Flat-Earth Resurgence

[Jokodo]

Are all planets supposed to be flat, or just earth?

The Earth, being at the Centre of the Universe is of course Flat. Flat, sitting on four pillars with the Dome of the sky and the Sun, Moon and stars located above the Clouds.

You don't know that, this assumption shows you haven't fully shed the Globalist propaganda. Sometimes you can see the Sun or Moon despite cirrus clouds. This suggests that at least the Moon is below the higher clouds. The globalist explanation that the clouds are transparent *might* work for the Sun but the Moon's just not bright enough! That's a fact! Prove me wrong: Show an unambiguous example of moonlight penetrating clouds. You can't, as usual. So why do you believe it? Typical globehead!

I'm not making this up, though I'll admit that Poe's Law is a hard one with These Guys.

They manage to make Kent Hovind come across as a Voice of Reason. He seems to be getting a ton of mails along the lines of "did they brainwash you in jail so that you now spread their unbiblical propaganda?!" and deals with it quite reasonably, with ridicule. Though there are times he seems to insinuate a plot by atheists to make Christians Look stupid.

I guess what baffles him as much as me is how this became an actual trending topic in a certain demographic over the Last couple years. Any takes on that?

 

[Jokodo]

So where exactly is the end(s) of the earth, so one may go there and see it?

In Antrctica of course. Have you never wondered why they won't let you go there? You're so gullible!

 

[Jokodo]

Forget about getting them to try to wrap their heads around angles of distant bodies, what about the idea that many travellers, airline companies and all their staff would have to be in on the secret too. If they have a route that brings them back to their starting point, compasses would show only one general direction during their flights.

Oh, they have no problem with that. Some of them'll accuse *you* of being bought when you counter their claims. Because no-one can be that stupid as to still believe what they've been fed once shown the obvious truth. They too used to believe the lies, but once you see it, you know it.

Also flight routes: They tend to not know the difference between a globe and a Mercator map. A lot of flight routes in the northern hemisphere do make more sense with the polar azimuthal map they mostly use than with Mercator, so they even think they can score here!

 

[Loren Pechtel]

So where exactly is the end(s) of the earth, so one may go there and see it?

The secret died with my father.


(He was planning to write a book about our travels, To the Ends of the Earth. He never wrote it.)

 

[blastula]

Sorry for your loss. Did he fall off the edge?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

They just looked at the airlines. It's obviously a sham!

When we are going to the Far East the pilot heads west. Obviously something is up, we are being lied to about how the world is laid out!

They have a specific thing about airlines: They find that there are not all that many direct intercontinental flights between destinations on the southern hemisphere, and oftentimes when you search a connection between two points on the southern hemisphere, flight search agents will through up something going through a northern hemisphere hub. To them, that proves this is actually the most direct route, and the southern hemisphere is peripheral in a flat world centered around the north pole.

Actually, it's more than economics that limit southern hemisphere to southern hemisphere flights. The problem is those big oceans with a distinct lack of land--and therefore a lack of runways. Long flights in the southern hemisphere will go way south (just like long flights in the northern hemisphere go way north) but that's only allowed for the planes with the highest ETOPS ratings. Anything about ETOPS-180 requires special approval for the airport pair in question--and at ETOPS-180 a flat-earther flight from Johannesburg to Rio is going to have to deviate north a bit to remain legal. Likewise, Johannesburg to Sydney. Since the map I'm working from breaks on the date line I'm not sure what happens from Sydney to Rio but I don't think the flat-Earth version threads the needle in the South Pacific (and note that said needle only exists if two specific airports are open. If weather closes either the South Pacific is impassable to ETOPS-180) that exists under ETOPS-180. Of course the real-world great circle flights would head way south and that's not permitted.

 

[LordKiran]

Gravity is the biggest indicator. That gravity always pulls directly down no matter where you stand on the earth is the bigest indicator that the world is round, nothing else would make sense. If the world were flat on top and round on the botton, gravity would constantly continue to pull you into the center, meaning its effects would not be distributed evenly across an uneven surface. No math, just basic fucking sense. =/

NASA would like to have a word with you.

Gravity pulls almost straight down but not exactly. (The problem is a lot worse on the moon--and will bring down just about any satellite placed in lunar orbit. The lunar modules were abandoned in lunar orbit--and aren't there any more.)

Look all these technicalities are all well and good but they ignore my immediate point that there is no reason to think that dropping a ball from shoulder height will cause the ball to do anything other than fall strait towards the center of the planet regardless of where you are standing (except maybe on the top of a mountain but we're assuming for the sake of argument that gravity is the only force in play). I know that the gravity around our planet is subject to small fluctuations, for reasons including small fluctuations in the planet's shape (Oceans, mountains, canyons, ect.) among other things.

 

[DBT]

So where exactly is the end(s) of the earth, so one may go there and see it?

God as He sits upon his throne on the Dome of the sky sees you, like an insect below (unless it's cloudy, then there may be trouble) approaching the Great Gulf of the World confusing your mind into thinking you are going around the world when in reality you have been redirected back to whatever hell hole you came from. So you only imagine that you have traveled around the World. Such is the power of Yahweh.

