Are you a moral person?

[untermensche]

Dictators in the workplace are not needed. You cannot prove they are needed.

The Spanish proved they are not and that is why all the dictators attacked them.

Including the capitalist dictators.

A dictator only rules a whole country. We might lovingly call the boss of our company a dictator, but he isn't one. Since he's not above the law.

A dictatorship is a power structure.

There can be governmental dictatorships.

And there can be dictators in a business.

It all depends on the power structure.

Being able to escape a power structure does not make it less than a dictatorial power structure. To be within it means submitting totally to the whims of the dictators. You submit or leave.

Some call that freedom.

 

[fromderinside]

We have the Spanish Anarchists and a great modern writer who came upon them.

You mean the guy who blew off his head in Idaho? Now that is a great writer who had a mythical handle on reality.

Orwell is considered one of the great minds of the 20th Century.

Maybe if the rest of the world was as nice as what he saw with the Anarchists he would not have killed himself.

Well there you go. When one speaks of anarchy not Orwell, but, Hemingway comes to my mind. Shame it doesn't come to yours.  Democratic Socialism is an Orwell thing not like anarchy or any hyphenated anarchy that comes to mind.

To wit:

Anarcho-syndicalism (also referred to as revolutionary syndicalism)^[1] is a theory of anarchism that views revolutionary industrial unionism or syndicalism as a method for workers in capitalist society to gain control of an economy and with that control influence in broader society. Syndicalists consider their economic theories a strategy for facilitating worker self-activity and as an alternative co-operative economic system with democratic values and production centered on meeting human needs. *

*  Anarcho-syndicalism

Please note that leftist republican (Orwell's preferred approach) are counterpoint to anarchists.

You have wrapped yourself around an axel so tight it's taken away all your intellectual oxygen.

Got any more straws?

 

[untermensche]

Well there you go. When one speaks of anarchy not Orwell, but, Hemingway comes to my mind.

Anarchy?

This is what Orwell has to say about it.

re; Mairin Mitchell's book Storm over Spain:

"Her book is valuable for a number of reasons, but especially because, unlike almost all English writers on Spain, she gives a fair deal to Spanish Anarchist. The Anarchists and Syndicalists have been persistently misrepresented in England, and the average English person still retains his eightneen-ninetyish notion that Anarchism is the same thing as anarchy....

Please note that leftist republican (Orwell's preferred approach) are counterpoint to anarchists.

This is almost a sentence in English. What it means is beyond me.

You have wrapped yourself around an axel so tight it's taken away all your intellectual oxygen.

I have opposed dictatorship in principle and in practice. That is: liberating the mind.

This is hand waving nonsense.

An insane defense of dictatorship.

 

[fromderinside]

You seem to be confusing political realities with movement actions and positions. So the revolution wound up with a dictatorship. So what? That result has no bearing on either principles or players who lost out. Orwell was an admirer of Spain's republicans left which finally became a conviction in democratic socialism by the late thirties. That's a fact. Read the wiki articles in my post, on both, if you are confused by a sentence.

First paragraph of Wiki article on Orwell includes

George Orwell, was an English novelist, essayist, journalist and critic whose work is marked by lucid prose, awareness of social injustice, opposition to totalitarianism and outspoken support of democratic socialism. *

I bet you'd vote Manaport not guilty because he's a Trump player rather than he's been proven an obviously very unethical and criminal person.

You operate the same way with your heros as well. I care for them so little that I leave it to you to explain to the populi who I mean.

* ^{_{Not a headline, but, definitely above the fold.}}

 

[untermensche]

Orwell can't be pigeon-holed to fit some Wikipedia explanation.

This is what Orwell actually wrote.

