• Welcome to the Internet Infidels Discussion Board.

My War On Vodkastan

 
 
 
Cheerful Charlie

Cheerful Charlie

Contributor
Joined
Nov 10, 2005
Messages
9,357
Location
Houston, Texas
Basic Beliefs
Strong Atheist
My War On Vodkastan

It is no secret that Russia has been meddling in our elections. And that Moscow Mitch and the GOP don't seem much to care.
I thought it would be nice if the Democratic Candidates would craft a strong statement warning Putin and Russia to not interfere in any manner in this election. Especially effective if the front runners, Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren and Joe Biden signed such a statement.

Warning Putin et al that any such interference or meddling will have severe consequences for Russia in the future. Especially if a Democrat becomes president. This would also have the knock on effect of lighting a fire under the GOP and Moscow Mitch to take the prospect of election security much more seriously. Drawing a strong line in the sand and making it clear that such activity on Russia's part is not tolerable. This would also have the effect of allowing the Democrats to demonstrate a strong foreign policy when it comes to dealing with Russia and Putin. As contrasted to Trump and the GOP's lack of resolve in regard to Russia's bad behavior.

After thinking about this a bit, I looked up Bernie Sanders campaign website. There was a contact us section there, so I dropped and e-mail to Sanders suggesting such a strong signed statement putting Russia on notice that any meddling or interference will cause severe consequences for Russia in the future. Especially if a Democrat becomes president.

I do not have strong hops anything will come of this, but who knows, maybe it could. It would be a cheap and easy thing to do that would have few downsides and many positives. Anyway, I have done my best to light this fuse. I can hope it will not be a dud. I can dream, can't I? Now I need to contact Warren's campaign and Biden's and others.

Oh yes, and Russia get out of Ukraine.
 
Follow up:

I have now sent my proposal off the Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren and Joe Biden. Tomorrow I will start on sending this to Beto, Mayor Pete, Harris and all the rest of the Democratic candidates. I will probably start a parallel effort with Democratic House and Senate members. Time to put Pooty and his Vodkastanis on notice and follow through. Sometimes, bitching on some damned forum isn't enough.

Ecrasez l'infame!
 
Follow up to the follow up.

I am thinking this needs to be something the Democratic party members of the House and Senate also need to do. I am going to have to write up a proposal and send it to as many of these members of Congress as I can. I need to contact the leaders of House and Senate and get them on board this effort. Warn Putin off in the strongest terms that this is no longer going to be tolerated. And will have stiff consequences if this sort of "soft war" continues.

Let the American public know, no more nice Congress in regards to this sort of interference. That the Democrats are not going to let this slide by even though Moscow Mitch and Trump don't seem to have an appetite for saying "No!" to Putin.

Everybody has to have a hobby.
 
My war on Putin's interference in our politics starts now. I know Putin's actions do not bother Trump, the GOP and Moscow Mitch very much, but I know it bothers many Americans a lot and if not Republicans, many independents and Democrats do not want to see Putin trying to influence our politics to put a useful idiot like Trump into office and keeping said useful idiot in power. This is not so much an "echo chamber" as common sense and rational position to try to stop Russia's destructive interference in our nation's electoral politics. This cannot be allowed to continue. This cannot be allowed to be something Russia sees as a useful set of activities with little reason to stop doing this because nobody in the US really strongly acts when Russia does this sort of thing.
 
I feel pretty good about having sent off emails on Friday afternoon to my Congressman and Senators on the need to take immediate action to prevent Trump from using his Doral resort for the G7 summit. A few hours later and Trump decides to cancel the plans. Trump caves under pressure! I'm all for punishing Putin as well. How about boycotting their vodka exports? That's only about $150M per year so it would only be symbolic. And this Thanksgiving holiday we should have a national Turkey boycot. Erdogan is scheduled to be at the White House this November. I bet Trump invites him to the symbolic Turkey pardoning ceremony, and this year he gives the turkey the Presidential Medal of Freedom.
 
