Can Roe v Wade be overturned?

[Half-Life]

That's not logic at all. It's YET ANOTHER straw man, which is a logical fallacy. Nobody is suggesting that a fetus is not life. Just that it's not a person. A clump of live human fetal cells without a brain is just a clump of cells. It's alive; but it's not sentient or aware, and there's no biological reason to treat it differently from a mole.

But we do treat it differently if the fetus is murdered by someone else while in the womb. It is granted the constitutional right to live.

 

[bilby]

Given the existence of the crime of rape, that is not something you can claim with certainty.

Given the woeful state of sex education, that too is not something you can claim with certainty.

It rarely is. But why not? Even if someone was too irresponsible to think about the consequences of their actions; Even if they consented to sex, and were fully aware of the consequences; Why should that mean that they lose their bodily autonomy? If someone says to a friend "If you ever need a kidney, you can have one of mine", that doesn't in any way prevent them from choosing to renege on that deal once their friend has renal failure. You can't force them to go through with it - it's their kidney, and they can choose to refuse to let someone else use it for any reason or none.

That would be crazy. But as it's a pure strawman, and not something anyone has ever said or thought, it's of no value as an argument.

Nobody ever gets an abortion in order to punish the fetus. You would have to be crazy to imagine that they did.

A mole is a living thing, and is made of human cells. But I wouldn't think twice about killing it, for purely cosmetic reasons. If you go to a dermatologist and ask him to remove an unsightly mole, he won't bat an eyelid. But if you say you are doing this to punish the mole, he will probably refer you to a psychiatrist. A fetus is no more able to be punished than is a mole. It has the same level of awareness, and the same rights - ie none at all.


I notice that everyone in favour of ANYTHING is alive. By the same logic, we can show that breathing causes cancer - everyone who ever got cancer was breathing at the time.

A mole doesn't have the potential to grow into a human being. You are being disingenuous. A fetus is perfectly capable of feeling pain, kicking in the womb, etc. etc.

The potential to become something isn't the thing itself.

The logical conclusion of your argument makes you a mass murderer - every spermatozoon you have ever produced had the potential to grow into a human being. And you murdered them all, by refusing to provide the right conditions for that to occur.

And a fetus, before about twenty weeks (and the VAST majority of abortions take place before that point) has no more ability to feel pain than a mole - less, in fact, as the mole is attached directly to a developed nervous system.

This is the new logic of the left: We find a clump of cells on Mars. We found life!
We found a clump of cells in a woman. That's not life, guys! Ignore it!

That's not logic at all. It's YET ANOTHER straw man, which is a logical fallacy. Nobody is suggesting that a fetus is not life. Just that it's not a person. A clump of live human fetal cells without a brain is just a clump of cells. It's alive; but it's not sentient or aware, and there's no biological reason to treat it differently from a mole.

Take a look at this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rh8rfHX-F54

It's basically the arguments of the left but by a little child. Look at all the comments about how mad people are about this. The right is getting fed up these days.

I don't watch online videos. I don't care for arguments made by little children. And I absolutely don't give a flying fuck about the opinions expressed in YouTube comments, which are a cesspool of juvenile nonsense. Almost everyone in YouTube comments threads seems to be both enraged and mentally disturbed. I have no interest in invitations to join that trend.

Do you have any kind of actual argument to present, that doesn't consist of 'Watch this video which makes people mad'?

 

[Half-Life]

A mole doesn't have the potential to grow into a human being. You are being disingenuous. A fetus is perfectly capable of feeling pain, kicking in the womb, etc. etc.

The potential to become something isn't the thing itself.

The logical conclusion of your argument makes you a mass murderer - every spermatozoon you have ever produced had the potential to grow into a human being. And you murdered them all, by refusing to provide the right conditions for that to occur.

And a fetus, before about twenty weeks (and the VAST majority of abortions take place before that point) has no more ability to feel pain than a mole - less, in fact, as the mole is attached directly to a developed nervous system.

