If god asked you to...

[steve_bank]

Christians commonly say god speaks to them.

What if he asked you to kill your firstborn? What if asked you to go to North Korea and hand out bibles?

 

[Learner]

Do you mean IF its not an halucination (therefore God is real in this case... not that I'd expect HIM to ask anyway) ? Second one is easier of course to the first. I could perhaps do it IF I had no dependents and ... pray for a little more courage .

 

[Ford]

No.

If god were actually a thing, he (or she, or it) would not have to ask. "God" would simply reach into my mind and reprogram it so that I would do whatever "he" wanted me to do.

Left to my own devices, I would refuse to kill my "first born" (I just have the one) and "God" can fuck right off.

 

[Learner]

No.

If god were actually a thing, he (or she, or it) would not have to ask. "God" would simply reach into my mind and reprogram it so that I would do whatever "he" wanted me to do.

Left to my own devices, I would refuse to kill my "first born" (I just have the one) and "God" can fuck right off.

Well , by this thought experiment shall we say: you certainly can't test an individual's independent mind e.g. loyalty or devotion. If you were to reprogram a mind according to your own lonely existence, this would be rather pointless .

Left to our own devices , Theists choose pro-life.

 

[skepticalbip]

Do you mean IF its not an halucination (therefore God is real in this case... not that I'd expect HIM to ask anyway) ? Second one is easier of course to the first. I could perhaps do it IF I had no dependents and ... pray for a little more courage .

You didn't actually answer the first question. But you did introduce another interesting question. If you really believe in God and he appeared to you (however you think he would appear) and told you to kill your firstborn, how would you know if it was an hallucination you could ignore or if it was God that will punish you with hell if you disobey? Then would you kill your firstborn or risk and accept eternity in hell for defying your God?

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

No.

If god were actually a thing, he (or she, or it) would not have to ask. "God" would simply reach into my mind and reprogram it so that I would do whatever "he" wanted me to do.

Left to my own devices, I would refuse to kill my "first born" (I just have the one) and "God" can fuck right off.

Well , by this thought experiment shall we say: you certainly can't test an individual's independent mind e.g. loyalty or devotion. If you were to reprogram a mind according to your own lonely existence, this would be rather pointless .

Left to our own devices , Theists choose pro-life.

Refusing your directive from your phantasm is to make a rational choice that your phantasm is not real. Now if you had decided to actually do the dirty work such as many do because they are saving their families from these strange creatures, you are professing your belief that these things are real.

It's worth remembering that the craziest of crazies are few and far between owing to natural selection. They come along now and then because Ma Nature is always serving up new recipes, but they never become numerous. Schizophrenia is not so good for survival.

 

[Politesse]

Christians commonly say god speaks to them.

What if he asked you to kill your firstborn? What if asked you to go to North Korea and hand out bibles?

My experience with such phenomena is that what you think you would do if asked ahead of time is not necessarily an accurate guide to what you would actually do in the situation. I find both of those ideas morally abhorrent, as described and with my current inclinations, but then God hasn't made any attempt to induce me to do them. It seems to me that if an omnipotent being exists, it probably does not struggle to talk people into things, else what good is omnipotence?

 

[Rhea]

Well , by this thought experiment shall we say: you certainly can't test an individual's independent mind e.g. loyalty or devotion. .

Clarifying question:
Why does a god that knows everything EVER need to test anyone?

 

[Keith&Co.]

Christians commonly say god speaks to them.

What if he asked you to kill your firstborn? What if asked you to go to North Korea and hand out bibles?

I watched Kingsman. I would not have shot my dog.

I have seen a number of time-travel/kill Hitler in his crib stories. I would not kill Baby Hitler.

My self image is not one of a person who kills dogs or babies. So no matter the argument aboute the necessity of dead dog, dead baby... i would tend to think that even if a god demanded something out of character for me, i would reject.

On the other hand, the voice in my head doesn't need to be or even claim divinity if it's IN character. I have used 'wanted to see what would happen' because "voices in my head" was not advantageous for my security clearance....

Also, s8nce i feel god is most likely an invention of the believer, his/her god isn't going to ask them anything they're not already disposed to do.

Pick a fight, go to war, fuck your brother's widow, go bomb a clinic, vote for Trump... all stuff that the voice only validates, they already decided internally.


Which makes the story of Abraham and Isaac monstrous....

 

[Learner]

Do you mean IF its not an halucination (therefore God is real in this case... not that I'd expect HIM to ask anyway) ? Second one is easier of course to the first. I could perhaps do it IF I had no dependents and ... pray for a little more courage .

