Chronicles in Socialist Success Stories - Venezuela, the fun in building socialism continues!

[maxparrish]

Socialist economies, even under the best of circumstances, usually turns out to be an ordinary disaster. Combine it with corruption and a proletariat bus driver for leadership and you have the world's largest insane asylum.

The WSJ has a nice photo slide show on the latest (behind a paywall so try google search, which seems to bypass direct link paywall).

http://www.wsj.com/articles/venezue...gger-long-lines-hunger-and-looting-1440545403

See the fun: shoppers waiting in long lines, then having their fingerprints scanned while buying government rationed corn flour at the "Latino Supermarket" (so as to prevent them from getting more than one ration); other shoppers in long lines (with nearly empty carts) in the barren-shelved state-run Bicentenario supermarket, which sells government subsidized food.

Marval as others scavenge for things to loot from a National Guard headquarters that was burned by anti-government demonstrators hours before on Aug. 14; gape at the armed soldiers standing guard over bags of food confiscated from people who illegally sought to buy contraband food goods for higher prices...

In the meantime:

Being the ex-President's daughter pays off: Hugo Chavez's ambassador daughter is Venezuela's richest woman
Diario las Americas claims that Maria Gabriela Chavez, 35, has $4.2billion in assets held in American and Andorran banks
Hugo Chavez famously declared 'being rich is bad' and during his lifetime railed against the wealthy for being lazy and gluttonous
Efforts to determine Chavez's wealth have been made before, without much luck
By PETE D'AMATO FOR DAILY MAIL ONLINE

The daughter of Hugo Chavez, the former president who once declared 'being rich is bad,' may be the wealthiest woman in Venezuela, according to evidence reportedly in the hands of Venezuelan media outlets.Maria Gabriela Chavez, 35, the late president's second-oldest daughter, holds assets in American and Andorran banks totaling almost $4.2billion, Diario las Americas reports.

The figure would make Gabriela Chavez wealthier than media mogul Gustavo Cisneros, whom Forbes named the wealthiest Venezuelan earlier this year with $3.6 billion in assets.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ela-s-richest-woman-according-new-report.html

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Is she single?

For $4.6 billion, I'll ignore the whole "she's evil" thing.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Ok, so the argument that maxparrish is making is that Venezuela isn't Socialist country, but a country that was victimized by totalitarian government that seized the nation's assets for themselves.

 

[arkirk]

Ok, so the argument that maxparrish is making is that Venezuela isn't Socialist country, but a country that was victimized by totalitarian government that seized the nation's assets for themselves.

That is the way maxparrish regards everything...it's gotta be bad. I have no way of knowing if these figures are indeed correct. More importantly, the U.S. undercover operations in every socialist country in the world tends to make socialist leaders hide assets in case they are needed to PUT DOWN CIA ENGINEERED AND SPONSORED COUPS.

 

[dismal]

Ok, so the argument that maxparrish is making is that Venezuela isn't Socialist country, but a country that was victimized by totalitarian government that seized the nation's assets for themselves.

Perhaps he's saying it turned out more like an actual socialist country than the unicorn socialism the naive assume will come to pass.

 

[arkirk]

Ok, so the argument that maxparrish is making is that Venezuela isn't Socialist country, but a country that was victimized by totalitarian government that seized the nation's assets for themselves.

Perhaps he's saying it turned out more like an actual socialist country than the unicorn socialism the naive assume will come to pass.

The one thing of which I am certain is that you offer no hope in a world of fossil fuel bullies. You reject the proposition that man can govern himself and choose instead the casino marketplace. I have never been able to understand people like you. Your handle pretty much represents my psychological reaction to your posts. You portray the world as such a dismal place where all people with a communitarian attitude are idiots. That doesn't in any way qualify you as a genius.

 

[untermensche]

Socialist economies, even under the best of circumstances, usually turns out to be an ordinary disaster.

I think you are talking about capitalist economies.

One crash after another.

 

[maxparrish]

Ok, so the argument that maxparrish is making is that Venezuela isn't Socialist country, but a country that was victimized by totalitarian government that seized the nation's assets for themselves.

Perhaps he's saying it turned out more like an actual socialist country than the unicorn socialism the naive assume will come to pass.

"Unicorn Socialism" - very funny.

 

[Axulus]

Socialist economies, even under the best of circumstances, usually turns out to be an ordinary disaster.

I think you are talking about capitalist economies.

