How should west respond to Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[Loren Pechtel]

One of your problems is that you don't understand international law. According to the UN charter, a state may use force only when authorized by UN security council or in self-defense against an armed attack. There was no Ukrainian attack on Russian land. Just as Israel was not part of the US and Crimea was not part of Russia, neither attack was legal.

Disagree on Iran. It is standardly accepted that a country may join a war against a friend even in the absence of a defense treaty.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Crimea re-became Russia in 2014 and illegal regime in Kiev attacked it immediately.
You can argue about Eastern Ukraine but Crimea absolutely had a right to have a referendum to leave Ukraine. So It was Ukraine who attacked Russia.
Also I don't remember you protesting against NATO aggression (Yugoslavia, Libya, Iraq)
Also both Maidans (2004 and 2014) in Ukraine were a western aggression.

The world understood that your "referendum" was bogus. Status quo ante wasn't on the ballot--because you knew that's what people would have voted for. And you brought in a whole bunch of voters.

 

[Arctish]

One of your problems is that you don't understand international law. According to the UN charter, a state may use force only when authorized by UN security council or in self-defense against an armed attack. There was no Ukrainian attack on Russian land. Just as Israel was not part of the US and Crimea was not part of Russia, neither attack was legal.

Disagree on Iran. It is standardly accepted that a country may join a war against a friend even in the absence of a defense treaty.

When did Israel declared war on Iran?

When did Iran declare war on Israel?

 

[barbos]

Crimea re-became Russia in 2014 and illegal regime in Kiev attacked it immediately.
You can argue about Eastern Ukraine but Crimea absolutely had a right to have a referendum to leave Ukraine. So It was Ukraine who attacked Russia.
Also I don't remember you protesting against NATO aggression (Yugoslavia, Libya, Iraq)
Also both Maidans (2004 and 2014) in Ukraine were a western aggression.

The world understood that your "referendum" was bogus.

You are not the world

 

[ZiprHead]

Crimea re-became Russia in 2014 and illegal regime in Kiev attacked it immediately.
You can argue about Eastern Ukraine but Crimea absolutely had a right to have a referendum to leave Ukraine. So It was Ukraine who attacked Russia.
Also I don't remember you protesting against NATO aggression (Yugoslavia, Libya, Iraq)
Also both Maidans (2004 and 2014) in Ukraine were a western aggression.

The world understood that your "referendum" was bogus.

You are not the world

As much as you want it to be, neither are you.

 

[barbos]

Real world politics: if you strike manufacturing in a foreign country you just went to war with that foreign country. Thus it is not done. We bent over backwards to avoid hitting Russians in Vietnam.

Vietnam have never attacked US. Whereas Nazi scum in Kiev attacked Russia, using western weapons and intelligence data. We, of course, returned the favor in Iran somewhat but that was limited only to Iranian defense. Iran is not attacking civilian targets in US proper.

A communist puppet state attacked US forces that were in the country by permission of it's government.

And no attack on Russia happened before your attack of 2014.

LOL
Puppet Nazi regime attcked Russian forces that were in the Crimea by permission of proper Ukrainian government.

You are fucking hilarious.

 

[barbos]

And no attack on Russia happened before your attack of 2014.

It was not an attack. Russia politely asked ukro-army to get out and they complied.

 

[barbos]

Crimea re-became Russia in 2014 and illegal regime in Kiev attacked it immediately.
You can argue about Eastern Ukraine but Crimea absolutely had a right to have a referendum to leave Ukraine. So It was Ukraine who attacked Russia.
Also I don't remember you protesting against NATO aggression (Yugoslavia, Libya, Iraq)
Also both Maidans (2004 and 2014) in Ukraine were a western aggression.

The world understood that your "referendum" was bogus.

You are not the world

As much as you want it to be, neither are you.

The World does not need to get involved. Crimeans voted and and got back to Russia.

 

[barbos]

Yeah, Russia hasn't launched thousands of drones and missiles on the Ukrainian civilian population just over the last couple of months.

No, we have not. Unlike US in Iran with their unprovoked agression against people of Iran, Russia strikes exclusively military targets.

Unprovoked??

You have a serious problem of not recognizing indirect attacks as attacks.

Oh really? It's me who does not recognize indirect attacks?
You fucking indirectly attack Russia constantly.
Georgia, Ukraine, Armenia.

Look a few posts up, my post about peaceful coexistence with western powers. Look how badly Iran has violated that: attacking our friends, perpetrating genocides that kill millions. Look at their "Axis of Resistance"--that's Iran + Iranian-controlled puppets. They're admitting what they're doing. None of the other members got there peacefully.

Utter bullshit and lies. You fucking indirectly attacked Iran in 1979 using chemical weapons.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Russia is suffering something like 35,000 casualties a month

why not 350,000?

How do you explain body exchange ratio 1000 ukrainian dead to something like 20 russians?
And yes that ratio is real and admitted by the ukrainian side.

Most Russians are dying to drone strikes in Russian territory. Ukraine isn't going to be recovering very many Russian bodies.