Treedbear said:
I feel pretty good about having sent off emails on Friday afternoon to my Congressman and Senators on the need to take immediate action to prevent Trump from using his Doral resort for the G7 summit. A few hours later and Trump decides to cancel the plans. Trump caves under pressure! I'm all for punishing Putin as well. How about boycotting their vodka exports? That's only about $150M per year so it would only be symbolic. And this Thanksgiving holiday we should have a national Turkey boycot. Erdogan is scheduled to be at the White House this November. I bet Trump invites him to the symbolic Turkey pardoning ceremony, and this year he gives the turkey the Presidential Medal of Freedom.
Click to expand...

The problem with both Russia and Turkey is that neither really has much to boycott. Stolichnaya vodka, a few years ago was target of a boycott, but oops! Stoli is Ukrainian. In all of Walmart, I cannot think of a single Russian anything to boycott. Turkey occasionally has cheap clothing they export. Sweatshop stuff. But I have not seen any of that lately.
 
This is Play-Doh politics, Charlie. It doesn't do anything for anyone other than making you feel good about yourself (and keeping you from directing your energy to more pressing concerns that are actually within your power to influence).

In America, recognizing the class roots of basically every problem we face is basically forbidden. Whenever something happens that seems to indicate a realization on our part about how screwed things have become, the media collaborates with the state to throw us something to chew on, something unrelated to what we should really be angry about... and importantly, something we are unable to really do anything about other than spin our wheels on internet forums.

Russia's meddling in American politics happened on Obama's watch. Do you think a sternly written letter by him, read from a teleprompter and broadcast to the world, would have done anything to stop it from happening? Of course not; the United States engages in the large-scale engineering of entire countries' economies, up to installing their leaders, and the international community would be justifiably laughing at our grandstanding against this comparatively minor instance on the part of Russia. As with all non-binding resolutions with no material provisions, nothing would change.

I also think it's kind of sad that blatant bigotry against Russians is acceptable now, due to the actions of those connected to Russia's corrupt government. Russian people deserve our support, not our mocking labels of "Vodkastan" to describe their home, nor these silly Cold War caricatures that don't even make sense anymore now that Russia is politically aligned 180° from where it was a century ago. The same is unfortunately true about much of American discourse on China, which is poisoned by an Orientalism that dates back to our most shameful years as a nation.
 
Treedbear said:
I feel pretty good about having sent off emails on Friday afternoon to my Congressman and Senators on the need to take immediate action to prevent Trump from using his Doral resort for the G7 summit. A few hours later and Trump decides to cancel the plans. Trump caves under pressure! I'm all for punishing Putin as well. How about boycotting their vodka exports? That's only about $150M per year so it would only be symbolic. And this Thanksgiving holiday we should have a national Turkey boycot. Erdogan is scheduled to be at the White House this November. I bet Trump invites him to the symbolic Turkey pardoning ceremony, and this year he gives the turkey the Presidential Medal of Freedom.
Click to expand...

The Doral thing was a ploy to get attention away from the Syria debacle.
 
ZiprHead said:
Treedbear said:
I feel pretty good about having sent off emails on Friday afternoon to my Congressman and Senators on the need to take immediate action to prevent Trump from using his Doral resort for the G7 summit. A few hours later and Trump decides to cancel the plans. Trump caves under pressure! I'm all for punishing Putin as well. How about boycotting their vodka exports? That's only about $150M per year so it would only be symbolic. And this Thanksgiving holiday we should have a national Turkey boycot. Erdogan is scheduled to be at the White House this November. I bet Trump invites him to the symbolic Turkey pardoning ceremony, and this year he gives the turkey the Presidential Medal of Freedom.
Click to expand...

The Doral thing was a ploy to get attention away from the Syria debacle.
Click to expand...

Are you saying he never intended to go ahead with it?

BTW - I was jesting about boycitting Russia and having Turkey over for Thanksgiving. But I do favor sanctions. Writing letters to congressmen on the other hand is always effective. Not my letter individually but as a sign of public consensus.
 
PyramidHead said:
This is Play-Doh politics, Charlie. It doesn't do anything for anyone other than making you feel good about yourself (and keeping you from directing your energy to more pressing concerns that are actually within your power to influence).

