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Trump and Hitler - a comparison

Enough with comparing the two. Where does it get us? And c'mon, there's a fairness issue that rears up and overwhelms the discussion. After all, one man:
> inspired a rebellion against the government out in the streets that led to several deaths (not, of course, his own, though his followers never called him a coward)
> was considered a harmless loon by the ruling class until he gained power, after which his movement of racial supremacy was shown in its true colors
> through unprecedented use of mass media, inflamed his countrymen's hatred against a marginalized, defenseless group
> preached a doctrine of pure, national blood
> caused countless deaths through his madness

The other was Reich Chancellor of Nazi Germany for a dozen years.
 
Enough with comparing the two. Where does it get us? And c'mon, there's a fairness issue that rears up and overwhelms the discussion. After all, one man:
> inspired a rebellion against the government out in the streets that led to several deaths (not, of course, his own, though his followers never called him a coward)
> was considered a harmless loon by the ruling class until he gained power, after which his movement of racial supremacy was shown in its true colors
> through unprecedented use of mass media, inflamed his countrymen's hatred against a marginalized, defenseless group
> preached a doctrine of pure, national blood
> caused countless deaths through his madness

The other was Reich Chancellor of Nazi Germany for a dozen years.
Cute.

IAE, I’ve continued my reading of the establishment of the Nazi regime. It’s truly frightening how quickly he was able to establish his position and to turn to suppression. Certainly, I don’t expect history to simplistically repeat itself, but I do believe that given the chance he would love to establish a similar regime. He would love to suppress all dissent and have everyone be required to effectively worship him as Hitler required adulation.

An interesting point about Nazi suppression of dissent is that the Gestapo were overwhelmed with numerous allegations of “malicious gossip,” everything from jokes about the regime to claims that the Nazis were suppressing the people’s freedom. But the reports were insane. People complained to the gestapo about their boss who didn’t promote them, businessmen complained about competitors, students about teachers who didn’t give them a high enough grade. The Gestapo investigated all of these. Most were quickly dismissed but many did result in imprisonment, especially for lower classes.

It was the unpredictability of denunciations that impacted social life. You could never trust anyone. The Gestapo could be anywhere but in reality in the 30’s was not that large. The regime actively destroyed social life in Germany in just a few years. Everyone had to be on guard about what you said or whom you offended. Quoted one in his diary, “Everyone fears the next person maybe an informer.”

Hitler also held elections and plebiscites. They were shams of course. You could only vote yes or no and the ballot was not secret. 99% of Austrians supported the Anschluss. To not vote or vote no was a sure fire way to get a visit from the Gestapo. Block wardens ensured that people displayed the proper enthusiasm for the regime.

The question is whether the American people will allow this to happen to them. People give lip service to freedom, what they want is order. Trump promises order, but calls it freedom. I strongly believe that we must openly dissent as much as possible. What I fear is some real or contrived emergency that Trump uses to establish his version of autocracy. I mean how dare you criticize Trump in this time of crisis? We must unite. Bullshit of course. Only through continued dissent, protest and resistance can we ensure he cannot establish an effectively autocratic government. He cannot put 50 million people in jail. But Hitler didn’t have to either. He just had to make examples of people to shut the rest up. Regardless of the consequences, we must dissent.

Not sure how I will exactly do so, but I will find a way, especially as an attorney in a deep red state.
 

Trump transition team compiling list of current and former U.S. military officers for possible courts-martial


Yup, time to weed out disloyal components from the military. People made Cheato look bad by pointing out the idiotic things he did to try to fuck up Joe Biden, should he try to do what Trump could not: Get us out of Afghanistan.
A 2022 independent review by the Special Inspector General for Afghanistan Reconstruction blamed both the Trump and Biden administrations for the chaotic U.S. withdrawal in 2021.
Whoever that inspector general is/was, he best be booking some flights.
Cheato don't take no steenkin blame for the stupid shit he does.
His Suckertary of Me-fense is another sexual predator - this regime is chock full of them. So this Pete Headset guy is Kompromatted by Trump who is Kompromatted by Putin...

We should just put Putin in the fucking Whitehouse, and eliminate teh stoopid apricot standing between him and running the country. We would probably be better off.
Putin is no genius, but he's easily twice as smart as the apricot, and probably more inclined toward the welfare of the American people.
 