This is the new logic of the left: We find a clump of cells on Mars. We found life!
We found a clump of cells in a woman. That's not life, guys! Ignore it!

That's not logic at all. It's YET ANOTHER straw man, which is a logical fallacy. Nobody is suggesting that a fetus is not life. Just that it's not a person. A clump of live human fetal cells without a brain is just a clump of cells. It's alive; but it's not sentient or aware, and there's no biological reason to treat it differently from a mole.

Take a look at this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rh8rfHX-F54

It's basically the arguments of the left but by a little child. Look at all the comments about how mad people are about this. The right is getting fed up these days.

I don't watch online videos. I don't care for arguments made by little children. And I absolutely don't give a flying fuck about the opinions expressed in YouTube comments, which are a cesspool of juvenile nonsense. Almost everyone in YouTube comments threads seems to be both enraged and mentally disturbed. I have no interest in invitations to join that trend.

Do you have any kind of actual argument to present, that doesn't consist of 'Watch this video which makes people mad'?

It would give you an indication to see just how serious people take this. I didn't say you had to join the comments. I said just read them and skim them.

 

[bilby]

The potential to become something isn't the thing itself.

The logical conclusion of your argument makes you a mass murderer - every spermatozoon you have ever produced had the potential to grow into a human being. And you murdered them all, by refusing to provide the right conditions for that to occur.

And a fetus, before about twenty weeks (and the VAST majority of abortions take place before that point) has no more ability to feel pain than a mole - less, in fact, as the mole is attached directly to a developed nervous system.

This is the new logic of the left: We find a clump of cells on Mars. We found life!
We found a clump of cells in a woman. That's not life, guys! Ignore it!

That's not logic at all. It's YET ANOTHER straw man, which is a logical fallacy. Nobody is suggesting that a fetus is not life. Just that it's not a person. A clump of live human fetal cells without a brain is just a clump of cells. It's alive; but it's not sentient or aware, and there's no biological reason to treat it differently from a mole.

Take a look at this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rh8rfHX-F54

It's basically the arguments of the left but by a little child. Look at all the comments about how mad people are about this. The right is getting fed up these days.

I don't watch online videos. I don't care for arguments made by little children. And I absolutely don't give a flying fuck about the opinions expressed in YouTube comments, which are a cesspool of juvenile nonsense. Almost everyone in YouTube comments threads seems to be both enraged and mentally disturbed. I have no interest in invitations to join that trend.

Do you have any kind of actual argument to present, that doesn't consist of 'Watch this video which makes people mad'?

It would give you an indication to see just how serious people take this. I didn't say you had to join the comments. I said just read them and skim them.

I am already very much aware of how seriously people take this.

It remains true that the depth of someone's conviction tells you nothing about whether they are right or wrong.

And it remains true that it's morally wrong to interfere with a woman's choices about how she uses her reproductive organs.

Particularly if you do so under the delusion that a fetus with no brain should have more rights to her reproductive organs than she herself does. That position is not just wrong, it's evil and wrong.

It's an understandable mistake for people who are used to bullying others into conformity to make; But that doesn't make it less of a mistake, and nor does it make it less evil.

 

[Half-Life]

I am already very much aware of how seriously people take this.

It remains true that the depth of someone's conviction tells you nothing about whether they are right or wrong.

And it remains true that it's morally wrong to interfere with a woman's choices about how she uses her reproductive organs.

Particularly if you do so under the delusion that a fetus with no brain should have more rights to her reproductive organs than she herself does. That position is not just wrong, it's evil and wrong.

It's an understandable mistake for people who are used to bullying others into conformity to make; But that doesn't make it less of a mistake, and nor does it make it less evil.

That is why putting the child in foster care is the better option. This was discussed in the video. The argument is that there will be too many kids in foster care. But, it was full of comments of people saying "I was in foster care. I'd rather be alive than dead." Would you be willing to go to foster care and tell the children, "You should've all been aborted instead?"