 

[Jokodo]

They have a specific thing about airlines: They find that there are not all that many direct intercontinental flights between destinations on the southern hemisphere, and oftentimes when you search a connection between two points on the southern hemisphere, flight search agents will through up something going through a northern hemisphere hub. To them, that proves this is actually the most direct route, and the southern hemisphere is peripheral in a flat world centered around the north pole.

Actually, it's more than economics that limit southern hemisphere to southern hemisphere flights. The problem is those big oceans with a distinct lack of land--and therefore a lack of runways. Long flights in the southern hemisphere will go way south (just like long flights in the northern hemisphere go way north) but that's only allowed for the planes with the highest ETOPS ratings. Anything about ETOPS-180 requires special approval for the airport pair in question--and at ETOPS-180 a flat-earther flight from Johannesburg to Rio is going to have to deviate north a bit to remain legal. Likewise, Johannesburg to Sydney. Since the map I'm working from breaks on the date line I'm not sure what happens from Sydney to Rio but I don't think the flat-Earth version threads the needle in the South Pacific (and note that said needle only exists if two specific airports are open. If weather closes either the South Pacific is impassable to ETOPS-180) that exists under ETOPS-180. Of course the real-world great circle flights would head way south and that's not permitted.

I believe there are *some* great circle flights Sydney-Johannesburg.

At any rate, it's still to some degree economics: If Sydney-Johannesburg were anywhere near as popular a route as London-New York, they'd build and staff an airport at Kerguelen Islands with the sole purpose of providing an emergency landing site and save fuel.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Actually, it's more than economics that limit southern hemisphere to southern hemisphere flights. The problem is those big oceans with a distinct lack of land--and therefore a lack of runways. Long flights in the southern hemisphere will go way south (just like long flights in the northern hemisphere go way north) but that's only allowed for the planes with the highest ETOPS ratings. Anything about ETOPS-180 requires special approval for the airport pair in question--and at ETOPS-180 a flat-earther flight from Johannesburg to Rio is going to have to deviate north a bit to remain legal. Likewise, Johannesburg to Sydney. Since the map I'm working from breaks on the date line I'm not sure what happens from Sydney to Rio but I don't think the flat-Earth version threads the needle in the South Pacific (and note that said needle only exists if two specific airports are open. If weather closes either the South Pacific is impassable to ETOPS-180) that exists under ETOPS-180. Of course the real-world great circle flights would head way south and that's not permitted.

I believe there are *some* great circle flights Sydney-Johannesburg.

I believe there are some. The point is you have to obtain special authorization to go beyond ETOPS-180 and a true great circle flight down there requires I believe ETOPS-330. It's just one more hurdle to overcome.

At any rate, it's still to some degree economics: If Sydney-Johannesburg were anywhere near as popular a route as London-New York, they'd build and staff an airport at Kerguelen Islands with the sole purpose of providing an emergency landing site and save fuel.

Pretty nasty weather for a diversion base.

 

[Jokodo]

I believe there are *some* great circle flights Sydney-Johannesburg.

I believe there are some. The point is you have to obtain special authorization to go beyond ETOPS-180 and a true great circle flight down there requires I believe ETOPS-330. It's just one more hurdle to overcome.

At any rate, it's still to some degree economics: If Sydney-Johannesburg were anywhere near as popular a route as London-New York, they'd build and staff an airport at Kerguelen Islands with the sole purpose of providing an emergency landing site and save fuel.

Pretty nasty weather for a diversion base.

Doesn't Thule have Bad weather too?

 

[horhangi]

Oddly/curiously, I spent two days down this rabbit hole over the summer. These people are real and immune to reason. They are also not united or clear on what they agree on. I saw some who said nuclear weapons don't exist and there is a camp that says the apollo launches were attempts to create a hole in the firmament. Some say moon light is colder than moon shade, complete with videos showing their experiments with digital thermometers. Most seem to be fundamentalist believers and I suspect that those that are no openly fundamentalist believers, are.
The funniest thing is to see them ty to explain a lunar eclipse, they are fine with solar eclipses, but the moon, phases and eclipses leaves them stumped.
That these people exist causes me diametrically opposed feelings. Science education is needed, and as a science teacher, great. People are this stupid, is there any amount of teaching that can undo the stupid?

 

[rjh01]

Actually, it's more than economics that limit southern hemisphere to southern hemisphere flights. The problem is those big oceans with a distinct lack of land--and therefore a lack of runways. Long flights in the southern hemisphere will go way south (just like long flights in the northern hemisphere go way north) but that's only allowed for the planes with the highest ETOPS ratings. Anything about ETOPS-180 requires special approval for the airport pair in question--and at ETOPS-180 a flat-earther flight from Johannesburg to Rio is going to have to deviate north a bit to remain legal. Likewise, Johannesburg to Sydney. Since the map I'm working from breaks on the date line I'm not sure what happens from Sydney to Rio but I don't think the flat-Earth version threads the needle in the South Pacific (and note that said needle only exists if two specific airports are open. If weather closes either the South Pacific is impassable to ETOPS-180) that exists under ETOPS-180. Of course the real-world great circle flights would head way south and that's not permitted.