 

[barbos]

Fiber-optic drones more expensive than radio-link ones. But they provide high resolution jam-free picture for hunting military targets on the battlefield.
Only deranged idiot would believe they make good tool for terrorizing civilians. Russia can terrorize civilians less expensively just fine. But we don't terrorize civilians, ukrainian army does.

The problem is one of metrics. Russian drones are supposed to kill Ukranian troops, but they are hard to find. Civilians are much easier to find. Thus you get drone operators hitting civilians in order to look good to command.

More telling is the kid's response: look for the guideline, count to 15.

Entirely sensible battlefield instructions--given to a civilian. You don't train civilians in how to deal with military threats unless you expect them to face such threats. An untrained civilian might very well recognize to go for the guideline, but a count of 15 for a safety parameter is training.

Wow, what a bullshit.
And what part of "story is a complete fiction" you do not not understand?
You are fucking clueless, more clueless the the rest of the usual suspects here.

 

[barbos]

Crimea re-became Russia in 2014

"re-became". Boy if that ain't some Orwellian newspeak bullshit.

To be fair they have never been "Ukraine".

In other news, Estonia shot down an ukrainina drone
Whether he was lost or not is not reported.
Elensky must be mad at Estonia now.

Or you could read up on what actually happened.

Hmmm, exactly what I said.

 

[pood]

Fiber-optic drones more expensive than radio-link ones. But they provide high resolution jam-free picture for hunting military targets on the battlefield.
Only deranged idiot would believe they make good tool for terrorizing civilians. Russia can terrorize civilians less expensively just fine. But we don't terrorize civilians, ukrainian army does.

The problem is one of metrics. Russian drones are supposed to kill Ukranian troops, but they are hard to find. Civilians are much easier to find. Thus you get drone operators hitting civilians in order to look good to command.

More telling is the kid's response: look for the guideline, count to 15.

Entirely sensible battlefield instructions--given to a civilian. You don't train civilians in how to deal with military threats unless you expect them to face such threats. An untrained civilian might very well recognize to go for the guideline, but a count of 15 for a safety parameter is training.

Wow, what a bullshit.
And what part of "story is a complete fiction" you do not not understand?
You are fucking clueless, more clueless the the rest of the usual suspects here.

Freaking out over Adolf Putin’s massive strategic failure in Ukraine, are we?

 

[barbos]

You people have no clue how much brain-washing Regime in Kiev does.
no fucking clue.

 

[barbos]

Fiber-optic drones more expensive than radio-link ones. But they provide high resolution jam-free picture for hunting military targets on the battlefield.
Only deranged idiot would believe they make good tool for terrorizing civilians. Russia can terrorize civilians less expensively just fine. But we don't terrorize civilians, ukrainian army does.

The problem is one of metrics. Russian drones are supposed to kill Ukranian troops, but they are hard to find. Civilians are much easier to find. Thus you get drone operators hitting civilians in order to look good to command.

More telling is the kid's response: look for the guideline, count to 15.

Entirely sensible battlefield instructions--given to a civilian. You don't train civilians in how to deal with military threats unless you expect them to face such threats. An untrained civilian might very well recognize to go for the guideline, but a count of 15 for a safety parameter is training.

Wow, what a bullshit.
And what part of "story is a complete fiction" you do not not understand?
You are fucking clueless, more clueless the the rest of the usual suspects here.

Freaking out over Adolf Putin’s massive strategic failure in Ukraine, are we?

No. I am not. You are projecting.
You were sure Russia will fall after Kherson counteroffensive, remember that?

 

[barbos]

Western Media simply repost every lie coming from Regime in Kiev knowing damn well that it is a lie.
And idiots believe all of that, after all, it's CNN!

 

[barbos]

Meanwhile, Kiev Regime (more specifically Elensky himself) continues assassination campaign on his opponents in Europe. The plot has been foiled by the target (Sharij) himself when someone in SBU warned him about it. Spanish Police has everything and Sharij dumped all the info. That's quite a watch I have to say. It was a second attempt on his life by Kiev Regime, the first one was fiasco but Spanish Police was not on top of it to say the least. This one Sharij is quite satisfied with the spanish police.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

One of your problems is that you don't understand international law. According to the UN charter, a state may use force only when authorized by UN security council or in self-defense against an armed attack. There was no Ukrainian attack on Russian land. Just as Israel was not part of the US and Crimea was not part of Russia, neither attack was legal.

Disagree on Iran. It is standardly accepted that a country may join a war against a friend even in the absence of a defense treaty.

When did Israel declared war on Iran?

When did Iran declare war on Israel?

Wars are generally not declared these days.

Israel hit Hezbollah targets, killed some Iranian guy. Iran attacked Israel. That's a de-facto war.

 

[barbos]

Wars are generally not declared these days.

US are the master of that.
Just look at the intro of Judge Napolitano youtubes

 

[barbos]

One can argue about internal policies of Iranian regime. You can even argue about internal policies of Russian "Regime". But it should be quite obvious that it is the West and more specifically US who is the aggressor in all cases.

US does not care (and never did) whether or not you are democracy (Arab states are not democracies) all it cares about is control and bending to their will. Iran is a Democracy, specific one at that but it is a democracy, certainly compared to UAE and SA.