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Nobody likes Dr. Oz anymore....boo fucking hoo

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thebeave

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When it comes to mockery, Dr. Oz is as close to a perfect target as you’ll find. For years, we have been taking serious issue with Oz’s tactics: Becoming “America’s Doctor,” courtesy of Oprah, transforming himself from a respected cardiac surgeon to a peddler of both useless supplements and junk science once he got his own show.

(ACSH’s Dr. Josh Bloom has written a number of seriously unflattering (and amusing) Science pieces about Oz, two of which can be read here, and here.)

But, Dr. Henry Miller, a highly regarded Research Fellow at the Hoover Institute, who specializes in public health policy, scientific philosophy, junk science and medicine, to name a few, does not find the relationship between Oz and Columbia University the least bit funny.

Dr. Miller wrote this letter to Dr. Lee Goldman, the Dean of Faculties of Health Science and Medicine, strongly suggesting that Oz be stripped of his privileges at Columbia.
Click to expand...
http://acsh.org/2015/04/we-have-been-ragging-on-dr-oz-for-years-now-acsh-friend-dr-henry-miller-gets-serious/
 
My gf was talking about Dr. Oz several years ago. I guess she saw him on Oprah or something. Without ever seeing him on TV, I came to the conclusion that he was full of shit just from what my gf and others were blabbering about.
 
transforming himself from a respected cardiac surgeon to a peddler of both useless supplements and junk science once he got his own show

The bolded is the sad part
 
Dr. Oz is an asshole, but he also has tenure. That counts for a lot when you want to protect the rights of college professors to express provocative opinions that need to be expressed.
 
He may have tenure, but as of now, he has the ability to do a lot more damage through the medium of TV. If the trends continue, hopefully this will be lessened over time.
 
thebeave said:
Dr. Miller wrote this letter to Dr. Lee Goldman, the Dean of Faculties of Health Science and Medicine, strongly suggesting that Oz be stripped of his privileges at Columbia.
Click to expand...

The woo-profiteers will just use that as a marketing tool. Such action is clearly nothing but Big Pharma Medicine Lizard People Hussein Obama trying to silence the twoof.
 
He is still loved by the faith based crowd, the emotionally damaged and the paranoid.

My heart goes out to the emotionally damaged. The hyenas go out for the weakest.
 
RavenSky said:
transforming himself from a respected cardiac surgeon to a peddler of both useless supplements and junk science once he got his own show

The bolded is the sad part
Click to expand...

Surgeons are basically highly skilled technicians. Although these skills can be quite impressive and worthy of respect, you don't really need to be a scientist or scientifically inclined to be a surgeon or any sort of doctor for that matter.

MEDICAL DOCTORS are to BIOLOGY as ENGINEERS are to PHYSICS.
 
J842P said:
RavenSky said:
transforming himself from a respected cardiac surgeon to a peddler of both useless supplements and junk science once he got his own show

The bolded is the sad part
Click to expand...

Surgeons are basically highly skilled technicians. Although these skills can be quite impressive and worthy of respect, you don't really need to be a scientist or scientifically inclined to be a surgeon or any sort of doctor for that matter.

MEDICAL DOCTORS are to BIOLOGY as ENGINEERS are to PHYSICS.
Click to expand...
I think more as TECHNICIANS are to PHYSICISTS (as you started your post).

e.g.
A physicist finds and describes the laws of mechanics (a science pretty much completed quite a while ago).
An automotive engineer uses those laws to design the automobile.
An auto technician learns how the engineer designed the auto so he can maintain and repair it.

A doctor tries to maintain and repair us biological critters.
:devil:
 
J842P said:
Surgeons are basically highly skilled technicians. Although these skills can be quite impressive and worthy of respect, you don't really need to be a scientist or scientifically inclined to be a surgeon or any sort of doctor for that matter.
Click to expand...

My father-in-law is a retired neurosurgeon. He was an atheist but became a Jehovah's Witness. Apparently you don't need to be all there to do successful surgery. I hope the crazy skipped a generation.

Of course Oz isn't crazy. He's a fucking con-man like a Kevin Trudeau or one of those TV psychics.
 
skepticalbip said:
J842P said:
Surgeons are basically highly skilled technicians. Although these skills can be quite impressive and worthy of respect, you don't really need to be a scientist or scientifically inclined to be a surgeon or any sort of doctor for that matter.

MEDICAL DOCTORS are to BIOLOGY as ENGINEERS are to PHYSICS.
Click to expand...
I think more as TECHNICIANS are to PHYSICISTS (as you started your post).

e.g.
A physicist finds and describes the laws of mechanics (a science pretty much completed quite a while ago).
An automotive engineer uses those laws to design the automobile.
An auto technician learns how the engineer designed the auto so he can maintain and repair it.

A doctor tries to maintain and repair us biological critters.
:devil:
Click to expand...

^^This^^

Medical doctors are body-mechanics.

