England headed for A Caliphate

[RVonse]

Islam, unlike Judaism, has a great desire to make the entire world subservient to Islam.

Sure. Also, international Jewry is conspiring with the communists to undermine the German state, as evidenced by their betrayal of the fatherland in the Great War.

Or perhaps propaganda is a poor source of information about reality.

Or perhaps Derec is right. At the very least, there seems to be a huge disconnect between the actual facts of reality; how significant and rapid is the increase of muslim culture in Europe in general? Your side seems to be saying it is nothing but the other side says it is a dire concern. So right away there is the propaganda divide on both sides making a reasonable person not even knowing facts that should seem easily apparent. So lets see where this goes if your side is correct versus Derec's.

What if liberals are right and nothing is done? We would then expect the small community of Muslims to integrate nicely with European culture with no problems. But what if you are wrong? In that scenario, your liberal views are now a very distant memory of obsolescence being completely replaced by the (now) Islam women wearing sheets over their heads.

It should also be pointed out if Islam is about to take over, nothing short of a fascist (Trumpian) state would fix any of this anyway. Indeed the saving of Europe from Islam culture would only be saved if NATO would just allow Putin to take it over. Since Russia taking over Europe would be closer to the values to European values of today.

 

[pood]

Islam, unlike Judaism, has a great desire to make the entire world subservient to Islam.

Sure. Also, international Jewry is conspiring with the communists to undermine the German state, as evidenced by their betrayal of the fatherland in the Great War.

Or perhaps propaganda is a poor source of information about reality.

Or perhaps Derec is right. At the very least, there seems to be a huge disconnect between the actual facts of reality; how significant and rapid is the increase of muslim culture in Europe in general? Your side seems to be saying it is nothing but the other side says it is a dire concern. So right away there is the propaganda divide on both sides making a reasonable person not even knowing facts that should seem easily apparent. So lets see where this goes if your side is correct versus Derec's.

What if liberals are right and nothing is done? We would then expect the small community of Muslims to integrate nicely with European culture with no problems. But what if you are wrong? In that scenario, your liberal views are now a very distant memory of obsolescence being completely replaced by the (now) Islam women wearing sheets over their heads.

It should also be pointed out if Islam is about to take over, nothing short of a fascist (Trumpian) state would fix any of this anyway. Indeed the saving of Europe from Islam culture would only be saved if NATO would just allow Putin to take it over. Since Russia taking over Europe would be closer to the values to European values of today.

The Muslim population of New York City, where I live, is now estimated to be approaching one million. It is the largest Muslim population of any city in the country. And they present no problem to anyone. They work hard and care for their families like anyone else, and they worship at beautiful mosques. So I guess us liberals are right.

If, after 9/11, non-Muslims had undertaken systematic persecution of the city’s Muslim population, I imagine the city’s Muslim population would have been radicalized and they would have fought back. But that largely did not happen, because of the sophistication and maturity of us New Yorkers. And now we are on the verge of electing a Muslim as mayor. Yay for us!

 

[pood]

In the 19th century, the influx of Irish, Italian, German, Polish, and other non-WASP immigrants to New York City was considered a major threat by WASPs. It is the theme of the movie Gangs of New York, emphasizing the dire uproar over the arrival of Irish. How did that all work out? You work it out.

As it happens Muslims and Arabs have integrated just fine here, just as the others did.

 

[southernhybrid]

https://factually.co/fact-checks/society/uk-muslim-population-percentage-b99c00

How scary that about 6% of the English and Wales population identify as Muslim. It's less than 2% in the US, but I personally know a Christian woman who is shaking in her boots thinking that Muslims are taking over the country.