One crash after another.

Unicorn socialism, exhibit A: "REAL socialism never suffers from economic recessions."

 

[untermensche]

I think you are talking about capitalist economies.

One crash after another.

Unicorn socialism, exhibit A: "REAL socialism never suffers from economic recessions."

Isn't that the entire point you keep making over and over?

Socialism, however you define it, is no good because as the world has been in a long period of stagnation thanks to capitalism Venezuela is also struggling.

 

[dismal]

Unicorn socialism, exhibit A: "REAL socialism never suffers from economic recessions."

Isn't that the entire point you keep making over and over?

Socialism, however you define it, is no good because as the world has been in a long period of stagnation thanks to capitalism Venezuela is also struggling.

I would have said the problem highlighted in this thread is the problem of placing large amounts of authority over property and people in the hands of a ruling elite has a tendency to produce a corrupt and ruthless ruling elite.

Whereas in unicorn socialism it is assumed the ruling elite will actually be gracious and thoughtful leaders -- as opposed to just locking up the people who say they aren't.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I think you are talking about capitalist economies.

One crash after another.

Unicorn socialism, exhibit A: "REAL socialism never suffers from economic recessions."

Why wouldn't it. Socialism isn't exactly a perfect system. The best is a capitalistic system with socialistic safeguards. Kind of like what exists in most of the Western World.

 

[dismal]

Unicorn socialism, exhibit A: "REAL socialism never suffers from economic recessions."

Why wouldn't it. Socialism isn't exactly a perfect system. The best is a capitalistic system with socialistic safeguards. Kind of like what exists in most of the Western World.

I think socialists believe recessions are caused by the "excesses of capitalism".

If this is the case no capitalism = no excesses of capitalism = no recessions.

 

[untermensche]

Isn't that the entire point you keep making over and over?

Socialism, however you define it, is no good because as the world has been in a long period of stagnation thanks to capitalism Venezuela is also struggling.

I would have said the problem highlighted in this thread is the problem of placing large amounts of authority over property and people in the hands of a ruling elite has a tendency to produce a corrupt and ruthless ruling elite.

Sounds exactly like capitalism.

Whereas in unicorn socialism it is assumed the ruling elite will actually be gracious and thoughtful leaders -- as opposed to just locking up the people who say they aren't.

The US has the most people in jail.

 

[dismal]

I would have said the problem highlighted in this thread is the problem of placing large amounts of authority over property and people in the hands of a ruling elite has a tendency to produce a corrupt and ruthless ruling elite.

Sounds exactly like capitalism.

Except the people in charge of all the property are also in charge of the army, the jails and secret police.

McDonalds does not use force me to require me to buy it's hamburger. It must offer me something I enjoy at a price I'm willing to pay.

 

[untermensche]

Sounds exactly like capitalism.

Except the people in charge of all the property are also in charge of the army, the jails and secret police.

Sounds exactly like US capitalism.

McDonalds does not use force me to require me to buy it's hamburger. It must offer me something I enjoy at a price I'm willing to pay.

Not every Socialist is the current Venezuelan government. They are making it up as they go. They are not following some Socialist playbook.

But some US corporations, like oil and defense corporations, do have a lot of control over the government, and in things like foreign policy almost total control.

 

[dismal]

Except the people in charge of all the property are also in charge of the army, the jails and secret police.

Sounds exactly like US capitalism.

You are under the impression that US companies have armies, tanks, jails and secret police?

 

[untermensche]

Sounds exactly like US capitalism.

You are under the impression that US companies have armies, tanks, jails and secret police?

They do.

They used those things in Iraq for example.

And the US government acted as their agent.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Sounds exactly like US capitalism.

You are under the impression that US companies have armies, tanks, jails and secret police?

Have you not been paying attention?

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

Isn't that the entire point you keep making over and over?

Socialism, however you define it, is no good because as the world has been in a long period of stagnation thanks to capitalism Venezuela is also struggling.

I would have said the problem highlighted in this thread is the problem of placing large amounts of authority over property and people in the hands of a ruling elite has a tendency to produce a corrupt and ruthless ruling elite.

Whereas in unicorn socialism it is assumed the ruling elite will actually be gracious and thoughtful leaders -- as opposed to just locking up the people who say they aren't.

Why is it whenever I hear people go on about "socialism" and how bad it is, it is always in the context of a corrupt dictator? Why can't socialism and democracy co-exist?