In principle tenure should only protect politically unpopular but scientifically legit ideas, not scientifically invalid ideas, and in OZ's case he has made claims that strongly contradict the science. But then, so do a huge % of medical doctors, such every time one of them talks about healing the mind, body, and the "spirit".

Like others have said, anyone who buys his nonsense would just increase their faith if he were stripped of his credentials. Thus, unless he is teaching that nonsense to students at the University, stripping his tenure for comments made outside his University role isn't worth setting the precedent, because the line between a scientifically legit speculation or hypothesis and total unscientific nonsense is often fuzzy. OTOH, he can and should be stripped of his licence to practice medicine.
 
thebeave said:
He has taped a response to his critics. He's couching it as a Freedom of Speech issue.

http://money.cnn.com/2015/04/21/media/dr-mehmet-oz-accusations/
Click to expand...

In the same vein, Bernie Madoff should not be criticised, as he was merely exercising his free speech rights to say whatever he wanted to his investors. If they came to harm as a result of believing him, and he ended up with all their money, that is hardly a justification for infringing his right to tell them any old bullshit he wanted, right?
 
thebeave said:
He has taped a response to his critics. He's couching it as a Freedom of Speech issue.

http://money.cnn.com/2015/04/21/media/dr-mehmet-oz-accusations/
Click to expand...
Interesting video. So he is appealing to freedom of speech? Certainly he is intelligent and informed enough to know that the guarantee of freedom of speech only protects individuals from government silencing them, not from other individuals holding him responsible for obvious misstatements that impact their organization or associations. Freedom of speech also does not protect individuals from charges of fraud by the government.

I like his trying to skew the issue by trying to make it appear that his critics are slamming him for wanting to label GMOs when their actual charges are his endorsing fraudulent products like miracle diet pills, etc.
 
skepticalbip said:
thebeave said:
He has taped a response to his critics. He's couching it as a Freedom of Speech issue.

http://money.cnn.com/2015/04/21/media/dr-mehmet-oz-accusations/
Click to expand...
Interesting video. So he is appealing to freedom of speech? Certainly he is intelligent and informed enough to know that the guarantee of freedom of speech only protects individuals from government silencing them, not from other individuals holding him responsible for obvious misstatements that impact their organization or associations. Freedom of speech also does not protect individuals from charges of fraud by the government.

I like his trying to skew the issue by trying to make it appear that his critics are slamming him for wanting to label GMOs when their actual charges are his endorsing fraudulent products like miracle diet pills, etc.
Click to expand...

Essentially every freedom of speech claim I've ever heard has been spurious in this way. The cynic in me thinks that the goal is always to spin public opinion - the average American takes the claim to imply that the speaker is being victimized by those trying to silence them, regardless of the actual facts.
 
beero1000 said:
skepticalbip said:
Interesting video. So he is appealing to freedom of speech? Certainly he is intelligent and informed enough to know that the guarantee of freedom of speech only protects individuals from government silencing them, not from other individuals holding him responsible for obvious misstatements that impact their organization or associations. Freedom of speech also does not protect individuals from charges of fraud by the government.

I like his trying to skew the issue by trying to make it appear that his critics are slamming him for wanting to label GMOs when their actual charges are his endorsing fraudulent products like miracle diet pills, etc.
Click to expand...

Essentially every freedom of speech claim I've ever heard has been spurious in this way. The cynic in me thinks that the goal is always to spin public opinion - the average American takes the claim to imply that the speaker is being victimized by those trying to silence them, regardless of the actual facts.
Click to expand...
I certainly agree... but then I tend to be rather cynical too.

One tell is that he is not defending the claims he has made and is being criticized for. Instead, he is essentially saying he has a right to say anything he wants and then misstating what the criticisms actually are.
 
J842P said:
RavenSky said:
transforming himself from a respected cardiac surgeon to a peddler of both useless supplements and junk science once he got his own show

The bolded is the sad part
Click to expand...

Surgeons are basically highly skilled technicians. Although these skills can be quite impressive and worthy of respect, you don't really need to be a scientist or scientifically inclined to be a surgeon or any sort of doctor for that matter.

MEDICAL DOCTORS are to BIOLOGY as ENGINEERS are to PHYSICS.
Click to expand...

Sadly, this is more often true than it is false. Medicine has far more art than science to it, especially lately, than they will either admit or if they are honest, than competent doctors will feel comfortable with. My first impression of Dr. Oz when I caught one of his shows was that he managed to sound competent, an then I listened to what he was actually trying to do. He's in effect more dangerous than most f the pseudoscience pioneers because he can sound like he knows more than most on a topic, then people believe him because he has medical degree and many years of experience in surgery with a clear record under his belt. They forget therefore to think abut what the man is actually saying, and also that a surgeon does not a dietician or health science ethicist make. Sic:<sarcasm> But he has his own show and he was on Oprah!> is what I hear from so many people it's quite scary.
 
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