In America, recognizing the class roots of basically every problem we face is basically forbidden. Whenever something happens that seems to indicate a realization on our part about how screwed things have become, the media collaborates with the state to throw us something to chew on, something unrelated to what we should really be angry about... and importantly, something we are unable to really do anything about other than spin our wheels on internet forums.

Russia's meddling in American politics happened on Obama's watch. Do you think a sternly written letter by him, read from a teleprompter and broadcast to the world, would have done anything to stop it from happening? Of course not; the United States engages in the large-scale engineering of entire countries' economies, up to installing their leaders, and the international community would be justifiably laughing at our grandstanding against this comparatively minor instance on the part of Russia. As with all non-binding resolutions with no material provisions, nothing would change.

I also think it's kind of sad that blatant bigotry against Russians is acceptable now, due to the actions of those connected to Russia's corrupt government. Russian people deserve our support, not our mocking labels of "Vodkastan" to describe their home, nor these silly Cold War caricatures that don't even make sense anymore now that Russia is politically aligned 180° from where it was a century ago. The same is unfortunately true about much of American discourse on China, which is poisoned by an Orientalism that dates back to our most shameful years as a nation.
Click to expand...

I have run out of patience with the Russians. Sure there are some good Russians living in Russia, but they are not able to do much about any of this. But Putin and his Russian Mafia oligarch buddies did not just drop into Russia from Mars. The good Russians overwhelm9ing voting him in. Despite his record he keeps winning re-election.

Several polls over the years have shown very large numbers of Russians pine for the days Stalin ran the country. Despite the madness, the Gulags, the treatment of ethnic minorities in USSR, the common Russian in the street doesn't seem to remember that or care. If Stalin was alive to day and running for ruler of Russia, he would have a good chance of winning. No. I am out of patience with the Russians who keep voting for Putin. I pity those in Russia who want no part of this and can only protest and vote knowing Putin is not going to be defeated and the Russian Mafia is going to own Russia for decades to come.

Don't tell me to take it easy on the jerks that admire Putin and do not protest his attacks on Ukraine and other horrors of modern day Russia, Screw 'em!
 
Cheerful Charlie said:
PyramidHead said:
This is Play-Doh politics, Charlie. It doesn't do anything for anyone other than making you feel good about yourself (and keeping you from directing your energy to more pressing concerns that are actually within your power to influence).

In America, recognizing the class roots of basically every problem we face is basically forbidden. Whenever something happens that seems to indicate a realization on our part about how screwed things have become, the media collaborates with the state to throw us something to chew on, something unrelated to what we should really be angry about... and importantly, something we are unable to really do anything about other than spin our wheels on internet forums.

Russia's meddling in American politics happened on Obama's watch. Do you think a sternly written letter by him, read from a teleprompter and broadcast to the world, would have done anything to stop it from happening? Of course not; the United States engages in the large-scale engineering of entire countries' economies, up to installing their leaders, and the international community would be justifiably laughing at our grandstanding against this comparatively minor instance on the part of Russia. As with all non-binding resolutions with no material provisions, nothing would change.

I also think it's kind of sad that blatant bigotry against Russians is acceptable now, due to the actions of those connected to Russia's corrupt government. Russian people deserve our support, not our mocking labels of "Vodkastan" to describe their home, nor these silly Cold War caricatures that don't even make sense anymore now that Russia is politically aligned 180° from where it was a century ago. The same is unfortunately true about much of American discourse on China, which is poisoned by an Orientalism that dates back to our most shameful years as a nation.
Click to expand...

I have run out of patience with the Russians. Sure there are some good Russians living in Russia, but they are not able to do much about any of this. But Putin and his Russian Mafia oligarch buddies did not just drop into Russia from Mars. The good Russians overwhelm9ing voting him in. Despite his record he keeps winning re-election.

Several polls over the years have shown very large numbers of Russians pine for the days Stalin ran the country. Despite the madness, the Gulags, the treatment of ethnic minorities in USSR, the common Russian in the street doesn't seem to remember that or care. If Stalin was alive to day and running for ruler of Russia, he would have a good chance of winning. No. I am out of patience with the Russians who keep voting for Putin. I pity those in Russia who want no part of this and can only protest and vote knowing Putin is not going to be defeated and the Russian Mafia is going to own Russia for decades to come.

