How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[Harry Bosch]

Of course Russia is in Ukraine for no reason.. they just have too many people and need Ukrainians to kill some. To save on buying bullets and missles.. my mom said when I fought with my sisters and brother it takes two to tango.. and she would punish BOTH of us.

Do you think Ukraine is not being punished enough? Over 4 million refugees, hundreds of thousands dead or injured, their cities being bombed to rubble, their territory being taken from them, their economy destroyed for many years.

Meanwhile in Russia, the price of sugar is up.

Just curious, when you were a child and you gouged your sister's eye out, punched her face and broke her jaw bone, kicked her knee cap and crippled her for life.... how did your mother punish her for being such a trouble maker?

Ukraine JOINING NATO WILL destroy trade for Russia.. Millions of starving Russians Trillions of dollars in trade… The only way for Russia to survive is to stop Ukraine ability to stop trade

I hate to ruin your morning but let me tell you this: Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

 

[Hermit]

Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

Putin will survive the setback, reform the military, and have another bite at the cherry in two or four years. He will definitely succeed with the annexation of all of Ukraine if part of the withdrawal agreement is Ukraine's demilitarisation, and probably even if the US/NATO provides Ukraine with a couple of billion dollars worth of armaments and training.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

Putin will survive the setback, reform the military, and have another bite at the cherry in two or four years. He will definitely succeed with the annexation of all of Ukraine if part of the withdrawal agreement is Ukraine's demilitarisation, and probably even if the US/NATO provides Ukraine with a couple of billion dollars worth of armaments and training.

Well, of course there's no way that Ukraine will demilitarize. Putin has done the exact opposite of what he wanted: he's incredibly fortified and unified NATO, destroyed any goodwill or trust that eastern Europeans had for Russia. To be fair, Ukraine was pretty divided towards going west or east prior to the Russian invasion. That's gone today. Ukraine is fully united to preserve their country and stop Putin. If anything, I think that Ukraine will be in a better position in a few years if Putin tries again.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

Of course Russia is in Ukraine for no reason.. they just have too many people and need Ukrainians to kill some. To save on buying bullets and missles.. my mom said when I fought with my sisters and brother it takes two to tango.. and she would punish BOTH of us.

Do you think Ukraine is not being punished enough? Over 4 million refugees, hundreds of thousands dead or injured, their cities being bombed to rubble, their territory being taken from them, their economy destroyed for many years.

Meanwhile in Russia, the price of sugar is up.

Just curious, when you were a child and you gouged your sister's eye out, punched her face and broke her jaw bone, kicked her knee cap and crippled her for life.... how did your mother punish her for being such a trouble maker?

Ukraine JOINING NATO WILL destroy trade for Russia.. Millions of starving Russians Trillions of dollars in trade… The only way for Russia to survive is to stop Ukraine ability to stop trade

I hate to ruin your morning but let me tell you this: Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

This was no attempt to destroy Ukraine. That you’ll not benefit Russia. It was a control device to make the world know any attempt by any country to block access to the Black Sea would result in a war the Ukraine would not survive even with NATO support if they could get it. This is Russia using Ukraine like a political football… just a safety not a field goal or touchdown.. Russia has to much to gain by keeping the Ukraine as an asset.

 

[Hermit]

Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

Putin will survive the setback, reform the military, and have another bite at the cherry in two or four years. He will definitely succeed with the annexation of all of Ukraine if part of the withdrawal agreement is Ukraine's demilitarisation, and probably even if the US/NATO provides Ukraine with a couple of billion dollars worth of armaments and training.

Well, of course there's no way that Ukraine will demilitarize. Putin has done the exact opposite of what he wanted: he's incredibly fortified and unified NATO, destroyed any goodwill or trust that eastern Europeans had for Russia. To be fair, Ukraine was pretty divided towards going west or east prior to the Russian invasion. That's gone today. Ukraine is fully united to preserve their country and stop Putin. If anything, I think that Ukraine will be in a better position in a few years if Putin tries again.

Of course I could be wrong. We'll see.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Of course Russia is in Ukraine for no reason.. they just have too many people and need Ukrainians to kill some. To save on buying bullets and missles.. my mom said when I fought with my sisters and brother it takes two to tango.. and she would punish BOTH of us.

Do you think Ukraine is not being punished enough? Over 4 million refugees, hundreds of thousands dead or injured, their cities being bombed to rubble, their territory being taken from them, their economy destroyed for many years.

Meanwhile in Russia, the price of sugar is up.

Just curious, when you were a child and you gouged your sister's eye out, punched her face and broke her jaw bone, kicked her knee cap and crippled her for life.... how did your mother punish her for being such a trouble maker?

Ukraine JOINING NATO WILL destroy trade for Russia.. Millions of starving Russians Trillions of dollars in trade… The only way for Russia to survive is to stop Ukraine ability to stop trade

I hate to ruin your morning but let me tell you this: Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

This was no attempt to destroy Ukraine. That you’ll not benefit Russia. It was a control device to make the world know any attempt by any country to block access to the Black Sea would result in a war the Ukraine would not survive even with NATO support if they could get it. This is Russia using Ukraine like a political football… just a safety not a field goal or touchdown.. Russia has to much to gain by keeping the Ukraine as an asset.

You're not paying attention. It doesn't matter what Putin's goals were. I really don't care. Putin is losing. He's pulling back. And his main goals (destabilize the west, hurt Ukraine, empower pro-Russia Ukrainians, scare non-NATO Eastern European countries) has dramatically failed.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

Putin will survive the setback, reform the military, and have another bite at the cherry in two or four years. He will definitely succeed with the annexation of all of Ukraine if part of the withdrawal agreement is Ukraine's demilitarisation, and probably even if the US/NATO provides Ukraine with a couple of billion dollars worth of armaments and training.

Well, of course there's no way that Ukraine will demilitarize. Putin has done the exact opposite of what he wanted: he's incredibly fortified and unified NATO, destroyed any goodwill or trust that eastern Europeans had for Russia. To be fair, Ukraine was pretty divided towards going west or east prior to the Russian invasion. That's gone today. Ukraine is fully united to preserve their country and stop Putin. If anything, I think that Ukraine will be in a better position in a few years if Putin tries again.

Of course I could be wrong. We'll see.

Yea, I'll double down, no chance in a million years now that Ukraine will disarm.! Again, I've been mocking Putin for his perceived intelligence for a long time. How smart is this: Putin's strategy to convince border states to disarm and be friendly to Ukraine is to invade them and break and mock all treaties that they had with them! It's human nature, people don't want their buildings bombed and its civilians shot. People don't want to be bullied.

 

[SLD]

Do you think joining NATO did not threaten Russia .. considering any trade has to go through Ukraine.. TRILLIONS of dollars in trade millions of staring Russians.. Russia has no choice…

Ukraine is not a member of NATO and had recently rejected joining. But why do you suppose the Baltic's, Poland, Romania, etc joined NATO? Could it be that Russia's imperialistic behaviors?

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.

So what? They’re a sovereign nation. If they want to petition NATO for membership, Russia does not have the right to stop them. Whether we should admit them is another question. While I understand Russia’s concerns, they wouldn’t need to worry if they didn’t act like they are now. Russia needs to adopt a less aggressive foreign policy and have serious democratic reforms. Then they can be true partners in the international community instead of a rogue nation bent on domination and control of its neighbors. They could even join the EU and perhaps NATO one day.

But they’ll need to learn how to fight a lot better first.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

Do you think joining NATO did not threaten Russia .. considering any trade has to go through Ukraine.. TRILLIONS of dollars in trade millions of staring Russians.. Russia has no choice…

Ukraine is not a member of NATO and had recently rejected joining. But why do you suppose the Baltic's, Poland, Romania, etc joined NATO? Could it be that Russia's imperialistic behaviors?

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.

So what? They’re a sovereign nation. If they want to petition NATO for membership, Russia does not have the right to stop them. Whether we should admit them is another question. While I understand Russia’s concerns, they wouldn’t need to worry if they didn’t act like they are now. Russia needs to adopt a less aggressive foreign policy and have serious democratic reforms. Then they can be true partners in the international community instead of a rogue nation bent on domination and control of its neighbors. They could even join the EU and perhaps NATO one day.

But they’ll need to learn how to fight a lot better first.

Learn how to fight? Great idea let’s fire all the nukes we posses and see who wins the fight.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

Putin will survive the setback, reform the military, and have another bite at the cherry in two or four years. He will definitely succeed with the annexation of all of Ukraine if part of the withdrawal agreement is Ukraine's demilitarisation, and probably even if the US/NATO provides Ukraine with a couple of billion dollars worth of armaments and training.

Except Russia has been strangled economically and those high end sanctions including Swift provide Ukraine substantial bargaining power regarding terms for peace such Putin out of Ukraine and paying for Crimea and the damage.

Ukraine is currently in a WWI standstill and it is up to Putin just how much more damage he wants to expose Russia and its military to.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

Putin will survive the setback, reform the military, and have another bite at the cherry in two or four years. He will definitely succeed with the annexation of all of Ukraine if part of the withdrawal agreement is Ukraine's demilitarisation, and probably even if the US/NATO provides Ukraine with a couple of billion dollars worth of armaments and training.

Except Russia has been strangled economically and those high end sanctions including Swift provide Ukraine substantial bargaining power regarding terms for peace such Putin out of Ukraine and paying for Crimea and the damage.

Ukraine is currently in a WWI standstill and it is up to Putin just how much more damage he wants to expose Russia and its military to.

