Can the Democrats come back?

[Harry Bosch]

Her showing up and campaigning won't neccesarily have made a big difference. She lacked a good message, was an establishment candidate when people were sick of the establishment, had an air of self-entitlement from her initial expected "coronation" and topped off with her "I'm with her" rather than "She's with us" slogan, and followed after 8 years of Obama (elections tend to oscilate back and forth). She was a bad candidate and ran a bad campaign with a bad message. What needs to change to get the Democrats back on course is an actual course correction, not more campaigning with the same broken message.

Push to get money out of politics and put Elizabeth Warren up next time. Make her your first female president, and use a slogan similar to "We are the 99%".

How the hell would we get money out of politics? There are no democrats in power today. Any thought that we'll have much influence on policy is crazy talk.

I think that the problem with Warren is that her base is too small. She appeals to people who are pissed off at wall street. We have much bigger problems than that. I think that we need leaders who can appeal to the moderates. Warren and Sanders appeal to younger voters. Younger voters don't vote! I haven't seen the exit polls (too depressing for me to look at) but I'll bet that once again, their turn out was terrible.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Her showing up and campaigning won't neccesarily have made a big difference. She lacked a good message, was an establishment candidate when people were sick of the establishment, had an air of self-entitlement from her initial expected "coronation" and topped off with her "I'm with her" rather than "She's with us" slogan, and followed after 8 years of Obama (elections tend to oscilate back and forth). She was a bad candidate and ran a bad campaign with a bad message. What needs to change to get the Democrats back on course is an actual course correction, not more campaigning with the same broken message.

Push to get money out of politics and put Elizabeth Warren up next time. Make her your first female president, and use a slogan similar to "We are the 99%".

How the hell would we get money out of politics? There are no democrats in power today. Any thought that we'll have much influence on policy is crazy talk.

I think that the problem with Warren is that her base is too small. She appeals to people who are pissed off at wall street. We have much bigger problems than that. I think that we need leaders who can appeal to the moderates. Warren and Sanders appeal to younger voters. Younger voters don't vote! I haven't seen the exit polls (too depressing for me to look at) but I'll bet that once again, their turn out was terrible.

Yeah, millenials were one of the issues. They were clueless about what was at stake... like Nader voters in '00.

But so were racist mofos.

 

[dismal]

Her showing up and campaigning won't neccesarily have made a big difference. She lacked a good message, was an establishment candidate when people were sick of the establishment, had an air of self-entitlement from her initial expected "coronation" and topped off with her "I'm with her" rather than "She's with us" slogan, and followed after 8 years of Obama (elections tend to oscilate back and forth). She was a bad candidate and ran a bad campaign with a bad message. What needs to change to get the Democrats back on course is an actual course correction, not more campaigning with the same broken message.

Push to get money out of politics and put Elizabeth Warren up next time. Make her your first female president, and use a slogan similar to "We are the 99%".

How the hell would we get money out of politics?

You are becoming seriously detached from reality. The Dems have all the money these days. Hillary massively outspent Trump, and I'm guessing any candidate ever.

Trying to elect Dems to get money out of politics is like voting for cheerleaders to get rid of peppy girls in short skirts.

Trump probably just delivered the greatest blow against money in politics in American history. He showed how you win without it.

 

[Harry Bosch]

How the hell would we get money out of politics?

You are becoming seriously detached from reality. The Dems have all the money these days. Hillary massively outspent Trump, and I'm guessing any candidate ever.

Trying to elect Dems to get money out of politics is like voting for cheerleaders to get rid of peppy girls in short skirts.

Trump probably just delivered the greatest blow against money in politics in American history. He showed how you win without it.

Well, my post was directed at Jolly. The dems have zero power today. Therefore it's crazy to "push" anything. But to your point: I agree. Bush spent far more than Trump.

 

[Tristan Scott]

Can the Democrats come back?

The Democrats will be fine.

Will the Republicans survive all this? Where do the republicans even stand any more? They have allowed their party to be completely dominated by Nationalist Radicals, White Supremacists and bigots. If this is a sustainable base, then the country itself is in deep shit. f not, which I believe (hope) to be the case, then it will be short lived and the Republican party will be the one that will have to regroup.

It has already started. Trump is already backing off some the radical promises that got him elected-the conservatives are getting more and more pissed, and soon the anti gay, anti immigrant, anti everything else bunch will start seeing that their agendas are going no-where.

No, I see this being a question of where the Republicans go from here. They may end up fracturing into different parties themselves.

 

[untermensche]

Obama has been president for the last eight years.

Therefore every bad thing that happened was blamed on him, by the Republicans. To the point of absurdity.