You didn't actually answer the first question. But you did introduce another interesting question. If you really believe in God and he appeared to you (however you think he would appear) and told you to kill your firstborn, how would you know if it was an hallucination you could ignore or if it was God that will punish you with hell if you disobey? Then would you kill your firstborn or risk and accept eternity in hell for defying your God?

Its not so simple a question to answer but I'd say yes (but only or more likely If ... it were during the times before the 10 commandments and of course ; before the arrival of Jesus and HIS teachings).

To be clear , anyone hearing voices to kill their first born, especially today after the scripture is already set out (a fail-safe if you will) : is either being fooled or is halucinating!! Other faiths / gods may differ according to the beliefs, obviously .

 

[steve_bank]

Christians commonly say god speaks to them.

What if he asked you to kill your firstborn? What if asked you to go to North Korea and hand out bibles?

My experience with such phenomena is that what you think you would do if asked ahead of time is not necessarily an accurate guide to what you would actually do in the situation. I find both of those ideas morally abhorrent, as described and with my current inclinations, but then God hasn't made any attempt to induce me to do them. It seems to me that if an omnipotent being exists, it probably does not struggle to talk people into things, else what good is omnipotence?

Then you reject the bible. God talks to people, or they think he does. God tells Mother Teresa to help the absolute lowest people in India and she is a saint.

God tells someone to kill prostitutes to purge veil from the world and he or she is a murderer.

Both cases have biblical antecedents.

I sat next to a Jew on a jet. He put a small block with symbols on his forehead and covered his head with a cloth. He told me he was commung with god.

I was invited to a private evangelical meeting of about 2o people. People having visions and the like. To Christians god is real and tangible. If you do not believe that then you are not Christian, at least by the bible.

In the RCC one believes on morality the pope speaks for god. Instead of a Bat Phone he has a God Phone. Excuse me cardinal Jones, the red light is flashing on t3e god phone.

The question posed in the OP is not trivial. The Law And Order show touched on the issue of civil law and religious freedom. God told me to do it, I was on a mission from god dealing with immorality and evil as a defense.

Christians transform scripture into 'god tells me to do this'.

 

[Learner]

Clarifying question:
Why does a god that knows everything EVER need to test anyone?

Who says God needs to test anyone for "Himself" while knowing everything . Testing only seems to be appear were Satan or other is concerned.

 

[Politesse]

Christians commonly say god speaks to them.

What if he asked you to kill your firstborn? What if asked you to go to North Korea and hand out bibles?

My experience with such phenomena is that what you think you would do if asked ahead of time is not necessarily an accurate guide to what you would actually do in the situation. I find both of those ideas morally abhorrent, as described and with my current inclinations, but then God hasn't made any attempt to induce me to do them. It seems to me that if an omnipotent being exists, it probably does not struggle to talk people into things, else what good is omnipotence?

Then you reject the bible. God talks to people, or they think he does. God tells Mother Teresa to help the absolute lowest people in India and she is a saint.

God tells someone to kill prostitutes to purge veil from the world and he or she is a murderer.

Both cases have biblical antecedents.

I sat next to a Jew on a jet. He put a small block with symbols on his forehead and covered his head with a cloth. He told me he was commung with god.

I was invited to a private evangelical meeting of about 2o people. People having visions and the like. To Christians god is real and tangible. If you do not believe that then you are not Christian, at least by the bible.

In the RCC one believes on morality the pope speaks for god. Instead of a Bat Phone he has a God Phone. Excuse me cardinal Jones, the red light is flashing on t3e god phone.

The question posed in the OP is not trivial. The Law And Order show touched on the issue of civil law and religious freedom. God told me to do it, I was on a mission from god dealing with immorality and evil as a defense.

Christians transform scripture into 'god tells me to do this'.

Okay! I'm not a Christian then. Glad that's settled.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Andrea Yates: drowns her 5 children, (at least partly) because she claimed they were 'unrighteous' and were bound for the hellfire. Evaluation: delusional, pitiable, needs to be confined in mental hospital.
Abraham: All set to gut his tied-up son with a knife when God yells, "Punked!" Evaluation: a true hero, symbol of profound faith in a righteous God, the creator of us all.
On a related note, see: the Hitler/Joshua Paradigm

 

[steve_bank]

Then you reject the bible. God talks to people, or they think he does. God tells Mother Teresa to help the absolute lowest people in India and she is a saint.

God tells someone to kill prostitutes to purge veil from the world and he or she is a murderer.

