entirely on ICBMs and submarine launched nukes. The ICBMs sit in silos, hidden, doing nothing to attract attention. They don't need to be in working order, as long as you slip the inspector a crate of vodka.

The submarines do at least need to work, but the missiles they are carrying are (pun intended) in the same boat.

The rest of the Russian nuclear arsenal is carried by aircraft, which might be able to get to Eastern Europe before being shot down, but won't get any further than that.

And none of this - including USAF "elephant walks" requires or demonstrates working warheads. The various test-ban treaties provide carte blanche to a corrupt military to allow warheads to deteriorate and spend the funds allocated to maintaining them on vodka and hookers.

Nuclear weapons are complex, and expensive to maintain, and if they don't work when the order arrives to use them, there's a good chance that nobody will be around to ask why not.
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Yeah, doesn't work too well with missiles.

There actually is a scenario in which you could elephant walk them to some degree--mobile missiles. All come out of hiding at the same time. But mobile missiles don't work too well, building a missile that can drive down the highway without damage is problematic.

But my point was about the general case--showing off that the equipment is at least somewhat functional.
 
Loren Pechtel said:
But mobile missiles don't work too well, building a missile that can drive down the highway without damage is problematic.
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The old USSR paraded missiles through Red Square every year on May Day, showing off their military preparedness, and the surface was still good enough for Mathias Rust to land a light aircraft on it, showing off their abject lack of military preparedness...
 
aupmanyav said:
Loren Pechtel said:
Doesn't really matter who forms the government, the same reality exists that Iran wants to genocide Israel.
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Not just Iran, but all Muslims.
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I know personally plenty of Muslims who have zero desire to see genocide against Israel. I am sure many exist who do want to genocide Israel, but I have yet to meet one, and have good reason, both from personal interactions and from media reports, to think that even "most" would likely be false, and that "all" is absurd.

Most Muslims couldn't give a hoot either way about Israel. Just as most Catholics don't much care about birth control. The leaders of their religion care, and those leaders want their congregations to care. But wanting doesn't make it so, and lots of Muslims outside the Middle East (and plenty even within the Middle East) really have no particular reason to think about Israel at all.
 
bilby said:
barbos said:
In other news western media does not like talking is the fact that Russian Navy keeps sinking ships in Black Sea.
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Navy?
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Yes, operating on sea - navy
bilby said:
barbos said:
there has been a dozen or so ships sunk recently.
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Indeed. Cargo ships. Sunk by drones, launched and controlled from land. Maybe by the Navy - I presume they have to do something with their time, now that they have no ships to sail about in.

It's not being ignored by the media. It's just that "Russian military attacks defenceless civilians" isn't unusual enough to make the front page headlines.
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It IS being ignored.
 
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bilby said:
For ballistic missiles?

The Russian nuclear deterrent depends entirely on ICBMs and submarine launched nukes. The ICBMs sit in silos, hidden, doing nothing to attract attention. They don't need to be in working order, as long as you slip the inspector a crate of vodka.

The submarines do at least need to work, but the missiles they are carrying are (pun intended) in the same boat.
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Bullshit as usual. Russian nuclear deterrent is in perfect order and they regularly conduct test launches.
Russian ICBMs are not exclusively in silos and submarines. We have mobile ICBMs. There are also long range Burevestnik, nuclear powered cruise missile, and nuclear powered torpedo. Perfect for assholes in Australia.
 
And a war between Polish President and Prime Minister. Predictably Donald Tusk blamed it on ..... Russia.
I doubt Navrotski appreciates being called Kremlin agent.
 
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A record 54,400 Russian troops killed or severely wounded in the month of October as Russia for a second month loses territory in Ukraine. In most areas, Ukraine is on the offensive now. Details at ISW.
What a waste of a nation. But it is Russia. All they know is suffering and lies. And alcohol to make it all go away for a bit.
 
RFE/RL has an article about life in rural Russia now. Folks having to line up for food, all family members. No longer can one come for supplies for the entire family, young and old alike, no matter the weather have to stand in line for hours and then hope they don't run out before you get your turn. Hunting is almost nonexistent. Fish have all been killed by pollution. Older residents say it wasn't even this bad during Soviet days.
Food Lines, War Dead: The Way They Live Now In A Frigid Siberian Town
 
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