Don't tell me to take it easy on the jerks that admire Putin and do not protest his attacks on Ukraine and other horrors of modern day Russia, Screw 'em!
Click to expand...

You're way off base here. People pine for Stalin in Russia because Stalin was not the monster Western propaganda made him out to be, and your dismissal of those ignorant common Russians, why don't they know their own country's history better than me, an American is pure chauvinism. Do you ever wonder if the things you learn from mainstream sources while living in the core of the most brutal imperialist regime in world history could be a teensy bit skewed? That a country of ~145 million people isn't just made up of dimwits who jab at the election ballot randomly like infants? Log off for a while, Charlie, and learn about Russia from Russians, Stalin from his living supporters, and get your head out of Rachel Maddow's ass. She's given you a case of brain worms, and it's getting worse by the day.
 
Many Russians know as little about their past history as far right Americans really know about American history, little or nothing and far right propaganda masquerading as history. Stalin was a monster. 20 million dead.
 
https://www.rawstory.com/2019/10/fa...to-manipulate-the-2020-presidential-election/

...
On Monday, in a series of announcements by Facebook, the company revealed it had shut down four new foreign interference operations originating from Russia and Iran. According to their announcement, one appears to be linked to the Russian troll agency, the Internet Research Agency (IRA), and was targeting the U.S. 2020 presidential election.
The company removed 50 Instagram accounts and one account on Facebook that originated in Russia and focused primarily on the United States.
...

The elections are just getting started and already the shit heads are back at it. Because they don't fear having any real consequences from this sort of effort.
 
Cheerful Charlie said:
Many Russians know as little about their past history as far right Americans really know about American history, little or nothing and far right propaganda masquerading as history. Stalin was a monster. 20 million dead.
Click to expand...

Why would you consider Stalin to be far right? He was the typical socialist with one exception. Socialists always believe that once the socialists take complete power and throw all the capitalists into the gulag, that the socialist will voluntarily give up power to the "collective". And this never happens...
 
Do we need a Stalin thread? Don't make me do a Stalin thread.
 
Cheerful Charlie said:
https://www.rawstory.com/2019/10/fa...to-manipulate-the-2020-presidential-election/

...
On Monday, in a series of announcements by Facebook, the company revealed it had shut down four new foreign interference operations originating from Russia and Iran. According to their announcement, one appears to be linked to the Russian troll agency, the Internet Research Agency (IRA), and was targeting the U.S. 2020 presidential election.
The company removed 50 Instagram accounts and one account on Facebook that originated in Russia and focused primarily on the United States.
...

The elections are just getting started and already the shit heads are back at it. Because they don't fear having any real consequences from this sort of effort.
Click to expand...

Okay, but this is just par for the course. The United States has a program exactly like it that has been around for years.

Operation Earnest Voice

Operation Earnest Voice is an astroturfing campaign by the US government.[1] The aim of the initiative is to use sockpuppets to spread pro-American propaganda on social networking sites based outside of the US.[2][3][4][5] The campaign is operated by the United States Military Central Command (CENTCOM), thought to have been directed at jihadists across Pakistan, Afghanistan and other countries the Middle East.[2]

According to CENTCOM, the US-based Facebook and Twitter networks are not targeted by the program because US laws prohibit state agencies from spreading propaganda among US citizens as according to the Smith-Mundt Modernization Act of 2012.[6] However, according to the Smith-Mundt Modernization Act of 2012, dissemination of foreign propaganda to domestic audiences is expressly allowed over the internet including social media networks.[7] Isaac R. Porche, a researcher at the RAND corporation, claims it would not be easy to exclude US audiences when dealing with internet communications.[5]
Click to expand...

And if you think the extent of their astroturfing is completely captured by this publicly available information on Wikipedia, you're taking the piss. Again: how much are you willing to trust the USA as an arbiter of good behavior in other people's elections, to say nothing of historical narratives about Stalin, etc.?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom