Atheists: Questions 2, 3 and 4.

[dockeen]

Let me rephrase the questions into a less ambiguous form.
Do atheists know the future?

Answer: No. Anyone who claims to know the future is a liar.

How can devote self to the future that, do not believe in, as the real human life?

How can you have conviction to live without knowing the future?

Answer: Because we are here, roll the bones.

Has Saeed even made the transition to the new boards yet?

Doesn't he need to wait a month so he can get behind?

You thinking of Ed?

 

[Eldarion Lathria]

Re: Future Existence

I know that one day I will stop existing. I don't dwell on the matter, there are so many things more important, including the fact that right now, both DJ and Huckleberry want to be scratched.

I know the universe will go on existing. I won't give a damn after I'm dead. The chance of the universe ceasing to exist are low to negative.

I know that Mahoggianism is nonsense. What is 'devotion to the future?'

I have to go and scratch DJ's back and Huckleberry's ears. Then I have to prepare remarks for the debate over the National Railways budget.

Eldarion Lathria

 

[Keith&Co.]

What is 'devotion to the future?'

Saeed's thesis is that if we were really atheists, we would not expect there to be a tomorrow. The only option to theism is nihilism, he says.

The act of living life as if tomorrow will come is, in his eyes, accepting the truth that Allah has guaranteed there will be a tomorrow.

He challenges all atheists to show how any being other than the god of all supreme usefulness can ever guarantee that tomorrow will come. And investing in anything, or planning for tomorrow, or buying next week's TV guide can ONLY be interpreted as us being theists living in denial of Allah.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

He challenges all atheists to show how any being other than the god of all supreme usefulness can ever guarantee that tomorrow will come. And investing in anything, or planning for tomorrow, or buying next week's TV guide can ONLY be interpreted as us being theists living in denial of Allah.

Well, if we're buying a TV guide then we're in denial over a whole lot more than Allah. Like the fact that the 20th Century actually finished a while ago.

 

[Atheos]

What is the reasonably satisfactory basis for belief in the future existence of self and of the universe?

Saeed, seriously, how many times do we have to explain this? Are you ever going to listen to the responses are do you intend to continue asking these questions as if somehow the process of asking them repeatedly will browbeat everyone here into submission? News flash: It's not going to happen.

My belief in the future existence of myself and the universe is based on exactly the same type of rational thinking that leads me to accept the axiom "What goes up must come down." Yes, it's inductive reasoning. It is based on repeatable outcomes that suggest the same outcome will continue to be experienced. The sun will appear to rise in the east tomorrow just like it did this morning, yesterday morning, and every day before that for as far back as written records exist chronicling sunrises.

It's the same reason I know that when my doorbell rings my dogs will bark.

It's the same reason I know what will happen if I try to hold my breath for 30 minutes. It's the same reason I know what the next bite of a peanut butter sandwich is going to taste like. The same reason I know winter won't last forever, this cold is going to go away, I'll have to take a piss sometime between now and when I go to bed tonight and people will keep believing in ancient and ridiculous superstitions. The experiences of the past condition us to expect that the future will be the same.

If a killer asteroid hits the Earth sometime in the next 5 minutes none of what I just said will happen or matter. But the odds of a disaster major enough to globally change life as we know it are remote. The odds that I'll be dead tonight are higher but still quite remote. The odds that you'll ignore all the rational thoughts and explanations put forth by those of us that have participated in this thread so far are so good I'd be willing to bet all the money I can get my hands on right now on it. This is precisely because of inductive reasoning. You've been doing it for years and nobody here really expects you to give up on it now. Which is the point.

 

[pegasus8]

Gee Saeed. What did people do before Abrahamic monotheism was invented by iron age goat herders?

The question my good Saeed is more to the point. Hence I hope that we can all share in the glory of logic and reasoning.
Can one live his or her life without a God or even better without the God of Abraham? And even if you and millions of others
will say no still millions say yes. We have been living good decent lives without a God or any God for 100's of 1000's years.
Hence the need and devotion,as many have shared with you in this thread and on the old board, to logic.

So to take a cue from one of the world's first hippies, William Blake, I along with millions of other "Atheist" shall continue to
worship the one and only true God in the universe, Urizen. Without logic and reasoning Man could never be the King of the Jungle
and its Noble Beast.




Peace Saeed

Pegasus

 

[saeedalyousuf]

Tom Sawyer: "existed yesterday"

Yes.

Q4:
If the answer to the Q2 is “YES” then:
What is the reasonably satisfactory basis for belief in the future existence of self and of the universe?

Tom Sawyer
Basic logical reasoning. Both the universe and myself existed yesterday and we exist today and there's no particular reason to believe either will change before tommorrow.

S:

Many people, who did exist yesterday, they are dead today. Therefore, yesterday cannot be the evidence for today.


Saeed

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Yes.

Q4:
If the answer to the Q2 is “YES” then:
What is the reasonably satisfactory basis for belief in the future existence of self and of the universe?

Tom Sawyer
Basic logical reasoning. Both the universe and myself existed yesterday and we exist today and there's no particular reason to believe either will change before tommorrow.

S:

Many people, who did exist yesterday, they are dead today. Therefore, yesterday cannot be the evidence for today.