Both cases have biblical antecedents.

I sat next to a Jew on a jet. He put a small block with symbols on his forehead and covered his head with a cloth. He told me he was commung with god.

I was invited to a private evangelical meeting of about 2o people. People having visions and the like. To Christians god is real and tangible. If you do not believe that then you are not Christian, at least by the bible.

In the RCC one believes on morality the pope speaks for god. Instead of a Bat Phone he has a God Phone. Excuse me cardinal Jones, the red light is flashing on t3e god phone.

The question posed in the OP is not trivial. The Law And Order show touched on the issue of civil law and religious freedom. God told me to do it, I was on a mission from god dealing with immorality and evil as a defense.

Christians transform scripture into 'god tells me to do this'.

Okay! I'm not a Christian then. Glad that's settled.

Then what on God's Green Earth are you? There are many labels to choose from. Or invent your own.

 

[Politesse]

Then you reject the bible. God talks to people, or they think he does. God tells Mother Teresa to help the absolute lowest people in India and she is a saint.

God tells someone to kill prostitutes to purge veil from the world and he or she is a murderer.

Both cases have biblical antecedents.

I sat next to a Jew on a jet. He put a small block with symbols on his forehead and covered his head with a cloth. He told me he was commung with god.

I was invited to a private evangelical meeting of about 2o people. People having visions and the like. To Christians god is real and tangible. If you do not believe that then you are not Christian, at least by the bible.

In the RCC one believes on morality the pope speaks for god. Instead of a Bat Phone he has a God Phone. Excuse me cardinal Jones, the red light is flashing on t3e god phone.

The question posed in the OP is not trivial. The Law And Order show touched on the issue of civil law and religious freedom. God told me to do it, I was on a mission from god dealing with immorality and evil as a defense.

Christians transform scripture into 'god tells me to do this'.

Okay! I'm not a Christian then. Glad that's settled.

Then what on God's Green Earth are you? There are many labels to choose from. Or invent your own.

Well, you tell me! You seem to be the expert.

 

[steve_bank]

Sorry, I am not a teacher or guru. If I were I would require you to hand over all your positions, shave your head, and tend to my needs for 20 years or so before we could even begin.

Other than that step out on the journey of self discovery. Or find a teacher. There are reparable and authentic Zen, yoga, Buddhist and other groups around . Whatever floats your boat. For some people it is math or gardening or chess.

An old BC cartoon. Wiley climbs hand over foot up a mountain peak. On the top is sitting a guru. Wiley asks 'What is the meaning of life?'.

Guru replies 'Why should I tell you?'

 

[Politesse]

Sorry, I am not a teacher or guru. If I were I would require you to hand over all your positions, shave your head, and tend to my needs for 20 years or so before we could even begin.

Other than that step out on the journey of self discovery. Or find a teacher. There are reparable and authentic Zen, yoga, Buddhist and other groups around . Whatever floats your boat. For some people it is math or gardening or chess.

An old BC cartoon. Wiley climbs hand over foot up a mountain peak. On the top is sitting a guru. Wiley asks 'What is the meaning of life?'.

Guru replies 'Why should I tell you?'

You seem to be laboring under the delusion that I am the one who is confused.

 

[steve_bank]

Sorry, I am not a teacher or guru. If I were I would require you to hand over all your positions, shave your head, and tend to my needs for 20 years or so before we could even begin.

Other than that step out on the journey of self discovery. Or find a teacher. There are reparable and authentic Zen, yoga, Buddhist and other groups around . Whatever floats your boat. For some people it is math or gardening or chess.

An old BC cartoon. Wiley climbs hand over foot up a mountain peak. On the top is sitting a guru. Wiley asks 'What is the meaning of life?'.

Guru replies 'Why should I tell you?'

You seem to be laboring under the delusion that I am the one who is confused.

You win, you are superior to me.

 

[skepticalbip]

Sorry, I am not a teacher or guru. If I were I would require you to hand over all your positions, shave your head, and tend to my needs for 20 years or so before we could even begin.

Other than that step out on the journey of self discovery. Or find a teacher. There are reparable and authentic Zen, yoga, Buddhist and other groups around . Whatever floats your boat. For some people it is math or gardening or chess.

An old BC cartoon. Wiley climbs hand over foot up a mountain peak. On the top is sitting a guru. Wiley asks 'What is the meaning of life?'.

Guru replies 'Why should I tell you?'

You seem to be laboring under the delusion that I am the one who is confused.

You win, you are superior to me.

How could that be? Politesse continually claims to know and understand nothing.