How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[aupmanyav]

Nuclear war would be a total disaster, even for survivors on the "winning" side.

If they are about similarly armed, like India and Pakistan. Otherwise the results can be different.

 

[zorq]

.. don't invite NATO scambags and you will have your country safe from russian "invasion".

That is correct. There was no need for a tilt and no need for a war.

Barbos has never justified his clams that Nuland ordered, demanded, or even suggested anything provocative regarding Ukraine with any evidence. I have asked him to show a shred of evidence many a time but His Nuland conspiracy theories exist purely outside the realm of physical reality. Ukraine kicked out a Putin puppet all by themselves. And they have the right to do that. And you think that justifies Russia murdering Ukraine's people and pillaging her resources. Why do you keep saying this?

A wife has a conversation with another man in the market and you defend the (ex-)husband for abusing her and breaking her arm? Because it is right to break the arm of a woman who dares to speak to someone other than her (ex-)husband? Because she should have expected this battery and abuse? She is condemned to remain perpetually subserviant to her abusive (ex-)husband if she wants her limbs to remain intact? And you want to shift all the blame to her and the guy she met in the market? WTF?

 

[bilby]

Nuclear war would be a total disaster, even for survivors on the "winning" side.

If they are about similarly armed, like India and Pakistan. Otherwise the results can be different.

Different how?

If New Delhi were hit by a nuclear weapon, how different would your experience be if it were a Chinese, Russian, American or French weapon, compared with a Pakistani one?

Are you hoping to catch a glimpse of the flag painted on the warhead just before it detonates?

Dead is dead. Burned is burned. Radiation sickness is radiation sickness. A pile of rubble is not a home, no matter how it became rubble.

You won't feel any better about watching your family die, even if you believe that some Pakistanis are simultaneously experiencing the same horror.

 

[aupmanyav]

Other nations do not have that strength, and must seek alliances.

That is where Ukraine made a mistake. After removing Yukowych, they could have elected a moderate, and not someone like Poroshenko who started with the mantra "armiia, mova, vira (English: military, language, faith)" (Poroshenko). Then, they erred in electing Zelensky who embroiled them in this long war. The world is still divided into 'spheres of influence'.
May be Putin has heard Modi's call, but Ukraine also has to come around it. Otherwise the war will continue, and I do not know how will it finally end.

 

[barbos]

Barbos has never justified his clams that Nuland ordered, demanded,

Sure, and Biden never promised to blow up Nord Stream.

 

[bilby]

Other nations do not have that strength, and must seek alliances.

That is where Ukraine made a mistake. After removing Yukowych, they could have elected a moderate, and not someone like Poroshenko who started with the mantra "armiia, mova, vira (English: military, language, faith)" (Poroshenko).

Anyone they elected would either have triggered war, or invited Russia to take over without a fight.

Putting Quisling in charge didn't protect Norway from the Nazis; It is obviously ideal to remain free without a fight, but that option was never on the table.

The choices for Ukraine were (and remain): Fight, and hope to win, but risk defeat; Or don't fight, and be defeated for certain.

Then, they erred in electing Zelensky who embroiled them in this long war.

When the alternatives were to lose a short war, or to lose without even fighting back, that was a smart move.

The world is still divided into 'spheres of influence'.

But not at the sole discretion of the imperial powers.

May be Putin has heard Modi's call, but Ukraine also has to come around it.

Ukraine didn't want to fight at all. They didn't invade Russia, Russia invaded them. So what would them "hearing Modi's call" look like, that isn't capitulation?

Otherwise the war will continue, and I do not know how will it finally end.

Mate, you say you are in your eighties. You seriously don't have time to start listing all the things you don't know about this situation.

 

[barbos]

I have asked him to show a shred of evidence

That's rich coming from someone who failed to provide a shred of evidence for his theories, like Putin will invade Europe if he wins in Ukraine.
And yes, I have provided plenty of evidence for my theories, latest one being conference in Poland where they openly discussed splitting Russia into 5 parts and then pillaging its resources.

 

[aupmanyav]

If New Delhi were hit by a nuclear weapon, how different would your experience be if it were a Chinese, Russian, American or French weapon, compared with a Pakistani one?

A hit in Delhi will not hurt India as much as a hit in Kyiv in Ukraine with no power to retaliate. India will regroup and retaliate more easily.
Although I do not like concentration of all government offices and policy-makers in Delhi within a distance of 5 kms. They should distribute them all around India, so that one hit does not destroy everything. I do not know if government of India keeps this in view or not.
My living or dying does not matter. I am just one of the 1442+ million in India.

 

[barbos]

Ukraine didn't want to fight at all. They didn't invade Russia, Russia invaded them.

Vietnam, Yugoslavia, Iraq, Libya, Panama, Grenada, Cuba invaded US?
Your "Russia invaded Ukraine" is getting tiresome. Yes, we invaded these motherfuckers and I am proud of it!
We should have invaded that scum country long time ago.
I don't give a shit what EU and US nazi regimes think about Russia. EU/US started this war.

 

[barbos]

Regarding India and China, they both need Russia to deal with each other. And they both need Russia the way it is now, not the way US neocon fascists want it.
China especially does not want US land forces on its northern border. And India needs counterweight to China in BRICS.
However, Russia-India trade is a mess, they need to solve it, cause right now Russia sends oil to India essentially for free.
India simply does not have anything to sell to Russia. I think BRICS currency is a necessity now. Indian rupee is not convertible.

LOL, I checked it's rate. It's pretty much equal to russian ruble. 1 indian rupee = 1.06 Russian Ruble.
That can not be a coincidence
I think India and Russia as well should try to be more like China economy wise.
Russia should actively reduce gas-oil dependency way more than it is now. I mean it's been reducing but it should be pretty much insignificant in my view.

 

[barbos]

Even Ukro-regime is seeing writing on the wall. I recently watched an ukrainian political show.
Doom and gloom is apparent.

 

[zorq]

Barbos has never justified his clams that Nuland ordered, demanded,

Sure,

I'm glad we agree. You have never given any evidence.

and Biden never promised to blow up Nord Stream.

True. Yes. He never promised to "BLOW UP" Nord Stream. Biden promised to "Put an end to it." We completely agree here. Good job! Thanks for agreeing that your conspiracy theories are completely unsupported by physical evidence.

 

[barbos]

True. Yes. He never promised to "BLOW UP" Nord Stream. Biden promised to "Put an end to it."

Cool, show me Putin promising to invade other EU countries after Ukraine?
And Biden did promise to promise to commit and an act of war and then commited it.
I am not a lawyer but I think it's against US laws where US Congress is the one who declares wars.

 

[barbos]

Speaking of doom and gloom in Ukraine. One thing I noticed watching these ukrainian shows is a confirmation of ukrainian stereotypes. Ukrainians have this reputation in Russia as people who are "short-sighted" and unsophisticated who are, nevertheless, clever. But overall, they are not interested in anything beyond stuff which directly affects them. If you want US analogy they are republicans or better trumpers as opposed to russians who are democrats.
They themselves even have a word for it "selyuk". It's like "redneck" but still more negative. Its literal meaning is "villager".

Anyway, that's a trait which does not serve them well. They can be easily manipulated into doing shit like what we have now.
And historically, it's not the first time they do that. They have been doing that shit for a long time.s. Compare them to Georgians. They learned their lesson pretty quickly.
Ukrainians can not govern themselves, it's better for them to be in Russia again.