Saeed

They may be dead, but they are still here.

 

[Keith&Co.]

Many people, who did exist yesterday, they are dead today. Therefore, yesterday cannot be the evidence for today.

So they were wrong.
Tom, however, is still here. So he's correct.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Many people, who did exist yesterday, they are dead today. Therefore, yesterday cannot be the evidence for today.

Ya, but there's a reason that they now no longer exist. One day, a similar reason will apply to all of us.

 

[saeedalyousuf]

As it is you who is making a claim on behalf of the world view of Islam, where is the relationship between the claims of Islam, the existence of its God, etc, to be found the actual world? Can you point to something in the Universe, the World, and show that this supports the claims of Islam, the very same claims that you happen to support...

Challenge of the Qur’an:

S:

Surah Al-Israa Ruku 10 Surah 17

88 Say: Verily, though mankind and the Jinn should assemble to produce the like of this Qur'an, they could not produce the like thereof though they were helpers one of another.

M. Pickthall Quran Translation

If Mohammed were alive today, would you trust him ?

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20130608033430AAebzSw

http://www.freeratio.org/showthread.php?t=328325

Saeed

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Challenge of the Qur’an:

Dude, we already had that challenge and Harry Potter beat the Koran hands down.

Allah is a puny god who couldn't stand up to a basic Bat-Bogey hex.

 

[saeedalyousuf]

The Evidence for the Future Existence Please?

Many people, who did exist yesterday, they are dead today. Therefore, yesterday cannot be the evidence for today.

Ya, but there's a reason that they now no longer exist. One day, a similar reason will apply to all of us.

S:
You did fail to address my conclusion:

"Therefore, yesterday cannot be the evidence for today."

Since neither the material existence nor the human beings can be the evidence then, who or what is the evidence for the future existence of human life and of the universe?

Saeed

 

[Keith&Co.]

You did fail to address my conclusion:

"Therefore, yesterday cannot be the evidence for today."

He addressed it.
He said 'Ya, but...' Meaning your conclusion is not the compelling triumph of logic that you think it is.

Since neither the material existence nor the human beings can be the evidence then, who or what is the evidence for the future existence of human life and of the universe?

And yet again, Saeed, you've never shown us any reason that we NEED evidence for the future existence of human life and of the universe.
it just seems really likely to us, not guaranteed, and you've shown no good reason to reject the reasons we think it's likely.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Since neither the material existence nor the human beings can be the evidence then, who or what is the evidence for the future existence of human life and of the universe?

From that perspective, nothing. What's your point?

 

[saeedalyousuf]

Tom Sawyer: "Harry Potter"

Challenge of the Qur’an:

Dude, we already had that challenge and Harry Potter beat the Koran hands down.

Allah is a puny god who couldn't stand up to a basic Bat-Bogey hex.

S:
Just hollow claims do not count. You need to demonstrate that "Harry Potter" is written in response to the Qur'anic challenge and present the detailed comparison and documented evidence for its superiority.

Saeed

 

[Keith&Co.]

Just hollow claims do not count.

That would mean we can dismiss just about every claim you have ever made on this or the previous forum.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Just hollow claims do not count. You need to demonstrate that "Harry Potter" is written in response to the Qur'anic challenge and present the detailed comparison and documented evidence for its superiority.

I already documented evidence for its superiority. You're having the conversation with the same people and you can't base your argument on hoping that we've forgotten what we talked about last time. It wasn't all that long ago.

Also, why would anyone bother to write something in response to a Koranic challenge? That's like saying "Sure, you cured cancer, but you did it in order to cure cancer and not in direct response to Frank Smith from Fresno's challenge that cancer couldn't be cured, so it doesn't count". The Koran is a shitty piece of inferior literature which doesn't teach moral lessons or deliver quality story-telling at level one can find when reading about teenaged wizards. Few people write anything in response to tripe like that.

 

[saeedalyousuf]

A BLATANT DECEPTION

Since neither the material existence nor the human beings can be the evidence then, who or what is the evidence for the future existence of human life and of the universe?

From that perspective, nothing. What's your point?

S:

While the atheists claim the lack of evidence for disbelieve in the creator of the universe; they do believe in the future existence of self and of the universe without evidence. This does prove the atheist self contradiction.. Since there is no alternative to belief in the creator of the universe for belief in future existence; the atheist claim of disbelief in the creator of the universe is nothing but A BLATANT DECEPTION.

Saeed

 

[Tom Sawyer]

While the atheists claim the lack of evidence for disbelieve in the creator of the universe; they do believe in the future existence of self and of the universe without evidence. This does prove the atheist self contradiction.. Since there is no alternative to belief in the creator of the universe for belief in future existence; the atheist claim of disbelief in the creator of the universe is nothing but A BLATANT DECEPTION.

We do have evidence. That doesn't mean that we don't recognize that there will be exceptions to that evidence. I assume that I will be alive tomorrow because I have kept being alive every day in the past and my being alive tomorrow is based on the same criteria that my managing to stay alive between yesterday and today was. One day I will be wrong and no longer be alive. Whatever the fuck the rest of that shit you said was about has no relation to anything which even remotely resembles logic.