The best available 2021-census–based estimates put the Muslim population in England and Wales at roughly 4.0 million people, which various analysts translate into about 6%–6.5% of the population depending on the geographic denominator used and rounding choices <a href="https://mcb.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/03/Census-Report-Summary-2025-.pdf" rel="noopener noreferrer">[1]</a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_Kingdom#Historical_trends_since_1900" rel="noopener noreferrer">[2]</a>. More recent mid‑2024 population growth and differing reporting frames (England & Wales versus the whole UK, plus subsequent migration) mean that simple percentage headlines can either understate or overstate the current share; the core fact is that 2021 census counts cluster around four million Muslims, and that figure yields a Muslim share near six percent <a href="https://mcb.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/03/Census-Report-Summary-2025-.pdf" rel="noopener noreferrer">[1]</a> <a href="https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/tran.../freedomofinformationfoi/muslimslivingintheuk" rel="noopener noreferrer">[3]</a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_Kingdom#Historical_trends_since_1900" rel="noopener noreferrer">[2]</a>.

 

[pood]

https://factually.co/fact-checks/society/uk-muslim-population-percentage-b99c00

How scary that about 6% of the English and Wales population identify as Muslim. It's less than 2% in the US, but I personally know a Christian woman who is shaking in her boots thinking that Muslims are taking over the country.

The best available 2021-census–based estimates put the Muslim population in England and Wales at roughly 4.0 million people, which various analysts translate into about 6%–6.5% of the population depending on the geographic denominator used and rounding choices <a href="https://mcb.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/03/Census-Report-Summary-2025-.pdf" rel="noopener noreferrer">[1]</a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_Kingdom#Historical_trends_since_1900" rel="noopener noreferrer">[2]</a>. More recent mid‑2024 population growth and differing reporting frames (England & Wales versus the whole UK, plus subsequent migration) mean that simple percentage headlines can either understate or overstate the current share; the core fact is that 2021 census counts cluster around four million Muslims, and that figure yields a Muslim share near six percent <a href="https://mcb.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2025/03/Census-Report-Summary-2025-.pdf" rel="noopener noreferrer">[1]</a> <a href="https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/tran.../freedomofinformationfoi/muslimslivingintheuk" rel="noopener noreferrer">[3]</a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_Kingdom#Historical_trends_since_1900" rel="noopener noreferrer">[2]</a>.

Yep, but England is heading for a caliphate!!

 

[Swammerdami]

Two dead in Manchester in an attack on a synagogue

Horrible, but not surprising anymore unfortunately.

Manchester police say they believe the synagogue attacker is 35-year-old Jihad Al-Shamie, a British citizen of Syrian descent

The article says that a "woman in her 60s" was arrested along with two 30-something men. Could the woman be the terrorist's mother? After all, who names their kid "Jihad"?

Diversity is our strength indeed.

There is sadly a lack of willingness to acknowledge that some cultures are not compatible with the West.

What ignorant bullshit. White Christian supremacists have targeted and killed Jewish people in the US. Anti-Semitism was Christian led in Europe when Germany perfected mass murder. Some protestants hate the Jewish, and Trump's 'globalism' crap is anti-Semitism born.

The Jewish Community, unfortunately, is now dealing with expanding threats and violence from the Right (religious bigotry) and Left / Arabs (Gaza and religious/historic based intolerance). For whatever reason, you use their fear and sorrow as a lance to fight for your bigotry against Muslims. It is pathetic.

Forget it, Jimmy. It's MAGA Town.

 

[pood]

What I “simp” for is the underdog and the oppressed against fascists. The opposite of you and your ilk.

Nonsense. Islam is not "oppressed". It is an oppressive ideology that seeks to make the whole world submit to itself.

Total twaddle, as usual from you. The vast majority of Muslims don’t give a shit about oppressing the world or making it submit to itself. They just want to live in peace and not be oppressed by people like you. You are the oppressor.

 

[pood]

The largest concentration of Muslims in the world is in Indonesia. Is Indonesia waging global jihad?

Nope. Didn’t think so.

The stark ignorance displayed in this thread is boggling.

Muslims, like any self-identified group, will radicalize when marginalized.

 

[pood]

I just pointed out to Derec that there are nearly one million Muslims in NYC and yet somehow we are not living under a caliphate nor subject to repeated suicide bombings. Derec and Vonse’s response?

 

[RVonse]

I just pointed out to Derec that there are nearly one million Muslims in NYC and yet somehow we are not living under a caliphate nor subject to repeated suicide bombings. Derec and Vonse’s response?

