martial arts question

[BH]

Hello,

I do not know any martial arts but was wondering about something about it.

If you do not know martial arts and am confronted by someone who does is there any way you might could beat them in a fight, or at least get them down long enough you can run off.

About twenty years ago I was mugged in Dallas. The guy hit me a couple of times and took my wallet. When the cops came and I described the guys two hits he said it sounded like my attacker used some sort of karate.

I have always wondered, if that was the case, if there was any way I would have had a chance?

 

[Sarpedon]

Martial arts is a fancy way of saying they practice hitting things. Anyone who practices anything will be better at it than one who doesn't. No martial art is intrinsically superior to any other, but practicing is always superior to not practicing.

Remember the old Chinese proverb: "Of the thirty-six stratagems, the best one is to run away." The best self defense technique you can practice is running.

In some cases, simply being big and strong will defeat a smaller man who is so-so at martial arts, but it is unlikely a mugger would chose a big and strong target. One of the better ways to protect yourself against mugging is to simply not be the sort of person they target. While some things you can't change, there are plenty of things you can. Walk like you have a purpose, maintain a strong posture, be alert, move your head around, obviously be aware of your surroundings. Don't look like you are off in your own world, don't look at your feet, don't look like you are scared.

 

[prideandfall]

in my experience in a fight or any kind of physical confrontation, size and strength and skill are factors in who will "win", but are insignificant factors compared to the one that will alter every encounter: which person is willing to inflict the most damage.

most fights are structured around this general idea that you trade blows until the superior strength and skill prevails.
martial arts doesn't do shit against just grabbing a guy's ballsack and squeezing as hard as you can, or jumping in his face and shoving a finger tip up his nostril and pulling upwards and outwards as hard as you can.
inflicting physical damage > any/all fighting skill.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Really, it depends. For the average martial artist, it probably wouldn't make a whole lot of difference. Practicing fighting in a controlled environment is very different from using those fighting skills in a situation where someone actually wants to hurt you and you're trying to hurt them.

If somebody's going to try and mug you, odds are that you're not the first person he's tried to mug and he has experience in actual street fighting and will get the better of you. It's always better to be trained than not trained, but the greatest value ot martial arts is that it gets you some cardio exercise, not that it gives you tools which would be useful in stopping a mugger from pounding on you.

 

[TSwizzle]

Hello,

I do not know any martial arts but was wondering about something about it.

If you do not know martial arts and am confronted by someone who does is there any way you might could beat them in a fight, or at least get them down long enough you can run off.

About twenty years ago I was mugged in Dallas. The guy hit me a couple of times and took my wallet. When the cops came and I described the guys two hits he said it sounded like my attacker used some sort of karate.

I have always wondered, if that was the case, if there was any way I would have had a chance?

In general, a trained fighter has the edge but a lot depends on the experience and temperament of the fighter. To stand a chance in the situation you found yourself in depends on how it went down and your willingness to actually fight. There's no defense against the sucker punch from behind or somebody walking up and punching you in the face. But I doubt it went down like that, there is usually a preamble to such confrontations, like "hey bud, have you got the time?".

 

[Shadowy Man]

Really, it depends. For the average martial artist, it probably wouldn't make a whole lot of difference. Practicing fighting in a controlled environment is very different from using those fighting skills in a situation where someone actually wants to hurt you and you're trying to hurt them.

If somebody's going to try and mug you, odds are that you're not the first person he's tried to mug and he has experience in actual street fighting and will get the better of you. It's always better to be trained than not trained, but the greatest value ot martial arts is that it gets you some cardio exercise, not that it gives you tools which would be useful in stopping a mugger from pounding on you.

That's why something like Krav Maga would be better to learn than say Tae Kwon Do or Kickboxing. Being extremely proficient at Aikido would probably be a good thing too.

 

[BH]

Martial arts is a fancy way of saying they practice hitting things. Anyone who practices anything will be better at it than one who doesn't. No martial art is intrinsically superior to any other, but practicing is always superior to not practicing.