The damage is not to Russia it is to our entire existence once the nukes start flying like that bugs bunny cartoon where they keep bringing out bigger and bigger weapons…
Russia is saying to Ukraine do not attempt to control our economy or we are prepared to blow you to smithereenies

 

[SLD]

Do you think joining NATO did not threaten Russia .. considering any trade has to go through Ukraine.. TRILLIONS of dollars in trade millions of staring Russians.. Russia has no choice…

Ukraine is not a member of NATO and had recently rejected joining. But why do you suppose the Baltic's, Poland, Romania, etc joined NATO? Could it be that Russia's imperialistic behaviors?

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.

So what? They’re a sovereign nation. If they want to petition NATO for membership, Russia does not have the right to stop them. Whether we should admit them is another question. While I understand Russia’s concerns, they wouldn’t need to worry if they didn’t act like they are now. Russia needs to adopt a less aggressive foreign policy and have serious democratic reforms. Then they can be true partners in the international community instead of a rogue nation bent on domination and control of its neighbors. They could even join the EU and perhaps NATO one day.

But they’ll need to learn how to fight a lot better first.

Learn how to fight? Great idea let’s fire all the nukes we posses and see who wins the fight.

They’re coordination and even simple tactics are beyond their capabilities. They have no logistical support. They don’t understand proper military planning. Frankly, they’re mostly cowards who run away at the first sign of resistance. That though is a consequence of poor military leadership at NCO and JO levels. They don’t develop such people. It’s actually the basis of Putin’s rule, simply lead by fear and intimidation. That’s why so many dictators fall. It just doesn’t work. In a conventional fight with virtually any other power, they’d get their asses kicked. Just as Ukraine is now doing to them.

There’s a separate thread for their nuclear capabilities, and one in Science about the survivability of nuclear war. But it certainly isn’t our plan to fire all our nuclear weapons. Most are not even mounted on delivery platforms.

The truth is that we just don’t need to use nukes to defeat them. They’re defeating themselves without us having to fire a shot. Military units are already revolting. In the coming weeks, it will only get worse for them. Ukraine, with our help and logistical support will drive them out. And when defeat can no longer be covered up, and sanctions really start to bite, Putin will fall like the dog he is.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

Putin will survive the setback, reform the military, and have another bite at the cherry in two or four years. He will definitely succeed with the annexation of all of Ukraine if part of the withdrawal agreement is Ukraine's demilitarisation, and probably even if the US/NATO provides Ukraine with a couple of billion dollars worth of armaments and training.

Except Russia has been strangled economically and those high end sanctions including Swift provide Ukraine substantial bargaining power regarding terms for peace such Putin out of Ukraine and paying for Crimea and the damage.

Ukraine is currently in a WWI standstill and it is up to Putin just how much more damage he wants to expose Russia and its military to.

The damage is not to Russia it is to our entire existence once the nukes start flying like that bugs bunny cartoon where they keep bringing out bigger and bigger weapons…
Russia is saying to Ukraine do not attempt to control our economy or we are prepared to blow you to smithereenies

How in the world does Ukraine control Russia's economy? Currently the west is attempting to bankrupt Russia in order to encourage Russia to stop invading. It's much cheaper for the west to stop Russia now in Ukraine and force them to retreat, than having Russian imperialism spread throughout eastern Europe.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

Do you think joining NATO did not threaten Russia .. considering any trade has to go through Ukraine.. TRILLIONS of dollars in trade millions of staring Russians.. Russia has no choice…

Ukraine is not a member of NATO and had recently rejected joining. But why do you suppose the Baltic's, Poland, Romania, etc joined NATO? Could it be that Russia's imperialistic behaviors?

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.

So what? They’re a sovereign nation. If they want to petition NATO for membership, Russia does not have the right to stop them. Whether we should admit them is another question. While I understand Russia’s concerns, they wouldn’t need to worry if they didn’t act like they are now. Russia needs to adopt a less aggressive foreign policy and have serious democratic reforms. Then they can be true partners in the international community instead of a rogue nation bent on domination and control of its neighbors. They could even join the EU and perhaps NATO one day.

But they’ll need to learn how to fight a lot better first.

Learn how to fight? Great idea let’s fire all the nukes we posses and see who wins the fight.

They’re coordination and even simple tactics are beyond their capabilities. They have no logistical support. They don’t understand proper military planning. Frankly, they’re mostly cowards who run away at the first sign of resistance. That though is a consequence of poor military leadership at NCO and JO levels. They don’t develop such people. It’s actually the basis of Putin’s rule, simply lead by fear and intimidation. That’s why so many dictators fall. It just doesn’t work. In a conventional fight with virtually any other power, they’d get their asses kicked. Just as Ukraine is now doing to them.