One obvious difference between London and NYC is your mayor is not Muslim...yet.

Is the religious belief of a government leader even important at all to the average voter? (ask JFK during his 1960 POTUS election!)

 

[southernhybrid]

I just pointed out to Derec that there are nearly one million Muslims in NYC and yet somehow we are not living under a caliphate nor subject to repeated suicide bombings. Derec and Vonse’s response?

One obvious difference between London and NYC is your mayor is not Muslim...yet.

Is the religious belief of a government leader even important at all to the average voter? (ask JFK during his 1960 POTUS election!)

It's only important to stupid or poorly informed people. My parents were told by their fucking church that if JFK got elected, the pope would rule the US, so they stupidly voted for Nixon. Later they came to regret their vote and liked JFK. They never voted for another Republican for the rest of their lives.

The potential mayor of NYC is a rather liberal Muslim. I'm making that claim since he supports the rights of the LBGTQ citizens as well as reproductive rights for women. The conservative Muslims in NYC don't like him for that.

The Atlanta Freethought Society had a small group of Muslims as speakers a year or so after 911 to explain to us that most Muslims aren't anything like the ones who are terrorists or who want to deny others religious freedom. They were very nice, thoughtful people and I felt sorry for the way that some were treating them.

Atheists might consider religion to be fairy tales but the majority of us fully support religious freedom, as long as it doesn't try to interfere with government. If their fairy tales help others cope, what business is it of mine?

The WCNs are the problem these days as they want an extremist Christian theocracy that would go so far as to take away the voting rights of women, suppress minorities and deny people other basic rights. Why are one or two of you so hung up on those who are Muslim when they aren't the primary threat in this country?

There are good and bad in all groups. Timothy McVeigh said he was an atheist in a televised interview shortly before he was executed. I saw the interview on tv and remember it quite well. Most atheists are good people but as I said before, there are good and bad in all groups

 

[TSwizzle]

How scary that about 6% of the English and Wales population identify as Muslim.

It won’t take much more for the effects to really make changes. A declining birth rate in the natives coupled with a large birth rate of mulims and mass immigration will have consequences. You only need look at some larger cities in the UK and Europe where muslims are almost the majority. Birmingham and Bradford for example. Sharia courts everywhere, the wearing of the burqa, school curriculum being muslim friendly. muslims are not coming to Europe to integrate, they are coming to Europe to invade and conquer. It’s what islam does. A cursory look at the history of islam will relieve you of some of your ignorance, maybe.

 

[southernhybrid]

How scary that about 6% of the English and Wales population identify as Muslim.

It won’t take much more for the effects to really make changes. A declining birth rate in the natives coupled with a large birth rate of mulims and mass immigration will have consequences. You only need look at some larger cities in the UK and Europe where muslims are almost the majority. Birmingham and Bradford for example. Sharia courts everywhere, the wearing of the burqa, school curriculum being muslim friendly. muslims are not coming to Europe to integrate, they are coming to Europe to invade and conquer. It’s what islam does. A cursory look at the history of islam will relieve you of some of your ignorance, maybe.

Sounds more like you are the ignorant one, considering that you voted for Trump and still don't see the plans to establish a Christian theocracy in the US.

I read yesterday that due to the increased birth rates among Muslims, there will likely be around 3.5% by 2050 in the US. Not so scary. Maybe it will be around 10 or 15% in parts of Europe, but since most aren't harmful, who the fuck cares! I've read that a lot of Iranians are atheists but they can't say that is public out of fear. A lot of Iranians are also Bahai's, a far less destructive religion based on racial and sexual equality, although still a fairy tale.