 

[bilby]

I am already very much aware of how seriously people take this.

It remains true that the depth of someone's conviction tells you nothing about whether they are right or wrong.

And it remains true that it's morally wrong to interfere with a woman's choices about how she uses her reproductive organs.

Particularly if you do so under the delusion that a fetus with no brain should have more rights to her reproductive organs than she herself does. That position is not just wrong, it's evil and wrong.

It's an understandable mistake for people who are used to bullying others into conformity to make; But that doesn't make it less of a mistake, and nor does it make it less evil.

That is why putting the child in foster care is the better option.

How, exactly, does putting a child into foster care avoid the evil of forcing a woman to host a fetus she doesn't want to carry? Your response appears to be completely unrelated to the post you are quoting.

This was discussed in the video.

I couldn't care less what was in a video I haven't watched and have no intention of watching.

The argument is that there will be too many kids in foster care. But, it was full of comments of people saying "I was in foster care. I'd rather be alive than dead." Would you be willing to go to foster care and tell the children, "You should've all been aborted instead?"

Are you hard of thinking or something?

I am not interested in foster children, or for that matter in children at all. The discussion is about fetuses and the women who (if you moronic bullies got your way) would be forced against their will to give up their bodily autonomy.

The opinions of entities without functioning brains are of no weight in this discussion; The possibility that a future person might one day be happy to be alive is not relevant in the slightest, unless you plan to try and rescue every last sperm cell, lest you be accused of mass murder.

And the potential to become something is STILL not the same as the thing.

If you had never been born, you wouldn't have any opinions on any issues. So what your opinions are about things that might have led to your not being born are is utterly meaningless.

If your father had decided to wear a condom, your brother would not be here. He wouldn't be dead; He just wouldn't BE. Same as if he had been aborted. Your brother's opinion is irrelevant. And I am not talking about any brothers you actually have; I am talking here about the brother you would have had if your dad hadn't decided to have a sly wank one day instead of fucking your mum. If you want his opinions, or those of the foster kids, to carry any weight in the abortion debate, you had better start by telling your father that he is a murderer. Literally every time he ejaculated outside your mother, he killed one of your brothers or sisters - at least, according to your bizarrely twisted train of thought.

Seriously, you need to start learning how to think - or start leaving the thinking to those who are at least barely competent at it.

 

[Half-Life]

How, exactly, does putting a child into foster care avoid the evil of forcing a woman to host a fetus she doesn't want to carry? Your response appears to be completely unrelated to the post you are quoting.

This was discussed in the video.

I couldn't care less what was in a video I haven't watched and have no intention of watching.

The argument is that there will be too many kids in foster care. But, it was full of comments of people saying "I was in foster care. I'd rather be alive than dead." Would you be willing to go to foster care and tell the children, "You should've all been aborted instead?"

Are you hard of thinking or something?

I am not interested in foster children, or for that matter in children at all. The discussion is about fetuses and the women who (if you moronic bullies got your way) would be forced against their will to give up their bodily autonomy.

The opinions of entities without functioning brains are of no weight in this discussion; The possibility that a future person might one day be happy to be alive is not relevant in the slightest, unless you plan to try and rescue every last sperm cell, lest you be accused of mass murder.

And the potential to become something is STILL not the same as the thing.

If you had never been born, you wouldn't have any opinions on any issues. So what your opinions are about things that might have led to your not being born are is utterly meaningless.

If your father had decided to wear a condom, your brother would not be here. He wouldn't be dead; He just wouldn't BE. Same as if he had been aborted. Your brother's opinion is irrelevant. And I am not talking about any brothers you actually have; I am talking here about the brother you would have had if your dad hadn't decided to have a sly wank one day instead of fucking your mum. If you want his opinions, or those of the foster kids, to carry any weight in the abortion debate, you had better start by telling your father that he is a murderer. Literally every time he ejaculated outside your mother, he killed one of your brothers or sisters - at least, according to your bizarrely twisted train of thought.

