A customer is not somebody you steal from.
The dictatorial arrangement in business is strictly for theft. It has no other purpose.
Your definition of theft is very funny, but the same thing can be applied to me buying anything. If the right price of a hamburger is really $.79 cents and McD is charging $.99 then they are stealing 20 cents from me. If it's really $1.09 then I am stealing ten cents from McDonalds.
The agreement between employer and employee is the mutual decision, there is no right price.
Your definition of theft is very funny, but the same thing can be applied to me buying anything. If the right price of a hamburger is really $.79 cents and McD is charging $.99 then they are stealing 20 cents from me. If it's really $1.09 then I am stealing ten cents from McDonalds.
The agreement between employer and employee is the mutual decision, there is no right price.
Theft is when you take the fruits of labor and pay a "market wage" for them. You have to take control of the fruits of labor, take it away from the workers creating those fruits, to do this. Not buy the fruits as a customer.
And you need a dictatorship to do this. It couldn't happen in an open democratic workplace.
Theft is when you take the fruits of labor and pay a "market wage" for them. You have to take control of the fruits of labor, take it away from the workers creating those fruits, to do this. Not buy the fruits as a customer.
And you need a dictatorship to do this. It couldn't happen in an open democratic workplace.
Have you thought about taking your comedy routing on the road? Of course they would. The only time it wouldn't happen is a solo business.
Have you thought about taking your comedy routing on the road? Of course they would. The only time it wouldn't happen is a solo business.
So you have given up defending dictatorship in the workplace and are trying to weasel away?
So when that plumber comes to your house and says, "hey it will take 2 hours to fix the problem but I am going to charge you for 4 because the 2nd two hours I want to use your internet and watch porn" You'll say "yes"?
You're not discussing the workplace situation of most people.
You are discussing an individual worker out on their own. And it is not possible to steal the fruits of the individual worker out on their own. They get all the fruits, as it should be.
I am discussing conditions of the workplace, a dictatorial hierarchy, where those at the top, due to their power within the organization, steal the fruits of labor from workers and replace it with a "market wage" IOW the lowest possible price.
Your strawman arguments are an evasion from this immorality. Almost a defense of it.
So what accounting method do you use when you determine if profit is theft? GAAP, cash, or another form?
So you have given up defending dictatorship in the workplace and are trying to weasel away?
No. But you have incredible weird reasoning so nothing will change it. We've said numerous times, go start your own democratically run company. Have you yet?
No. But you have incredible weird reasoning so nothing will change it. We've said numerous times, go start your own democratically run company. Have you yet?
You won't address arguments, that is all.
If Nike sells a pair of shoes for $150 and it pays the labor that made those shoes $2, most likely less, then theft has occurred.
It is clear to some and impossible for some to see.
You won't address arguments, that is all.
If Nike sells a pair of shoes for $150 and it pays the labor that made those shoes $2, most likely less, then theft has occurred.
It is clear to some and impossible for some to see.
It costs more than the $2 to pay for the shoes. They aren't making $148 each show. They are paying other labor too, plus materials, plus shipping etc. If a company isn't turning a profit, are workers stealing from a company?
It costs more than the $2 to pay for the shoes. They aren't making $148 each show. They are paying other labor too, plus materials, plus shipping etc. If a company isn't turning a profit, are workers stealing from a company?
This is diversion. Once again.
I know you want to equate human labor with a piece of leather.
Yes materials and tools cost money.
All paid for by stealing from labor.
This is diversion. Once again.
I know you want to equate human labor with a piece of leather.
Yes materials and tools cost money.
All paid for by stealing from labor.
No I am not. If you and I agree that I pay you $2 an hour to make shoes it's not stealing.
Your system can't tell who is stealing from him even under the weirdest definition of stealing.
Let's take your example
$150 shoe
$2 shoe labor
$25 shipping costs
$25 marketing
$25 distribution
$25 engineers
So that makes $48 profit and that's high.
So who is the one being stolen from? Any of those groups can be. Or if Nike is price it at $150 and it's really $102 then it's the customer being stole from.
No I am not. If you and I agree that I pay you $2 an hour to make shoes it's not stealing.
Your system can't tell who is stealing from him even under the weirdest definition of stealing.
Let's take your example
$150 shoe
$2 shoe labor
$25 shipping costs
$25 marketing
$25 distribution
$25 engineers
So that makes $48 profit and that's high.
So who is the one being stolen from? Any of those groups can be. Or if Nike is price it at $150 and it's really $102 then it's the customer being stole from.
Profit IS theft.
If it is taken by a few dictators and they decide what to do with it.
If all the people involved in the making and selling of the shoes, by some democratic process, decide what to do with profit and how much profit is to be made, then that is not theft.
It is no different from dictatorship in government.
If a few dictators in government make all the rules that is not a good thing.
Why one can be clearly seen and the other is invisible is the result of careful indoctrination.
Profit IS theft.
If it is taken by a few dictators and they decide what to do with it.
If all the people involved in the making and selling of the shoes, by some democratic process, decide what to do with profit and how much profit is to be made, then that is not theft.
It is no different from dictatorship in government.
If a few dictators in government make all the rules that is not a good thing.
Why one can be clearly seen and the other is invisible is the result of careful indoctrination.
And there are people who think any type of sexual activity is rape. Consensual sex isn't rape they same way consensual trade between people isn't theft.
And there are people who think any type of sexual activity is rape. Consensual sex isn't rape they same way consensual trade between people isn't theft.
The worker consents only by necessity. That is a form of coercion.
There is no other reasonable choice than to consent to some dictatorship or another for many people.
This is why when capitalists control the government they try to degrade social services as much as possible.
They want helpless slaves, not people with options.
The worker consents only by necessity. That is a form of coercion.
There is no other reasonable choice than to consent to some dictatorship or another for many people.
This is why when capitalists control the government they try to degrade social services as much as possible.
They want helpless slaves, not people with options.
And absolutely nothing has stopped you from starting a democratic controlled company, but you haven't done it. Why not?
The worker consents only by necessity. That is a form of coercion.
There is no other reasonable choice than to consent to some dictatorship or another for many people.
This is why when capitalists control the government they try to degrade social services as much as possible.
They want helpless slaves, not people with options.
And absolutely nothing has stopped you from starting a democratic controlled company, but you haven't done it. Why not?
And absolutely nothing has stopped you from starting a democratic controlled company, but you haven't done it. Why not?
'Cause like a true Socialist, it's about using other people's money not his own.
And absolutely nothing has stopped you from starting a democratic controlled company, but you haven't done it. Why not?
More diversion.
I will give you a clue.
This does not justify dictatorship.
No diversion. You know it can't be done.
No diversion. You know it can't be done.
It's done everyday. All over the world.
But even if it wasn't done this is a matter of morality.
There is no moral justification for dictatorship in the workplace.