I saw some burka wearing Muslim women in Indianapolis during the 4 months we stayed up there, but they weren't the least bit scary. I did wonder why they were so attached to dressing that way and if they weren't afraid of ICE, but other than 2 or 3 in Burkas, the other Muslim women I saw in Indy wore headscarves, but they also had on lots of make up and very fashionable clothing. I think a lot of things tied to religion are more cultural than related to belief. Kind of like Christians wearing crosses made of gold. They are decorative although I wouldn't want to wear a symbol of execution. I'm sure they don't see it that way. They probably see it as a symbol of salvation. Liberal and moderate Christians don't concern me, but the extremist one on the right are a potential threat, so why worry about Muslims when we have a president who is braking laws and encouraging a Christian theocracy? Sadly, Europe is also leaning to the right although I don't think it's Muslims leading the way.

But yeah. Historically religion has started wars than anything, regardless of which version.

 

[TSwizzle]

How scary that about 6% of the English and Wales population identify as Muslim.

It won’t take much more for the effects to really make changes. A declining birth rate in the natives coupled with a large birth rate of mulims and mass immigration will have consequences. You only need look at some larger cities in the UK and Europe where muslims are almost the majority. Birmingham and Bradford for example. Sharia courts everywhere, the wearing of the burqa, school curriculum being muslim friendly. muslims are not coming to Europe to integrate, they are coming to Europe to invade and conquer. It’s what islam does. A cursory look at the history of islam will relieve you of some of your ignorance, maybe.

Sounds more like you are the ignorant one, {snip irrelevant screed}

This has zero relevance to the topic and you know it. You deflect because you can’t face the facts.

 

[bilby]

But what if you are wrong?

Really? Your proposed "reasoning" for accepting the premise that "bigotry is valuable" is a reworking of Pascal's Wager?

If that's the best you can do, you have no case at all.

Personally, I prefer an empirical, fact-based approach. And you can find examples in this very thread:

These are local government elections, so we are talking about county and city councils, which have very limited powers.

They can decide to spend more money on repairing roads, and less on garbage collection (or vice-versa), but declaring a theocracy would rather exceed their authority, and the Home Office would take a dim view of any attempt to do so.

County councillors don't get asked about "the free mixing of men and women".

Not even in Lancashire.

You know that only citizens are permitted to run and/or vote in these elections, right?

Most of the Muslims in Burnley (and across the UK) are the children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren and even great-great-grand children of immigrants who arrived in the UK in the 1950s from Pakistan and Bangladesh, at the invitation of the British Government who were seeking to resolve the post-war labour shortage.

That would be the deputy leader of the party that currently holds 0.615% of the seats in the UK Parliament?

How terrifying it must be to you for such a person to wield such enormous power!

Oh, and talking of utterly trivial numbers...

The UK government publishes the daily number of arrivals, on a rolling weekly basis, for irregular migrants attempting to cross the English Channel in small boats without permission to enter the UK.

Here are today's shocking figures:

Terrifying. It's an invading army of zero men, on zero boats, accompanied by zero women and children. How can the UK possibly cope??

In the week ending 24 August, 291 people arrived on five boats; A staggering 0.0005% of the UK population.

In England about 1,700 babies are born every day (There are a few born in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland too).

If they are going to take over, these boat people are going to have to try a LOT harder

An invasion of the UK consisting of a few tens of thousands? You are having a laugh mate.

The UK population is about 36% bigger today than it was in 1940, when Unternehmen Seelöwe was abandoned. That invasion plan called for 138,000 heavily armed men, with tank and artillery support, to land in the first two days, and 248,000 to land within two weeks of S-Tag.

A thousand people (or even a few tens of thousands spread over an entire year) in small boats crossing the channel is not an invasion that must be repelled; It is a pathetic trickle of desparate people who deserve assistance.

This thread is not about the US. It's about England/UK. And they have a lot of Islamic billboards.

No, they really don't. They have some. Probably as many (and as ignored) as the Christians.

This one does not even have any English, just Arabic.

Ooooh! Scary!!

What does it say?

View attachment 52293

This London advertisement is only in Chinese (though they have provided a helpful guide to pronunciation). And it's been there 252 years. Obviously it's only a matter of time before Chinese culture completely displaces Western Culture in England.

You appear to think that your ignorant cowardice is somehow laudable; It's not. Nobody should be as needlessly terrified as you are, certainly not of events in a distant country of which you know little, and care less.

