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Legal definition of woman is based on biological sex, UK supreme court rules

seanie said:
And again, go back to first principles.

What is the justification for separate male and female sports?

Why is that category separation important?

And why should men who consider themselves women be allowed to participate in a women’s category?

Explain.
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In the meantime…

What is the justification for allowing males to participate in female only sporting categories?
 
Thank you.

The sample of world class athletes in that survey also overwhelmingly supported more inclusivity for transgender athletes.
 
Inclusivity does not equate to someone participating in the wrong sex category.

Again, first principles.

Why do we separate most sports by sex in the first place?
 
What is the justification now?

Why is it justified to have separate male and female categories in most sports?

This is not a difficult question.
 
seanie said:
And your solution to “manage it” is to let any man who considers himself to be a woman, to access spaces for women only.
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No, imho

seanie said:
Jimmy Higgins said:
seanie said:
In what sense can an adult male be considered a woman?

Why?
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This is actually a great question and shouldn't be asked sarcastically. Especially the "why" part. I don't think the answer is available yet and won't be for a while

But before we leave the dark ages when it comes to understanding of our consciousness, we can at least accept that this does actually exist. Be humane about it. And try to determine how to manage it, so that all parties involved are left with their rights and dignity.
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There was no sarcasm.

It’s a simple question.

Why should men who consider themselves women, be considered women by anyone else?

Given they are actually men?
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Common courtesy?

Yeah, I know it's a quaint, old fashioned idea.
 
It’s common courtesy to let any man who says he’s a woman into a woman only space?

Are you quite mad?
 
“Oh, this double rapist, who only identified as a woman after being prosecuted wants to go to a women’s prison, should we let them?”

“Well it’s common courtesy”.
 
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ZiprHead said:
Common courtesy?

Yeah, I know it's a quaint, old fashioned idea.
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It is not "common courtesy" for males to mess with women in public restrooms.

All of us guys, including trans women, could do the same thing you and I do. Announce our male presence to the occupants of the women's restroom before entering and wait until we are sure the people entitled to use the place are okay with it. That's the "quaint old fashioned common courtesy".
Tom
 
TomC said:
Jimmy Higgins said:
This is actually a great question and shouldn't be asked sarcastically. Especially the "why" part. I don't think the answer is available yet and won't be for a while
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I think that the main problems here are two things. Sex and gender are two different things. That's one, and it doesn't fit the trans activists ideology.

The one we're talking about here (this post, not the whole thread) is semantics. For all of human history, until very recently, sex and gender were so tightly entwined there was little point to making a distinction between male and man or female and woman. A person's birth sex determined a ton of stuff about their life, including their gender. That's not the case anymore, at least not here in places with resources and secular values. We've got therapy and advanced treatment options. It's become important to make a distinction between sex and gender, at least under a few circumstances. Our language, however, hasn't kept up. It's gotten a bit obsolete. The difference is utterly unimportant in all but a tiny few circumstances, but sometimes it is important. "Male' and "woman" , sometimes, are opposites.
Tom
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This is true for western society but in fact, as has been noted earlier in this thread, many societies recognized more than two genders:

www.britannica.com

Cultures That Recognize More than Two Genders | Britannica

Curious about genders that defy the binary? Learn more about cultures around the world that recognize nonbinary identities.
www.britannica.com www.britannica.com


In the Talmud, seven genders are recognized:

www.myjewishlearning.com

The Seven Genders in the Talmud | My Jewish Learning

Thought nonbinary gender was a modern concept? Think again. The ancient Jewish understanding of gender was far more nuanced than ...
www.myjewishlearning.com www.myjewishlearning.com

I know that gender and sex are not equivalent. I’m just providing links to a couple of descriptions of how other societies view gender or did in the past.
 
So what?

What has that to do with the question of whether sex is an important characteristic in some circumstances?
 
Toni said:
This is true for western society but in fact, as has been noted earlier in this thread
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Which is where we live and where our language evolved.

What other cultures did isn't important to me. And frankly, I doubt that you (with your modern sensibilities) would find most primitive old cultures particularly attractive. You, as a mere female, would generally be restricted to cooking and cleaning and popping out babies.
As God intended!
Tom
 
TomC said:
Toni said:
This is true for western society but in fact, as has been noted earlier in this thread
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Which is where we live and where our language evolved.

What other cultures did isn't important to me. And frankly, I doubt that you (with your modern sensibilities) would find most primitive old cultures particularly attractive. You, as a mere female, would generally be restricted to cooking and cleaning and popping out babies.
As God intended!
Tom
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Did you notice the link to how the Talmud discussed gender? Jesus was a Jew.

I realize you believe that it is only in these more modern enlightened times that women were allowed to do anything except cook and have babies but you are not well informed about other cultures. Many other cultures had women in many different roles. In some, women were the last authority, the rule makers .
 
So men should be allowed into women only spaces because…

…other cultures.

This is idiocy.
 
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