"As far as my purely personal preferences went I would have liked to join the Anarchists." George Orwell - Homage to Catalonia page 116

 

[fromderinside]

...and if you read the wiki article you'll find he explored the entire scene between his arrival in Spain, form which your quote arises, and the dictatorship of Franco. You'll also note a pretty thorough treatment in the wiki article on Orwell. They do seem to present a unified total vision of his growth and preferences which leads me to believe there are reasons for putting his political beliefs re Spain in the first paragraph of the Orwell article.

You are wasting your nickel on a bad reading.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Orwell can't be pigeon-holed to fit some Wikipedia explanation.

This is what Orwell actually wrote.

"As far as my purely personal preferences went I would have liked to join the Anarchists." George Orwell - Homage to Catalonia page 116

Ehe... yeah... who cares about context? Why not lift everything out of context? That'll increase clarity.

 

[untermensche]

Orwell can't be pigeon-holed to fit some Wikipedia explanation.

This is what Orwell actually wrote.

"As far as my purely personal preferences went I would have liked to join the Anarchists." George Orwell - Homage to Catalonia page 116

Ehe... yeah... who cares about context? Why not lift everything out of context? That'll increase clarity.

The context was what was called the Spanish Civil war.

This is something Orwell said about himself.

As opposed to something others say about him.

 

[untermensche]

...and if you read the wiki article you'll find he explored the entire scene between his arrival in Spain, form which your quote arises, and the dictatorship of Franco. You'll also note a pretty thorough treatment in the wiki article on Orwell. They do seem to present a unified total vision of his growth and preferences which leads me to believe there are reasons for putting his political beliefs re Spain in the first paragraph of the Orwell article.

You are wasting your nickel on a bad reading.

You are trying to tell me that I should take what others say about Orwell over what he said about himself.

Go try to sell that shit somewhere else.

 

[untermensche]

Seeing this constant defense of dictatorship is getting nauseating to me.

I truly despise the defenders of dictatorship. They, not the dictators make it possible.

The worms that fully submit to the apish dictators make it possible.

I can respect those who submit because of necessity but don't like it.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Seeing this constant defense of dictatorship is getting nauseating to me.

I truly despise the defenders of dictatorship. They, not the dictators make it possible.

The worms that fully submit to the apish dictators make it possible.

I can respect those who submit because of necessity but don't like it.

ha ha ha HA HA HA HA

Nobody here is defending dictatorships. Nobody. It's all in your head

 

[untermensche]

Seeing this constant defense of dictatorship is getting nauseating to me.

I truly despise the defenders of dictatorship. They, not the dictators make it possible.

The worms that fully submit to the apish dictators make it possible.

I can respect those who submit because of necessity but don't like it.

ha ha ha HA HA HA HA

Nobody here is defending dictatorships. Nobody. It's all in your head

A dictatorial power structure is a dictatorship. An organization of humans where all real power is in the hands of one individual or a small group is a dictatorship.

The average corporation is as rigid a dictatorship as has ever existed. A deliberate dictatorship. Designed so those at the top can steal from all below.

The blindness of indoctrination is not an argument.

Or an excuse for an adult.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Seeing this constant defense of dictatorship is getting nauseating to me.

I truly despise the defenders of dictatorship. They, not the dictators make it possible.

The worms that fully submit to the apish dictators make it possible.

I can respect those who submit because of necessity but don't like it.

ha ha ha HA HA HA HA

Nobody here is defending dictatorships. Nobody. It's all in your head

A dictatorial power structure is a dictatorship. An organization of humans where all real power is in the hands of one individual or a small group is a dictatorship.

The average corporation is as rigid a dictatorship as has ever existed. A deliberate dictatorship. Designed so those at the top can steal from all below.

The blindness of indoctrination is not an argument.

Or an excuse for an adult.

I know how you've conflated being an authority with being a dictator. I think it's bullshit, and hyperbole. Not playing that game. Quit the straw man

 

[untermensche]

A dictatorial power structure is a dictatorship. An organization of humans where all real power is in the hands of one individual or a small group is a dictatorship.