Seriously, you need to start learning how to think - or start leaving the thinking to those who are at least barely competent at it.

To say that the people in the comments do not matter is not a very smart thing to say. They are calling for a civil war. The right is getting very fed up with the left's authoritarian views on things. Taking away free speech by banning conservative speakers on college campuses just so the students can stay indoctrinated with leftist dogma. Did you know Stanford banned Andrew Klavan from speaking because he is against Islamic terrorism? Yet, Stanford allowed a Muslim to speak there who wrote anti-semitic cartoons. Antifa is going around fighting people over free speech. Facebook is banning conservative commentators just for exercising free speech. You can go to jail for misgendering someone. If you watch right wing videos on youtube, they are full of "another civil war is coming soon. We must stop the leftist Nazi's" with thousands of likes. Things are really getting bad.

 

[bilby]

How, exactly, does putting a child into foster care avoid the evil of forcing a woman to host a fetus she doesn't want to carry? Your response appears to be completely unrelated to the post you are quoting.

I couldn't care less what was in a video I haven't watched and have no intention of watching.
Are you hard of thinking or something?

I am not interested in foster children, or for that matter in children at all. The discussion is about fetuses and the women who (if you moronic bullies got your way) would be forced against their will to give up their bodily autonomy.

The opinions of entities without functioning brains are of no weight in this discussion; The possibility that a future person might one day be happy to be alive is not relevant in the slightest, unless you plan to try and rescue every last sperm cell, lest you be accused of mass murder.

And the potential to become something is STILL not the same as the thing.

If you had never been born, you wouldn't have any opinions on any issues. So what your opinions are about things that might have led to your not being born are is utterly meaningless.

If your father had decided to wear a condom, your brother would not be here. He wouldn't be dead; He just wouldn't BE. Same as if he had been aborted. Your brother's opinion is irrelevant. And I am not talking about any brothers you actually have; I am talking here about the brother you would have had if your dad hadn't decided to have a sly wank one day instead of fucking your mum. If you want his opinions, or those of the foster kids, to carry any weight in the abortion debate, you had better start by telling your father that he is a murderer. Literally every time he ejaculated outside your mother, he killed one of your brothers or sisters - at least, according to your bizarrely twisted train of thought.

Seriously, you need to start learning how to think - or start leaving the thinking to those who are at least barely competent at it.

To say that the people in the comments do not matter is not a very smart thing to say.

I didn't say that. Your reading comprehension is inadequate for this conversation to be worth my time.

They are calling for a civil war. The right is getting very fed up with the left's authoritarian views on things. Taking away free speech by banning conservative speakers on college campuses just so the students can stay indoctrinated with leftist dogma. Did you know Stanford banned Andrew Klavan from speaking because he is against Islamic terrorism? Yet, Stanford allowed a Muslim to speak there who wrote anti-semitic cartoons. Antifa is going around fighting people over free speech. Facebook is banning conservative commentators just for exercising free speech. You can go to jail for misgendering someone. If you watch right wing videos on youtube, they are full of "another civil war is coming soon. We must stop the leftist Nazi's" with thousands of likes. Things are really getting bad.

Stupid people and angry people have always been with us. There's often a big overlap between the two.

I honestly don't care what they threaten; Threats are simply an admission that their position cannot win by reasoned argument. And frankly, they are not that scary. They can come and have a go, if they think they're hard enough.

We've defeated fascist bullies before, and if necessary we will do it again.

 

[Half-Life]

I didn't say that. Your reading comprehension is inadequate for this conversation to be worth my time.