Continuing my reading of Nazi Germany and how Hitler managed to capture the state and people, one thing that cannot be underestimated is the use of religion. Indeed Hitler as savior of Germany is a common motif. One “believed” in Hitler. He was the redeemer and savior of Germany. The Third Reich was the eternal kingdom. He used the churches particularly evangelical ones and evangelical pastors supported him. It was the liberals like Bonhoeffer and Neimoller who he had to imprison and even kill. Indeed he wanted to establish a national church that was evangelical in orientation.

Trump too is seen in such apotheosis terms. Trump is going to save America. Make it great again. If there is one thing that explains his enduring popularity it is evangelicals. Others used them. He actually delivered to them. They support him so much more than other candidates it’s utterly mind boggling. Trump as an Angel of his is a common meme. He has come to cleanse America in preparation for the coming of Jesus Christ which of course is right around the corner - as it has been for the last 1990 years. They forgive every sin he has committed against the church. It’s insane. Here are two propaganda pictures that are unsurprisingly similar.

IMG_8488.jpeg


IMG_8489.jpeg
 
One interesting difference between the two - and that might change - is Hitler’s ability to use extra judicial means to silence his opponents. Pastor Neimoller was initially a supporter of Hitler. Hitler promised him that there would be no pogrom against the Jews and he took him at his word.

Later disagreements led to Neimoller’s arrest and prosecution through traditional courts. But the evidence so flimsy that he was convicted of only one minor count and sentenced to time served and released.

The SS were waiting for him at the prison gates and took him immediately away to a concentration camp where he remained for the duration of the third Reich.

There is no SS in the US - yet. But Trump does have a variety of militias he could call upon to do his dirty work. He could say things like SLD is a pain in my side. I wish someone would take care of him. That would happen. He could use the power of pardon. Or he could just use them to form his own SS.
 
People give lip service to freedom, what they want is order.
That just shows that in order to have freedom, one must have order first.

And in many places in the US, order is breaking down. I said it before - I think the original wave of #BLM riots 2014-2016 contributed to Trump getting elected. Without the Pandemic, he surely would have been elected given the sorry display 2020 Democratic debates have offered, especially on the issue of mass migration. But also things like Kamala and Fauxachontas calling Michael Brown shooting "murder" even though, as lawyers, they knew better than that.
Elizabeth Warren and Kamala Harris’s controversial Michael Brown tweets, explained

And then you have DAs downgrading robberies to petty thefts, releasing repeat shoplifters without bail etc. A Michael Jackson impersonator attacked four people, including an older woman whose orbital socket he broke. And yet, he was allowed to roam the subway and threaten passengers.
 
Continuing my reading of Nazi Germany and how Hitler managed to capture the state and people, one thing that cannot be underestimated is the use of religion.
Like for example Islam.
maxresdefault.jpg

This is a photo of an actual Islamic division of the Waffen-SS.
 
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Continuing my reading of Nazi Germany and how Hitler managed to capture the state and people, one thing that cannot be underestimated is the use of religion.
Like for example Islam.
maxresdefault.jpg

This is a photo of an actual Islamic division of the Waffen-SS.
Yes. Recruited from Bosnia. But Hitler’s use of religion to effectuate his takeover of Germany and convincing ordinary Germans to support him required using evangelical Christianity to garner support.
 
That just shows that in order to have freedom, one must have order first.
That sentiment is absolutely terrifying, and could be a quote from pretty much any authoritarian dictator of the twentieth century.

Order is the antithesis of freedom.
 
Ralph Waldo Emerson posits that foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.
 
Hitler and Trump are both demagogues whose political movements each closely fit many of the attributes of fascism. One can list many similarities between the two men and their followings.

But there are also huge differences between the two men. These differences are so blatant that I think many low-information citizens will find the equation connecting Hitler and Trump to be absurd. I'm afraid that persisting in making the comparison may just reinforce the right-wing opinion that progressive thinkers have "gone off the rails."

Rather than emphasizing the similarities, it may be instructive to list some of the differences between the two men. Let me start with a few:

  • Most demagogues rise to power due to their oratorical skills, but the two men's styles seem vastly different. I don't think Hitler danced or rambled (did the "weave") incoherently as Trump does.
  • While both men suffer severely from the Dunning-Kruger effect, Hitler had a high IQ and was truly skillful at strategic thinking. Trump is a semi-literate buffoon with no intellectual talents beyond those of a grifter and con man. Hitler wrote a long detailed manifesto while Trump's book was ghost-written.
  • Hitler was a pro-Germany jingoistic and had great animosity against some groups, especially Jews. Trump isn't patriotic or particularly bigoted against specific groups: As a malignant narcissist he despises everyone except himself.
  • Hitler was eager for war and conquest that he thought would further Germany's interests. Trump will pursue war only for political or personal purpose, or to win favors from fellow fascist leaders.
  • Before attaining power Hitler had only limited support from Germany's upper class and businesses. Trump's agenda features pro-business policies like tax cuts and deregulation so rich elites were eager to support him. (This may not be a real difference: In each case rich elites tended to support political winners.)
  • Other differences?