I believe there are *some* great circle flights Sydney-Johannesburg.

At any rate, it's still to some degree economics: If Sydney-Johannesburg were anywhere near as popular a route as London-New York, they'd build and staff an airport at Kerguelen Islands with the sole purpose of providing an emergency landing site and save fuel.

If the flat earthers were correct the shortest path between Sydney and Johannesburg would pass near the equator, if not go through it twice. It would not go anywhere near the South Pole.

 

[Jokodo]

I believe there are *some* great circle flights Sydney-Johannesburg.

At any rate, it's still to some degree economics: If Sydney-Johannesburg were anywhere near as popular a route as London-New York, they'd build and staff an airport at Kerguelen Islands with the sole purpose of providing an emergency landing site and save fuel.

If the flat earthers were correct the shortest path between Sydney and Johannesburg would pass near the equator, if not go through it twice. It would not go anywhere near the South Pole.

If the flat earthers were correct, the shortes path from Sydney to Johannesburg would go essentially over the whole length of China and even cut the southeastern tip of Iran before continuing over the Arabian peninsula and inland Eastern Africa.

It would also take about 50% longer than a direct flight from Europe or Northeast US to Sydney.

 

[skepticalbip]

If the flat earthers were correct the shortest path between Sydney and Johannesburg would pass near the equator, if not go through it twice. It would not go anywhere near the South Pole.

If the flat earthers were correct, the shortes path from Sydney to Johannesburg would go essentially over the whole length of China and even cut the southeastern tip of Iran before continuing over the Arabian peninsula and inland Eastern Africa.

It would also take about 50% longer than a direct flight from Europe or Northeast US to Sydney.

... and the shortest route between Buenos Aeries, Argentina and Sydney would be across the north pole - almost due north from Buenos Aeries to the pole then almost due south to Sydney.

 

[Kosh]

You see, when I was young... by the time you came out of High School you knew if you were smart, or if you weren't smart. You'd gotten the bad grades and realized your limitations. Or you'd gotten good grades, scored high on SAT, and had a chance to go to college.

Now though? You get these people, who somehow were flunkies but were never told.

I blame "participation awards".

And Dunning-Kroger.

 

[LordKiran]

You see, when I was young... by the time you came out of High School you knew if you were smart, or if you weren't smart. You'd gotten the bad grades and realized your limitations. Or you'd gotten good grades, scored high on SAT, and had a chance to go to college.

Now though? You get these people, who somehow were flunkies but were never told.

I blame "participation awards".

And Dunning-Kroger.

Tempting idea, but it doesn't account for all the people who buy into this who grew up well before the "Every child is special" age.

 

[Peez]

You see, when I was young... by the time you came out of High School you knew if you were smart, or if you weren't smart. You'd gotten the bad grades and realized your limitations. Or you'd gotten good grades, scored high on SAT, and had a chance to go to college.

Now though? You get these people, who somehow were flunkies but were never told.

I blame "participation awards".

And Dunning-Kroger.

Though I have sympathy for this point of view, and it is not entirely without merit, my grades in high school were none too impressive (failed a couple of courses, could not get into college on my first try) and I am now a university professor. There is a great deal more to grades than being "smart".

Peez

 

[Kosh]

Though I have sympathy for this point of view, and it is not entirely without merit, my grades in high school were none too impressive (failed a couple of courses, could not get into college on my first try) and I am now a university professor. There is a great deal more to grades than being "smart".

Peez

Excellent point Peez. We are actually dealing with this right now with my oldest son (24). We struggled just to get him to do homework through the lower schools (still graduated with a 3.7), and he actually got kicked out of community college. Not that he's isn't smart - he's actually quite intelligent as any 5 minute conversation with him will demonstrate - he simply won't engage.

His lack of concern about actually showing up to class or doing homework has been bewildering. He's just not that kind of learner.

I think he's finally gotten straightened out (back in college). Something about "in two more years, you can't even be on our insurance"...

 

[LordKiran]

Though I have sympathy for this point of view, and it is not entirely without merit, my grades in high school were none too impressive (failed a couple of courses, could not get into college on my first try) and I am now a university professor. There is a great deal more to grades than being "smart".

Peez

Excellent point Peez. We are actually dealing with this right now with my oldest son (24). We struggled just to get him to do homework through the lower schools (still graduated with a 3.7), and he actually got kicked out of community college. Not that he's isn't smart - he's actually quite intelligent as any 5 minute conversation with him will demonstrate - he simply won't engage.

His lack of concern about actually showing up to class or doing homework has been bewildering. He's just not that kind of learner.

I think he's finally gotten straightened out (back in college). Something about "in two more years, you can't even be on our insurance"...

Same situation with me. Not everyone is able or willing to go through the motions at the break-neck pace we expect from people. From pretty much the ages of 6 to 22 we expect people to sit down at a desk, read, write, and listen five days out of the week, every week and then after that, you get to find a job and start a career! Nobody ever gets a chance to just take a breath, stop and smell the roses and that sort of thing. I'm honestly surprised people don't crack under that kind of duress more often.