They are calling for a civil war. The right is getting very fed up with the left's authoritarian views on things. Taking away free speech by banning conservative speakers on college campuses just so the students can stay indoctrinated with leftist dogma. Did you know Stanford banned Andrew Klavan from speaking because he is against Islamic terrorism? Yet, Stanford allowed a Muslim to speak there who wrote anti-semitic cartoons. Antifa is going around fighting people over free speech. Facebook is banning conservative commentators just for exercising free speech. You can go to jail for misgendering someone. If you watch right wing videos on youtube, they are full of "another civil war is coming soon. We must stop the leftist Nazi's" with thousands of likes. Things are really getting bad.

Stupid people and angry people have always been with us. There's often a big overlap between the two.

I honestly don't care what they threaten; Threats are simply an admission that their position cannot win by reasoned argument. And frankly, they are not that scary. They can come and have a go, if they think they're hard enough.

We've defeated fascist bullies before, and if necessary we will do it again.

But, don't you see? It is the left that are becoming the fascists. See what I wrote above. They are coming for free speech rights. Pretty soon they will ban all conservative thought and education. That is how fascism starts. They come for the education that goes against their dogma.

I will respond to the abortion points tomorrow.

 

[bilby]

I didn't say that. Your reading comprehension is inadequate for this conversation to be worth my time.

They are calling for a civil war. The right is getting very fed up with the left's authoritarian views on things. Taking away free speech by banning conservative speakers on college campuses just so the students can stay indoctrinated with leftist dogma. Did you know Stanford banned Andrew Klavan from speaking because he is against Islamic terrorism? Yet, Stanford allowed a Muslim to speak there who wrote anti-semitic cartoons. Antifa is going around fighting people over free speech. Facebook is banning conservative commentators just for exercising free speech. You can go to jail for misgendering someone. If you watch right wing videos on youtube, they are full of "another civil war is coming soon. We must stop the leftist Nazi's" with thousands of likes. Things are really getting bad.

Stupid people and angry people have always been with us. There's often a big overlap between the two.

I honestly don't care what they threaten; Threats are simply an admission that their position cannot win by reasoned argument. And frankly, they are not that scary. They can come and have a go, if they think they're hard enough.

We've defeated fascist bullies before, and if necessary we will do it again.

But, don't you see? It is the left that are becoming the fascists. See what I wrote above. They are coming for free speech rights. Pretty soon they will ban all conservative thought and education. That is how fascism starts. They come for the education that goes against their dogma.

You should seek psychiatric help.

I will respond to the abortion points tomorrow.

Don't bother. You aren't sufficiently competent to be worth any more of my time.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Pro-choice is about the mother's choice. Not some random murderer's choice.

Let's examine this. A woman gets stabbed and her baby dies in the womb. She says, "I was getting an abortion tomorrow anyway. No big deal."

Is that OK?

You mean other than the battery on the woman?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I didn't say that. Your reading comprehension is inadequate for this conversation to be worth my time.

They are calling for a civil war. The right is getting very fed up with the left's authoritarian views on things. Taking away free speech by banning conservative speakers on college campuses just so the students can stay indoctrinated with leftist dogma. Did you know Stanford banned Andrew Klavan from speaking because he is against Islamic terrorism? Yet, Stanford allowed a Muslim to speak there who wrote anti-semitic cartoons. Antifa is going around fighting people over free speech. Facebook is banning conservative commentators just for exercising free speech. You can go to jail for misgendering someone. If you watch right wing videos on youtube, they are full of "another civil war is coming soon. We must stop the leftist Nazi's" with thousands of likes. Things are really getting bad.

Stupid people and angry people have always been with us. There's often a big overlap between the two.

I honestly don't care what they threaten; Threats are simply an admission that their position cannot win by reasoned argument. And frankly, they are not that scary. They can come and have a go, if they think they're hard enough.

We've defeated fascist bullies before, and if necessary we will do it again.

But, don't you see? It is the left that are becoming the fascists.

Odd, the anti-semites were the ones marching with tiki torches, emboldened by their candidate who tried instigating violence at his own rallies.

