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Christian blogger grumbles about fellow Christians believing in New-Agey stuff

How science really gets done.

Faith Vs Fact - Why Science And Religion Are Incompatible
Jerry Coyne 2015

I learned about the nature of science the hard way. After an undergraduate
education in biology at a small southern college, I was determined to get
a Ph.D. in evolutionary genetics at the best laboratory in that field. At
the time, that was the laboratory of Richard Lewontin at Harvard’s Museum
of Comparative Zoology, for Lewontin was widely seen as the world’s best
evolutionary geneticist. But soon after I arrived and began working on
evolution in fruit flies, I thought I’d made a terrible mistake. Shy and
reserved, I felt as if I’d been hurled into a pit of unrelenting
negativity. In research seminars, the audience seemed determined to
dismantle the credibility of the speaker. Sometimes they wouldn’t even
wait until the question period after the talk, but would rudely shout out
critical questions and comments during the talk itself. When I thought I
had a good idea and tentatively described it to my fellow graduate
students, it was picked apart like a flounder on a plate. And when we all
discussed science around the big rectangular table in our commons room,
the atmosphere was heated and contentious. Every piece of work, published
or otherwise, was scrutinized for problems problems that were almost
always found. This made me worry that whatever science I managed to
produce could never make the grade. I even thought about leaving graduate
school. Eventually, fearful of being criticized, I simply kept my mouth
shut and listened. That went on for two years. But in the end, that
listening was my education in science, for I learned that the pervasive
doubt and criticality weren’t intended as personal attacks, but were
actually the essentialingredients in science, used as a form of quality
control to uncover the researcher’s misconceptions and mistakes. Like
Michelangelo’s sculpturing, which he saw as eliminating marble to reveal
the statue within, the critical scrutiny of scientific ideas and
experiments is designed, by eliminating error, to find the core of truth
in an idea. Once I’d learned this, and developed a skin thick enough to
engage in the inevitable to-and-fro, I began to enjoy science. For if you
can tolerate the criticality and doubt—and they’re not for everyone — the
process of science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to
be the first person to find out something new about the universe.

Until I started pondering the relationship of science and religion for this
book, I never really thought about what “science” was, although I’d been
doing it for over three decades. Most scientists never get formal
instruction in “the scientific method,” except perhaps for the rote (and
incorrect) recitation of “make hypothesis/test it/accept it”
sequence you see in textbooks. Literally and figuratively, I learned
science on the fly, simply by watching how my peers did it. But learning
it and defining it are different matters. In fact, it was not until I
wrote this book that I realized that my own notion of science is simply
that of a method: a process (to my mind, the only process) that hasproved
useful in helping us understand what is real in the universe. While I had
never pondered this issue, my training as a scientist had led me to
unconsciously internalize its methods.
 
"...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That's plainly untrue.
There are Nobel Prizes awaiting in your own backyard.
 
"...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That's plainly untrue.
There are Nobel Prizes awaiting in your own backyard.

You reject without explanation. Why do you think it's not true?

Here's why it IS true - not every new "something about the universe" is nobel prize-worthy.
Not sure why you thought that every new discovery got a prize.

On the contrary, all of us in STEM learn new things that no one else knew all the time and it is immensely exciting. There are millions of patents out there giving testimony to this, and millions more trade secrets that testify further

You have such a narrow view of the world that you don't even know what all we are encountering that brings us such joy.
You thought only Nobel Prize winners have discovered anything.


What a bland and featureless existence you contemplate compared to the rich and vibrant land of discovery that we inhabit.
 
"...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That's plainly untrue.
There are Nobel Prizes awaiting in your own backyard.

How would a patently deluded religious zealot know ANYTHING about the joys of scientific pursuit?
 
These 18 Accidental And Unintended Scientific Discoveries Changed The World

"...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That's plainly untrue.
There are Nobel Prizes awaiting in your own backyard.

How would a patently deluded religious zealot know ANYTHING about the joys of scientific pursuit?

You said..."...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That has NEVER been true at anytime in the history of human learning.

You don't HAVE to have a particular type of job to be the first person to discover something new about the universe - even in your own backyard.

Do you claim that every such new/first discovery was made by a person whose job was 'scientist'?

I would argue that all the really useful discoveries/inventions made by human beings occurred thousands of years before the word science came into existence.
 
Really useful inventions. Telescopes. Microscopes. These changed the way humans viewed the world and lead to many new discoveries that were impossible without that. Electricity. learning to handle electricity allowed chemists to discover the elements that could not be discovered without that. Cyclotron and cloud chambers. Allowed discoveries about nature not knowable without them. And on and on and on in this vein.
 
... snip ...

I would argue that all the really useful discoveries/inventions made by human beings occurred thousands of years before the word science came into existence.
Discovering and understanding are very different things.

Discovering that wood floats in water and can be used to keep one's head above water when crossing a river is useful but not science. Science would be the process used to understand why wood floats. Once understood, that knowledge can even be used to design boats made from iron even though a block iron does not float.
 
"...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That's plainly untrue.
There are Nobel Prizes awaiting in your own backyard.

How would a patently deluded religious zealot know ANYTHING about the joys of scientific pursuit?

You said..."...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That has NEVER been true at anytime in the history of human learning.

You don't HAVE to have a particular type of job to be the first person to discover something new about the universe - even in your own backyard.

Do you claim that every such new/first discovery was made by a person whose job was 'scientist'?

I would argue that all the really useful discoveries/inventions made by human beings occurred thousands of years before the word science came into existence.

This is the lamest point about anything I've ever seen someone attempt to make. Go outside or something. Actually don't go outside, you'll probably spread Covid.
 
"...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That's plainly untrue.
There are Nobel Prizes awaiting in your own backyard.

How would a patently deluded religious zealot know ANYTHING about the joys of scientific pursuit?

You said..."...science yields a joy that no other job confers: the chance to be the first person to find out something new about the universe."

That's fair. "job" is a poor word choice. "Method" is a better word.

That has NEVER been true at anytime in the history of human learning.

You don't HAVE to have a particular type of job to be the first person to discover something new about the universe - even in your own backyard.

But you do need to use the method of science to determine the thing in a way that discovers, rather than observes without context, meaning or a modicum of certainty.

Do you claim that every such new/first discovery was made by a person whose job was 'scientist'?

I would argue that all the really useful discoveries/inventions made by human beings occurred thousands of years before the word science came into existence.

And those who did it without science method were not discovering or inventing something they could hang their hat on. They were observing something interesting, but would not have been able to determine how accurate it was.

The "discovery" part was always when they could say, "no really, this is reliably true!"

Those who developed tinctures to cure or invented reading tea leaves were not "discovering something new about the universe."
 
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