If every problem in the world was not Obama's fault, it was the fault of Obamacare.

And then of course we learn from Trump that the universe is about to collapse and it is Hillary's fault, or the fault of her emails.

Even if the accusations are insanity when people fall on hard times they look for scapegoats and root causes.

All the election of Trump shows is that in corporate America many have fallen on hard times.

When was America great? Who knows?

When was America better?

When unions were strong and corporations were smaller.

 

[Tristan Scott]

Obama has been president for the last eight years.

Therefore every bad thing that happened was blamed on him, by the Republicans. To the point of absurdity.

If every problem in the world was not Obama's fault, it was the fault of Obamacare.

And then of course we learn from Trump that the universe is about to collapse and it is Hillary's fault, or the fault of her emails.

Even if the accusations are insanity when people fall on hard times they look for scapegoats and root causes.

All the election of Trump shows is that in corporate America many have fallen on hard times.

When was America great? Who knows?

When was America better?

When unions were strong and corporations were smaller.

...and we kept the distribution of wealth in better balance through progressive taxation.

 

[credoconsolans]

Obama has been president for the last eight years.

Therefore every bad thing that happened was blamed on him, by the Republicans. To the point of absurdity.

If every problem in the world was not Obama's fault, it was the fault of Obamacare.

And then of course we learn from Trump that the universe is about to collapse and it is Hillary's fault, or the fault of her emails.

Even if the accusations are insanity when people fall on hard times they look for scapegoats and root causes.

All the election of Trump shows is that in corporate America many have fallen on hard times.

When was America great? Who knows?

When was America better?

When unions were strong and corporations were smaller.

OMG! I just talked with a Trump gloater who said unions are evil and on the way out and good riddance because working for them was demeaning.

 

[Deepak]

How the hell would we get money out of politics? There are no democrats in power today. Any thought that we'll have much influence on policy is crazy talk.

I think that the problem with Warren is that her base is too small. She appeals to people who are pissed off at wall street. We have much bigger problems than that. I think that we need leaders who can appeal to the moderates. Warren and Sanders appeal to younger voters. Younger voters don't vote! I haven't seen the exit polls (too depressing for me to look at) but I'll bet that once again, their turn out was terrible.

Yeah, millenials were one of the issues. They were clueless about what was at stake... like Nader voters in '00.

But so were racist mofos.

Electoral map for 18-25 year olds:

 

[Harry Bosch]

Yeah, millenials were one of the issues. They were clueless about what was at stake... like Nader voters in '00.

But so were racist mofos.

Electoral map for 18-25 year olds:

Wow, that is a stunning graph. Although people tend to become conservative as they age...

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Yeah, millenials were one of the issues. They were clueless about what was at stake... like Nader voters in '00.

But so were racist mofos.

Electoral map for 18-25 year olds:

Yup, but what about the actual turnout? More baby boomers actually went out to vote to screw the Gen X and Millennial Generations. The fuck holes!

 

[Deepak]

Yup, but what about the actual turnout? More baby boomers actually went out to vote to screw the Gen X and Millennial Generations. The fuck holes!

I don't think those numbers will be known with a high degree of confidence until the next census, but looking at the wiki pages for 2012 and 2016 turnout was down across most age groups.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2016

If you have better numbers then I'd like to see them, but the way I read this is a candidate that didn't excite people.

And why do people who stayed home in this election matter, but the ones who stayed home when Nader 'spoiled' Bush-Gore didn't? Blaming the electorate doesn't sound like a winning strategy for me, but who knows - maybe morale does improve with sufficient beatings (or at least blaming).

 

[skepticalbip]

Yeah, millenials were one of the issues. They were clueless about what was at stake... like Nader voters in '00.

But so were racist mofos.

Electoral map for 18-25 year olds:

There is an old saying, I forget by who but think maybe Benjamin Disraeli:

If you are not a liberal at 25, you have no heart. If you are not a conservative at 35 you have no brain.

The distribution shown on that chart is nothing new. It pretty much replicates universal political thought vs. age.

 

[Deepak]

There is an old saying, I forget by who but think maybe Benjamin Disraeli:

If you are not a liberal at 25, you have no heart. If you are not a conservative at 35 you have no brain.

The distribution shown on that chart is nothing new. It pretty much replicates universal political thought vs. age.

It's one of those oft repeated apocryphal quotes that's been applied to so many different political theories that it has the profoundness of 'your keys are always in the last place you looked' and only means that the old are only able to tolerate whatever political change they were able to achieve and no more. http://quoteinvestigator.com/2014/02/24/heart-head/

To be sure, though, the Trump vote in this election was the radical one and the Clinton vote the measured conventional one.