 

[ideologyhunter]

% of Americans who say abortion should be legal in all or most circumstances -- about 58% (Pew Research Center)
% of American population that is Catholic -- 24%
% of SCOTUS that is Catholic -- 67%
Anyone taking bets on this question?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Hey guys, I used to post on here years ago. I have been thinking about the abortion argument and I am seeing hypocrisy.

It is OK for a woman to abort the baby because it is "not yet a human being." However, if someone were to stab a pregnant woman and the fetus dies, they get charged with murder. How is this possible if a fetus is not a human being?

Either it's a human being, and abortion AND murder of the baby should be illegal, or it's not a human being and abortion AND murder should both be legal. You can't say "Abortion is not murder but someone else doing it is murder." See the hypocrisy? This is why I'm leaning more towards the pro-life side.

They only get charged with murder because the pro-lifers noted that one of the reasons behind Roe vs Wade is the law didn't treat that as murder. The fetal murder laws are an attempt to undermine Roe vs Wade.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

But with the kidneys argument, you didn't do anything to make the other person have a kidney problem. With pregnancy, you deliberately chose to have sex knowing full well you could end up pregnant. Abortion shouldn't be used as a form of birth control because you were too irresponsible to think first. "Oh, I'm pregnant. I'm gonna punish the baby for my actions by killing it." See how crazy that is?

"I notice that everyone in favor of abortion is alive." - Ronald Reagan

1) Rape.

2) This is the normal position of those who are actually pro-punishment, not pro-life.

You've been hurt in an auto accident. You deliberately chose to drive knowing full well an accident could happen. Medical treatment shouldn't be used as a way to evade responsibility for your actions.

As for the pedestrians who get hurt--if they really were pedestrians they wouldn't have been hit.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I am already very much aware of how seriously people take this.

It remains true that the depth of someone's conviction tells you nothing about whether they are right or wrong.

And it remains true that it's morally wrong to interfere with a woman's choices about how she uses her reproductive organs.

Particularly if you do so under the delusion that a fetus with no brain should have more rights to her reproductive organs than she herself does. That position is not just wrong, it's evil and wrong.

It's an understandable mistake for people who are used to bullying others into conformity to make; But that doesn't make it less of a mistake, and nor does it make it less evil.

That is why putting the child in foster care is the better option. This was discussed in the video. The argument is that there will be too many kids in foster care. But, it was full of comments of people saying "I was in foster care. I'd rather be alive than dead." Would you be willing to go to foster care and tell the children, "You should've all been aborted instead?"

So she should attempt to conceive whenever possible? Because that's the choice between foster care and the egg dying in the womb unfertilized.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

To say that the people in the comments do not matter is not a very smart thing to say. They are calling for a civil war. The right is getting very fed up with the left's authoritarian views on things. Taking away free speech by banning conservative speakers on college campuses just so the students can stay indoctrinated with leftist dogma. Did you know Stanford banned Andrew Klavan from speaking because he is against Islamic terrorism? Yet, Stanford allowed a Muslim to speak there who wrote anti-semitic cartoons. Antifa is going around fighting people over free speech. Facebook is banning conservative commentators just for exercising free speech. You can go to jail for misgendering someone. If you watch right wing videos on youtube, they are full of "another civil war is coming soon. We must stop the leftist Nazi's" with thousands of likes. Things are really getting bad.

It's the right that's being authoritarian--you don't like any attempts to limit hate speech, even when it's outright lies.

Most people don't like hate speech from any side.

Note, also, that an awful lot of the incidents are manufactured.

An example from when I was in high school:

School clubs were allowed to make short announcements of upcoming events as part of the morning announcements over the PA.

Monday the Bible study group used this to read a bit from the Bible. They were told it was a misuse of the privilege, quit it. Tuesday they did the same thing. Wednesday they weren't allowed to make announcements anymore and they screamed discrimination.