Once in power, Hitler did and Trump will manipulate their countries and confound their opponents in various ways:
  • Trump has openly bragged that he will file frivolous lawsuits against reporters and other "enemies." The high cost and duration of litigation in the U.S. makes this retribution intolerable for the "enemy" even when eventual acquittal is assured. Prosecutors, judges and businesses will be intimidated into acquiescing to this and related mischief. (I suppose Hitler also redirected the bureaucracy and justice system to frustrate innocent people like this.)
  • Hitler encouraged violence by his supporters. (Though didn't he eventually outlaw the "brown shirts"?) MAGA supporters like the neo-Nazis and Proud Boys will be encouraged to commit just enough violence to frighten "enemies" into submission.
 
That just shows that in order to have freedom, one must have order first.
That sentiment is absolutely terrifying, and could be a quote from pretty much any authoritarian dictator of the twentieth century.

Order is the antithesis of freedom.
You are not completely wrong with your second sentence. Indeed, in a well-functioning society, order and freedom are indeed in tension.
However, in order to have freedom, you need a level of order. Otherwise you have anarchy, chaos and "might makes right". What freedom do you really have if people can just take your stuff or assault you with no consequences because there is no law and order?

Your first sentence, however, is exactly my point. Authoritarians make use of a malfunctioning society and promise to make it function again. That's why it behooves free societies not to neglect order because the interests of criminals are held above those of ordinary citizens.

If a kid for example steals cars many fucking times and neither he nor his parents suffer any consequences, many people are harmed by having their car stolen. Moreover, with every car thief or subway assaulter who is ignored by the powers that be, people lose faith in them and they lose faith in the system.

12-year-old serial car thief caught again with stolen Tesla in College Park: police
Officers found the male was a 12-year-old boy – who did not own the e-scooter he was riding, or the black Tesla he had the key fob to. The Tesla was from a dealership in Montgomery County.
The 12-year-old was taken back to his parents and was not charged with a crime since he's under 13 years old.
[...]
Montgomery County Police say the 12-year-old targeted more than half a dozen luxury car dealerships and other businesses over multiple days, starting August 16. Each time he's been caught, by law, he's been released to his parents, only to wander off and strike again.
"They really need to start locking these kids up for doing things like that because it’s just hurting the business. I’m glad Juan Carlos got his truck back though; that’s a good thing," said Jones.

With shit like this allowed to happen, is it any wonder people lose faith in the system?
 
What freedom do you really have if people can just take your stuff or assault you with no consequences because there is no law and order?
More than you have if people can just take your stuff or assault you with no consequences because they write the laws and give the orders.
 
Your first sentence, however, is exactly my point. Authoritarians make use of a malfunctioning society and promise to make it function again. That's why it behooves free societies not to neglect order because the interests of criminals are held above those of ordinary citizens.
What you are missing is that it it's perception of function, not actual function. It's not actual disorder that made people vote for The Felon.


If a kid for example steals cars many fucking times and neither he nor his parents suffer any consequences, many people are harmed by having their car stolen. Moreover, with every car thief or subway assaulter who is ignored by the powers that be, people lose faith in them and they lose faith in the system.

12-year-old serial car thief caught again with stolen Tesla in College Park: police
Officers found the male was a 12-year-old boy – who did not own the e-scooter he was riding, or the black Tesla he had the key fob to. The Tesla was from a dealership in Montgomery County.
The 12-year-old was taken back to his parents and was not charged with a crime since he's under 13 years old.
[...]
Montgomery County Police say the 12-year-old targeted more than half a dozen luxury car dealerships and other businesses over multiple days, starting August 16. Each time he's been caught, by law, he's been released to his parents, only to wander off and strike again.
"They really need to start locking these kids up for doing things like that because it’s just hurting the business. I’m glad Juan Carlos got his truck back though; that’s a good thing," said Jones.

With shit like this allowed to happen, is it any wonder people lose faith in the system?
What's new about this? I was the victim of a bunch of bullies back in school. The school didn't have the power to do anything and they knew that the police would just promptly release them to their parents. That was nearly 50 years ago.
 
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