The average corporation is as rigid a dictatorship as has ever existed. A deliberate dictatorship. Designed so those at the top can steal from all below.

The blindness of indoctrination is not an argument.

Or an excuse for an adult.

I know how you've conflated being an authority with being a dictator. I think it's bullshit, and hyperbole. Not playing that game. Quit the straw man

I am describing a real power situation in the real world accurately.

Most companies are designed to be rigid dictatorships. If you are in one you follow orders from above or you try to leave somehow. There is no other option in dictatorships.

I refuse to live in your fantasy world where we are blind to power dynamics all around us.

Especially when we see the incredible damage having this kind of power in the hands of humans does.

The next step in human progress, if we survive capitalism, is to eliminate unneeded dictatorships in the workplace.

 

[DrZoidberg]

A dictatorial power structure is a dictatorship. An organization of humans where all real power is in the hands of one individual or a small group is a dictatorship.

The average corporation is as rigid a dictatorship as has ever existed. A deliberate dictatorship. Designed so those at the top can steal from all below.

The blindness of indoctrination is not an argument.

Or an excuse for an adult.

I know how you've conflated being an authority with being a dictator. I think it's bullshit, and hyperbole. Not playing that game. Quit the straw man

I am describing a real power situation in the real world accurately.

Most companies are designed to be rigid dictatorships. If you are in one you follow orders from above or you try to leave somehow. There is no other option in dictatorships.

I refuse to live in your fantasy world where we are blind to power dynamics all around us.

Especially when we see the incredible damage having this kind of power in the hands of humans does.

The next step in human progress, if we survive capitalism, is to eliminate unneeded dictatorships in the workplace.

I refuse to play your loaded-word-game. It's disengenous. Just because I refuse to use your out of proportion words doesn't mean I'm blind to how power structures influence our society.

 

[fromderinside]

If you actually read the article you will find he went with Republican left. So your self self-serving snippet is just dust in the wind.

 

[untermensche]

I am describing a real power situation in the real world accurately.

Most companies are designed to be rigid dictatorships. If you are in one you follow orders from above or you try to leave somehow. There is no other option in dictatorships.

I refuse to live in your fantasy world where we are blind to power dynamics all around us.

Especially when we see the incredible damage having this kind of power in the hands of humans does.

The next step in human progress, if we survive capitalism, is to eliminate unneeded dictatorships in the workplace.

I refuse to play your loaded-word-game. It's disengenous. Just because I refuse to use your out of proportion words doesn't mean I'm blind to how power structures influence our society.

This is nothing but childish whining.

A dictatorship is a power structure.

And they are all over the place.

Denial of the reality around you is not an argument.

- - - Updated - - -

If you actually read the article you will find he went with Republican left. So your self self-serving snippet is just dust in the wind.

He was with them but his heart was with the Anarchists.

You have not defended dictatorship with any of this..

 

[fromderinside]

You got it all wrong. I'm just bashing the idea of social anarchist state. If you get off the money train and concentrate on humans working together to improve things you might come up with democratic socialism instead of dictator or strong dominate weak thinking as the only option to every man is an island.

 

[untermensche]

There is no idea of an Anarchist state.

There are Anarchist principles and how they would be expressed would be different depending on who expressed them.

We see capitalist principles in action.

Principles like dictatorships in human relationships are acceptable.

We see how this is usually expressed in places like Haiti and Guatemala and Indonesia and Mexico.

Luckily for people in the US and Europe union activity has modified capitalism to the point where many live decently.

But in the US the power of unions are dead which means progress for workers is dead.

You cannot make progress for all if you allow dictators to decide where to go and who will get what.

They will only allow progress for themselves.

And we see how much progress the sick dictators of business have made over the last few decades.

And we see what they did to the economy.

Destroyed the lives of millions a couple of times while escaping on their golden parachutes.

 

[fromderinside]

Fortunately there is still mobility available to you here. Head for Denmark. When you are required to have a card to travel begin to worry.