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Norse Pagans rise again

DrZoidberg

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March 20 the Swedish pagan association celebrated Vårblot.

The statues are of the siblings Frej and Freja. Male and female fertility gods. In pagan religion I love these minor variations. Making it such a rich tradition.

I think it's a damn shame the Vikings became Christian. So much good stuff disappeared
 

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I think the problem is that many pagan religions tolerate other pagan religions including christianity. But christianity tolerates none, at least insofar as only after christianity has stolen some tradition or teaching. Once it has become a christian thing it's okay now. Christianity is definitely a racist religion.
 
I think the problem is that many pagan religions tolerate other pagan religions including christianity. But christianity tolerates none, at least insofar as only after christianity has stolen some tradition or teaching. Once it has become a christian thing it's okay now. Christianity is definitely a racist religion.

That used to be true. But now Christianity is as liberal and accepting as Paganism used to be (or is).

Racist? You can accuse Christianity of many things. But surely not racism? The guy who influenced Christianity more than anyone else was St Augustine of Hippo. A black guy. This has been universally uncommented by Christians throughout the ages. Which tells you how little with upset Christians. Jesus was a Jew. Christianity has a long history of antisemitism. But their problem with Jews has for most of history been for their lack of embracing Jesus. If they would convert there wouldn't have been a problem. When Isabella of Spain banned Jews from Spain all they needed to do to stay was to convert. Martin Luther was for extreme harrassement of the Jews. But his expressed goal was to harrass them into joining the wider Christian community. Not exterminate them.

The antisemitic racism we associate with, for example, Nazism, is a result of the enlightenment. It has to do with very enthusiastic scientism being crowbared into Christianity. That's just a bizarre and pretty late development. It's a weird blend of a worship of thinking and reason with anti-intelectualism/faith first thinking. Just rediculous in every way.

Early Judaism was overtly racist. But when they were conquered by Assyria in 720 BC they re-interpretted the Torah as this Jewish kingdom not being a litteral kingdom, but a spiritual one. Then Persia conquered it in 539 BC and Cyrus the Great gets named the first Messiah by the Jews. At this point Jews are extremely NOT racist. They were very happy about being ruled by Persia. Jews had a lot of autonomy and were left to worship as they pleased.

In 312 BC the Greek Selucid empire conquered Israel. This was a very heavy handed rule. They forced the Jews to worship Dyonisus in parallel to Jehova. The Greeks were incompetent administrators and Greek rule was dysfunctional, corrupt and chaotic. They were so shit that the empire shook itself apart from within. In 110 BC Jews managed to gain indipendence (for the first time since 720 BC). The ruling Hasmonean (Jewish) dynasty was super racist. The pro-Jewish racism was used as the glue to fight the Greeks. But that same extreme racism became dysfunctional when the Romans took over (37 BC). Following the Jewish uprising of 70 AD this new racist streak was obliterated from Judaism.

This evolution can be tracked in the Old Testament. It's all in there.

Modern paganism is a modern invention. It's got very little to do with ancient paganism. It's a religion for nerdy alternatives. There's also barely a community to speak of. Besides the rituals it's just a bunch of palls hanging out. Until a religion acts as a glue for a community, I don't think it can count as an active religion. Just the way I think of religion. To me religion isn't about beliefs as much as it is a description of a behaviour.
 
BTW, we know the Norse pagans were not racist. We know this because of the diverse genetics of Scandinavians. The Vikings were slave traders. Based on genetics it looks like the Vikings kept the hottest ladies for themselves, regardless of race and made them a part of the gene pool. They seemed very liberal indeed. Vikings were also very comfortable with switching loyalties and being allied with whomever paid better. Even if they stabbed another Viking in the back. They were notoriously unreliable.
 
American evangelical Christians definitely fall into the racist camp.
 
American evangelical Christians definitely fall into the racist camp.
I was using racism in a more general sense. Maybe I should have said that christianity is a supremacist religion. There isn't much difference between racism and supremacism in how adherents deal with those they deem to be "different" and therefore inferior.
 
Jews can be as prejudices and biased outside their community as anyone else. It is hard not to see Israel in some ways racist. Especially the current Netanyahu government.

Here in the USA Chrtians and Jews run the same political and religious spectrum from liberal to ultra conservative.

Indian Hindus vs Pakistani Muslims. Hatred.

Persian Muslims vs Arab Muslims. Hatred.
 
Jews can be as prejudices and biased outside their community as anyone else. It is hard not to see Israel in some ways racist. Especially the current Netanyahu government.

Here in the USA Chrtians and Jews run the same political and religious spectrum from liberal to ultra conservative.

Indian Hindus vs Pakistani Muslims. Hatred.

Persian Muslims vs Arab Muslims. Hatred.
My Jewish ex-wife made me realise stuff. The holocaust was extremely traumatic for them. They have all kinds of intergenerational toxic crap to deal with. Still.

Basically, they treat eachother worse than anyone else.

Gypsies have the same shit.

All Jews seem to agree to hate Orthodox Jews. They're like having the most retarded cousin that you invite to your wedding because its family, but you hate their guts.

Fun fact, Orthodox Judaism is just Evangelical Christianity that have rubbed off on some of the Jews.
 
I know and undertone Jewish experience. I think it more than that.

That being said the Jewish bias goes back to the OT.

';ve told this story before. In the 70s a Jewsish womn I knew got engaged to and eventually married a Catholic. I knew her parents and they had no problem.

Some in her extended family treated her like a non person. Italian families can act the same way when an Italian marries outside the group.

When I was a kid my grandmother's nephew, strong Irish Catholic family, marrid a non irish Protestant here was commotion. I was too young to understand it at the time.

An Italian mroed an aunt. When I was older my ant told me some of her broterstook him outand told him therre was no way their sister was going to amrry a ;stinking Italian'.

I had an ItaliaN high school girlfriend. When I was at her house her mother was ok, her father never spoke tome and just glared

In NYC conservative Hasidic Jews can be extremely parochial. They tend to do biusiness only within the community. Separation of the sexes at social events. Biblical misogyny. In civil cases under the law they can go to binding arbitration by a Jewish religious court.

Watched a show on young Hasidic Jews who want out. Some grew up so isolated they don't know how to go to a restaurant and need help.

I was born in NYC and we moved to Stamford Ct about 30 miles away.

I grew up in a diverse immigrant cultural mix. Parks had Italian Bocce ball courts.

All groups have bias, prejuduce, and racism in different forms and expressions. I heard Jewish Yiddish slurs for blacks, but you wn;t find thm in online Yiddosh dictionaries.

Oy vey, meshugana is everywhere.
 
If nothing else Jewish culture is optimistic and joyful, and self effacing. They can joke about themselves.
 


This reminds me of my Jewish ex-wife calmly proclaiming. "Other Jews hate Hasidic Jews. Hate them. They're the source of all our problems. They really go out of their way to make life difficult for everyone. Arrogant, annoying and just all the worst aspects of Jewish culture".

She grew up in Budapest and then Jerusalem. The two epicenters of Judaism.

I thought it was funny, just how much she despised hasidic Jews.
 
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