And your efforts to engender fear in everyone else are as tiresome as they are stupid.

You have nothing to fear, but fear itself.

Perhaps TSw is onto something here

Jews banned from Aston Villa game

It is not getting safe for Jews in the UK., that former bastion of free speech.

Jews are not banned from the game. Away supporters are. Any jewish supporter of Villa is welcome to attend.

The ban is imposed by the police, and is due to lack of resources to handle a group of away supporters with a history of violence; Such bans are not uncommon in European football, which has a history of violent clashes between opposing groups of fans.

Personally, I think the decision by the police is a bad one, and that away fans should be permitted; But to spin their poor descision as a ban on Jews is unwarranted and untrue, and to imply that it is inspired by antisemitism is inflammatory and stupid.

Given the woeful state of the UK economy post-Brexit, and the insane austerity policies that followed, I am unsurprised that West Midlands Police feel incapable of handling the situation without extra funding, and this looks to me like a heavy-handed political move by the police to secure that funding.

 

[scombrid]

How scary that about 6% of the English and Wales population identify as Muslim.

It won’t take much more for the effects to really make changes. A declining birth rate in the natives coupled with a large birth rate of mulims and mass immigration will have consequences. You only need look at some larger cities in the UK and Europe where muslims are almost the majority. Birmingham and Bradford for example. Sharia courts everywhere, the wearing of the burqa, school curriculum being muslim friendly. muslims are not coming to Europe to integrate, they are coming to Europe to invade and conquer. It’s what islam does. A cursory look at the history of islam will relieve you of some of your ignorance, maybe.

Great replacement theory. Yep.

 

[scombrid]

Islam, unlike Judaism, has a great desire to make the entire world subservient to Islam.

Sure. Also, international Jewry is conspiring with the communists to undermine the German state, as evidenced by their betrayal of the fatherland in the Great War.

Or perhaps propaganda is a poor source of information about reality.

Or perhaps Derec is right. At the very least, there seems to be a huge disconnect between the actual facts of reality; how significant and rapid is the increase of muslim culture in Europe in general? Your side seems to be saying it is nothing but the other side says it is a dire concern. So right away there is the propaganda divide on both sides making a reasonable person not even knowing facts that should seem easily apparent. So lets see where this goes if your side is correct versus Derec's.

What if liberals are right and nothing is done? We would then expect the small community of Muslims to integrate nicely with European culture with no problems. But what if you are wrong? In that scenario, your liberal views are now a very distant memory of obsolescence being completely replaced by the (now) Islam women wearing sheets over their heads.

It should also be pointed out if Islam is about to take over, nothing short of a fascist (Trumpian) state would fix any of this anyway. Indeed the saving of Europe from Islam culture would only be saved if NATO would just allow Putin to take it over. Since Russia taking over Europe would be closer to the values to European values of today.

Yeah folks. Let Russia take over. Derp

 

[pood]

I note our pearl clutchers here over Islam have yet to address my posts about how the Muslim presence in NYC is working (quite well, thanks).

Hint: Don’t marginalize people and they won’t radicalize. Duh-oh!

 

[TSwizzle]

How scary that about 6% of the English and Wales population identify as Muslim.

It won’t take much more for the effects to really make changes. A declining birth rate in the natives coupled with a large birth rate of mulims and mass immigration will have consequences. You only need look at some larger cities in the UK and Europe where muslims are almost the majority. Birmingham and Bradford for example. Sharia courts everywhere, the wearing of the burqa, school curriculum being muslim friendly. muslims are not coming to Europe to integrate, they are coming to Europe to invade and conquer. It’s what islam does. A cursory look at the history of islam will relieve you of some of your ignorance, maybe.

Great replacement theory. Yep.

It’s not a theory when you can actually observe that it is happening.

 

[scombrid]

My Pakistani in-laws are far preferable to the Christofascists that are running the country. They are all liberal atheists that have completely rejected religion and fundamentalism. They are doctors and engineers that prefer the liberal multicultural west. So fuck Russia and fuck the fascists that are using any brown scapegoat that they can to support kleptocracy and white supremacy.