Remember the old Chinese proverb: "Of the thirty-six stratagems, the best one is to run away." The best self defense technique you can practice is running.

In some cases, simply being big and strong will defeat a smaller man who is so-so at martial arts, but it is unlikely a mugger would chose a big and strong target. One of the better ways to protect yourself against mugging is to simply not be the sort of person they target. While some things you can't change, there are plenty of things you can. Walk like you have a purpose, maintain a strong posture, be alert, move your head around, obviously be aware of your surroundings. Don't look like you are off in your own world, don't look at your feet, don't look like you are scared.

That was probably my downfall right there. I had had a minor surgery and was walking with a somewhat limp. He knew he had a vulnerable target. He hit me with his hand on my neck and then gave me a good punch in the chest. He walked by me and then stopped and said I had some sort of bug on me. When he got close he enough he got me. It hurt and he took twenty dollars but I was okay after a few days as far as physically speaking. It hurt me more emotionally knowing someone was willing to do something like that to me or another human being.

I just wondered and always have if there was someway I could have beat him presuming I was knowing he was coming to do what he did. I am not the biggest person but I am not a little pussy either. I have heard of black belts in karate losing fights to people who do not know karate but do not know how. I guess you would have to think quick and decide what to do within the first few seconds of an encounter.

 

[DBT]

Not all martial artists are good fighters, they may have good technique in the Dojo but lack the disposition to put it into practice when faced with an aggressive opponent.

 

[bigfield]

Some teachers can teach you how to fight, but most martial arts clubs are budo schools where the goal is personal development, or gyms where the goal is to win fighting competitions (MMA, boxing etc.).

Budo schools are extremely common because almsot anyone can become an instructor with about six months of training. Some budo schools happen to produce capable fighters, but these are usually only a small percentage of the students and they are mostly men who were pretty tough to begin with.

Boxing & MMA gyms train their students to compete in sports where they have to be able to fight effectively and also be tough and mean, and these skills work quite well for self-defence.

Schools that teach self-defence, restraint & eviction etc. tend to be rare and cater to a professional clientele: security personnel, police.

I just wondered and always have if there was someway I could have beat him presuming I was knowing he was coming to do what he did. I am not the biggest person but I am not a little pussy either. I have heard of black belts in karate losing fights to people who do not know karate but do not know how. I guess you would have to think quick and decide what to do within the first few seconds of an encounter.

A karate black belt is not nearly as impressive as the public has been led to believe. Karate used to be a hobby for young men who spent their class time knocking each other's teeth out, but they are now old men and karate has become a family-friendly activity where anyone can get a black belt.

 

[fast]

Hello,

I do not know any martial arts but was wondering about something about it.

If you do not know martial arts and am confronted by someone who does is there any way you might could beat them in a fight, or at least get them down long enough you can run off.

About twenty years ago I was mugged in Dallas. The guy hit me a couple of times and took my wallet. When the cops came and I described the guys two hits he said it sounded like my attacker used some sort of karate.

I have always wondered, if that was the case, if there was any way I would have had a chance?

Yes

 

[Sarpedon]

There's another problem, you let them get close. The first thing you learn in any martial art is to control the distance. Thanks to fencing, I always unconciously step back when someone else steps forwards, maintaining the safe distance.

 

[TSwizzle]

That was probably my downfall right there. I had had a minor surgery and was walking with a somewhat limp. He knew he had a vulnerable target. He hit me with his hand on my neck and then gave me a good punch in the chest. He walked by me and then stopped and said I had some sort of bug on me. When he got close he enough he got me.

That's the preamble. It's a distraction to put you off guard. If you fall for it, your are toast.

 

[Lion IRC]

Martial 'art' is a misnomer. There's no 'art' involved.

Art is subjective. Art is abstract.
In art, people can look at two different paintings and argue about which is better.

With combat, when you're on the ground unconscious or dead, there is no subjective opinion about whether you have been defeated.

In combat it's pretty easy to decide which 'painting' is better.

 

[Sarpedon]

And the winner of this month's "Unhelpful and Irrelevant reply" is...