 

[Half-Life]

But with the kidneys argument, you didn't do anything to make the other person have a kidney problem. With pregnancy, you deliberately chose to have sex knowing full well you could end up pregnant. Abortion shouldn't be used as a form of birth control because you were too irresponsible to think first. "Oh, I'm pregnant. I'm gonna punish the baby for my actions by killing it." See how crazy that is?

"I notice that everyone in favor of abortion is alive." - Ronald Reagan

1) Rape.

2) This is the normal position of those who are actually pro-punishment, not pro-life.

You've been hurt in an auto accident. You deliberately chose to drive knowing full well an accident could happen. Medical treatment shouldn't be used as a way to evade responsibility for your actions.

As for the pedestrians who get hurt--if they really were pedestrians they wouldn't have been hit.

Rape is only about 1% of the circumstances. The left loves to lie and make it seem like rapes account for 99% of pregnancies. And even if the woman is raped, there are plenty of women who voiced their opinions at rallies and protests saying, "I was raped and I love my child!" Being raped is very very evil, no doubt about it. But killing an innocent baby that had NOTHING TO DO WITH IT is evil as well.

You've been hurt in an auto accident. You deliberately chose to drive knowing full well an accident could happen. Medical treatment shouldn't be used as a way to evade responsibility for your actions.

As for the pedestrians who get hurt--if they really were pedestrians they wouldn't have been hit.

Not the same thing. People have to drive to their jobs. It's unavoidable. Don't you agree that if people were responsible and waited until marriage to have sex, abortion would become less of a problem? But, these days people are encouraged to have sex willy nilly for fun with no consequences because they can just get an abortion if they get pregnant. This is why the right is getting fed up. No one has personal responsibility anymore. The abortion laws are basically about personal responsibility and thinking before your actions. People will think twice about sex for fun if they realize they'd be stuck with the baby.

 

[Half-Life]

To say that the people in the comments do not matter is not a very smart thing to say. They are calling for a civil war. The right is getting very fed up with the left's authoritarian views on things. Taking away free speech by banning conservative speakers on college campuses just so the students can stay indoctrinated with leftist dogma. Did you know Stanford banned Andrew Klavan from speaking because he is against Islamic terrorism? Yet, Stanford allowed a Muslim to speak there who wrote anti-semitic cartoons. Antifa is going around fighting people over free speech. Facebook is banning conservative commentators just for exercising free speech. You can go to jail for misgendering someone. If you watch right wing videos on youtube, they are full of "another civil war is coming soon. We must stop the leftist Nazi's" with thousands of likes. Things are really getting bad.

It's the right that's being authoritarian--you don't like any attempts to limit hate speech, even when it's outright lies.

Most people don't like hate speech from any side.

Note, also, that an awful lot of the incidents are manufactured.

An example from when I was in high school:

School clubs were allowed to make short announcements of upcoming events as part of the morning announcements over the PA.

Monday the Bible study group used this to read a bit from the Bible. They were told it was a misuse of the privilege, quit it. Tuesday they did the same thing. Wednesday they weren't allowed to make announcements anymore and they screamed discrimination.

Look up the Andrew Klavan story. He literally got banned from speaking at Stanford because he speaks out against Islamic terrorism and how he doesn't want it in the U.S. Stanford said that they feel like he offends the Muslim students. HOWEVER, Stanford allowed a Muslim speaker at the school who made ANTI-SEMITIC cartoons and they got posted around campus. Why didn't Stanford ban the Muslim? Because the left hates Christians and loves Muslims.

"Hate speech" has become "whatever the left disagrees with." Even Obama and Hilary couldn't muster up the courage to say "Christians." They said, "Easter worshipers." Christians are getting tired of this disrespect of trying to be silenced while Muslims get free reign no matter what they do or say.

 

[Half-Life]

They only get charged with murder because the pro-lifers noted that one of the reasons behind Roe vs Wade is the law didn't treat that as murder. The fetal murder laws are an attempt to undermine Roe vs Wade.

So you agree that if the fetus dies in the womb due to a stabbing, the person shouldn't be charged with murder?