There’s a separate thread for their nuclear capabilities, and one in Science about the survivability of nuclear war. But it certainly isn’t our plan to fire all our nuclear weapons. Most are not even mounted on delivery platforms.

The truth is that we just don’t need to use nukes to defeat them. They’re defeating themselves without us having to fire a shot. Military units are already revolting. In the coming weeks, it will only get worse for them. Ukraine, with our help and logistical support will drive them out. And when defeat can no longer be covered up, and sanctions really start to bite, Putin will fall like the dog he is.

And what you said is exactly why someone will push that button and use the only weapon they have that will “win” the war for them.. a preemptive strike but at what ? There are too many missles from too many directions to stop the destruction of our ecosystem.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

Russia's attempt destroy Ukraine will fail. Putin is pulling back. Most experts predict full retreat to Eastern Ukraine (Dontesk) in the next two weeks or so.

Putin will survive the setback, reform the military, and have another bite at the cherry in two or four years. He will definitely succeed with the annexation of all of Ukraine if part of the withdrawal agreement is Ukraine's demilitarisation, and probably even if the US/NATO provides Ukraine with a couple of billion dollars worth of armaments and training.

Except Russia has been strangled economically and those high end sanctions including Swift provide Ukraine substantial bargaining power regarding terms for peace such Putin out of Ukraine and paying for Crimea and the damage.

Ukraine is currently in a WWI standstill and it is up to Putin just how much more damage he wants to expose Russia and its military to.

The damage is not to Russia it is to our entire existence once the nukes start flying like that bugs bunny cartoon where they keep bringing out bigger and bigger weapons…
Russia is saying to Ukraine do not attempt to control our economy or we are prepared to blow you to smithereenies

How in the world does Ukraine control Russia's economy? Currently the west is attempting to bankrupt Russia in order to encourage Russia to stop invading. It's much cheaper for the west to stop Russia now in Ukraine and force them to retreat, than having Russian imperialism spread throughout eastern Europe.

Ukraine is losing support and there is no way they can stand against the Russian force that wiped out the nazis…

 

[Hermit]

they’ll need to learn how to fight a lot better first.

According to Putin the special military operation is really a conflict between Russia and NATO about World dominance. What's the situation now?

Russia has lost 15000 troops, 6 generals, 500 tanks, 3 ships, 100 planes and 1000 trucks. NATO hasn't arrived yet.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Yea, I'll double down, no chance in a million years now that Ukraine will disarm.! Again, I've been mocking Putin for his perceived intelligence for a long time. How smart is this: Putin's strategy to convince border states to disarm and be friendly to Ukraine is to invade them and break and mock all treaties that they had with them! It's human nature, people don't want their buildings bombed and its civilians shot. People don't want to be bullied.

Putin obviously intended to terrorize and spread fear, to tell bordering countries that they'd better submit or risk destruction. It's a powerful motivator if one is on the fence and he's made a pretty good example of Ukraine in that respect considering all the damage, refugees, death, etc.

I do believe the smartest thing for Ukraine to do is join NATO, build up its military, and continue to tell the Pig and his cronies to go fuck themselves in the ass. To agree to demilitarization is pure folly because the Pig and his boot lickers will be back if they think it's easy pickings. That's the only reason they made war in Ukraine in the first place, because they believed they could get away with it.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

Domination by some mini military force over the Russian nuclear arsenal. Do not wake up the sleeping Russian bear. Poking him with a stick is annoying him.. for now… but that bear can wipe away that annoying ant with a single swipe of its paw.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

Yea, I'll double down, no chance in a million years now that Ukraine will disarm.! Again, I've been mocking Putin for his perceived intelligence for a long time. How smart is this: Putin's strategy to convince border states to disarm and be friendly to Ukraine is to invade them and break and mock all treaties that they had with them! It's human nature, people don't want their buildings bombed and its civilians shot. People don't want to be bullied.

Putin obviously intended to terrorize and spread fear, to tell bordering countries that they'd better submit or risk destruction. It's a powerful motivator if one is on the fence and he's made a pretty good example of Ukraine in that respect considering all the damage, refugees, death, etc.

I do believe the smartest thing for Ukraine to do is join NATO, build up its military, and continue to tell the Pig and his cronies to go fuck themselves in the ass. To agree to demilitarization is pure folly because the Pig and his boot lickers will be back if they think it's easy pickings. That's the only reason they made war in Ukraine in the first place, because they believed they could get away with it.

Ukraine joining NATO only forces Russia to stomp on this bothersome gnat. And risk a nuclear holocaust ? Not over some gnat.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Domination by some mini military force over the Russian nuclear arsenal. Do not wake up the sleeping Russian bear. Poking him with a stick is annoying him.. for now… but that bear can wipe away that annoying ant with a single swipe of its paw.

<deleted> lots of people don't shit their pants and run away crying every time someone bullies them.