 

[Lion IRC]

Speaking of unhelpful replies....

There's another problem, you let them get close. The first thing you learn in any martial art is to control the distance. Thanks to fencing, I always unconciously step back when someone else steps forwards, maintaining the safe distance.

Stepping back. Maintaining safe distance.
That's genius!

 

[Sarpedon]

and yet footwork is the first thing one learns in any martial art. It isn't genius, it is basics.

There's nothing wrong with teaching the basics to a beginner.

Only someone who's never bothered to learn the basics about anything would sneer at it. Your M.O here is to go straight to the advanced lesson in any subject, proclaim that since you can't understand it, it must be wrong, and then crawl back into your comforting myths.

Probably you are a member of one of those churches that call martial arts satanic, and you just want to spread your propaganda about it, like you've been trained, regardless of relevance the subject at hand.

This incident has bothered this poster for quite some time. I know other people who have been mugged that seem to carry the negative effects of it for a while. But rather than help make sense of the situation, you seem to be trying to change the subject into some kind of nonsense semantic game, which seems to be the only thing you know how to do.

You aren't helping this person. You are just taking yet another opportunity to show off your stale ideas.

 

[bigfield]

There's another problem, you let them get close. The first thing you learn in any martial art is to control the distance. Thanks to fencing, I always unconciously step back when someone else steps forwards, maintaining the safe distance.

Another useful habit is to adopt a surreptitious guard by raising your hands when a person is close enough to pose a physical threat, and adopting a wide, evenly-balanced stance (as opposed to a David-esque posture).

The police officer in this open-carry stop provides an example:

[YOUTUBE]sj9wahCTz08[/YOUTUBE]

It provides a covert stance and guard from which to counter a variety of attacks or take the initiative, but without looking like a fighting stance. Jumping into an overt fighting stance would be impractical for a couple of reasons: not only would you look like a spaz, but an overt display of readiness might give the impression that you want to escalate the confrontation into a fight.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Hello,

I do not know any martial arts but was wondering about something about it.

If you do not know martial arts and am confronted by someone who does is there any way you might could beat them in a fight, or at least get them down long enough you can run off.

About twenty years ago I was mugged in Dallas. The guy hit me a couple of times and took my wallet. When the cops came and I described the guys two hits he said it sounded like my attacker used some sort of karate.

I have always wondered, if that was the case, if there was any way I would have had a chance?

You're always better off handing over the wallet. You've got insurance, and if they're desperate enough to mug you then they'd be desperate enough to hurt you. No wallet is worth dying for.

"some sort of karate" sounds like, we have no clue.

Also, if you do martial arts and defend yourself you might kill the person you're fighting. No wallet is worth going to jail for.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Really, it depends. For the average martial artist, it probably wouldn't make a whole lot of difference. Practicing fighting in a controlled environment is very different from using those fighting skills in a situation where someone actually wants to hurt you and you're trying to hurt them.

If somebody's going to try and mug you, odds are that you're not the first person he's tried to mug and he has experience in actual street fighting and will get the better of you. It's always better to be trained than not trained, but the greatest value ot martial arts is that it gets you some cardio exercise, not that it gives you tools which would be useful in stopping a mugger from pounding on you.

That's why something like Krav Maga would be better to learn than say Tae Kwon Do or Kickboxing. Being extremely proficient at Aikido would probably be a good thing too.

Krav Maga is great if you want to go to jail. Something like Jiu Jutsu is better if you don't. But Jiu Jutsu is pretty worthless if you're up against more than one or the guy has a weapon.

 

[bigfield]

Something like Jiu Jutsu is better if you don't. But Jiu Jutsu is pretty worthless if you're up against more than one or the guy has a weapon.

Mixed Martial Arts solved that particular problem in the 90's by adding kickboxing to Brazilian Jiu Jitsu.

As far as weapon defence is concerned, several martial arts, including some schools of jujutsu, train in practical counters, which are mostly based on simple principles: dodge the weapon, unbalance (or stun) the attacker, disable the attacker, then disarm them.