Paul Ryan, Crusader for the Poor

[AthenaAwakened]

Rep. Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) on Thursday unveiled a new, highly anticipated proposal to fight poverty.

"I want to talk about how we can expand opportunity in America," the former vice presidential candidate said at the American Enterprise Institute, a conservative think tank. "I don’t have all the answers; nobody does. But by working together, we can build a healthy economy and help working families get ahead.”

The big idea in Ryan's plan would be to consolidate most of the federal government's anti-poverty programs, such as food stamps and housing vouchers, into one program that states could oversee and coordinate more closely. Ryan's "Opportunity Grant" would be voluntary -- states that want to try it could submit their own plan, so long as it includes "work requirements" for the able-bodied poor.





Though he has a well-earned reputation as tough on spending, Ryan said Thursday that the Opportunity Grant is only about reform, not reducing budget deficits.

"It would be budget neutral," Ryan said. "The state would get the same amount of money as under current law, not a penny less."

As chairman of the House Budget Committee, Ryan authored several budget documents over the years that would have drastically reduced federal spending on programs for poor people, especially food stamps. (None of his "Path to Prosperity" budgets became law.) Those proposals were designed to reflect the will of House Republicans generally, while Thursday's plan represents Ryan's thinking as an individual.

Rep. Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.), the highest-ranking Democrat on the budget committee, pooh-poohed Ryan's new ideas on Thursday, calling it the same old strategy Republicans have used in the past to cut the safety net.

"The core idea of the Ryan proposal is not a new idea at all: it’s nothing more than a block grant gussied up with some bells and whistles," Van Hollen said. "If you look at the block grant proposal in the context of the Ryan-Republican budget, it would dramatically slash the resources available to help struggling families."

Thursday's event is the culmination of a dozen visits to poor neighborhoods where religious and local nonprofits ran programs that Ryan has suggested could be models for national policy. Ryan made most of his field trips with little fanfare, in sharp contrast to his photo op in a soup kitchen during the 2012 vice presidential campaign.

Antipoverty activist Bob Woodson is the man who brought Ryan to nonprofits across the country.

"What I tried to show Paul is that the real solutions to poverty," Woodson said at AEI on Thursday, "are the people who are residents in the community experiencing the problem."

During his yearlong poverty quest, Ryan repeatedly stressed the inadequacy of federal programs, along with the need for better-off members of society to give their time to the poor. "You need to get involved yourself, whether through a good mentor program, or some religious charity, whatever it is to make a difference," Ryan said on a radio program in March, for instance. His statements echoed welfare reformers of the 1990s and charity reformers of the late 1890s, who believed "indiscriminate almsgiving" only emboldened beggars.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/24/paul-ryan-poverty_n_5616609.html

Which side is right?

Is the new Ryan plan a bold innovation or just more of the same?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

My understanding is that it is robbing Paul to pay Mary and offers nothing new. It also fails to recognize that most of those that are poor, do work.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

My understanding is that it is robbing Paul to pay Mary and offers nothing new. It also fails to recognize that most of those that are poor, do work.

Well, conservative politics in general fails to recognize that fact.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

My understanding is that it is robbing Paul to pay Mary and offers nothing new. It also fails to recognize that most of those that are poor, do work.

Well other than the requirement that the poor will be forced to work at Wal-Mart and other exploitative employers... what could go wrong?

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Ryan discussed how he's rethinking poverty, and his idea to create "opportunity grants," with NPR's Steve Inskeep.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Interview Highlights

On rethinking "makers" and "takers"

In my opinion it was sort of a callous generalization. This man, a Democrat from the Democratic tent at the county 4-H fair, said, 'So who are the takers? The veteran who comes back from war who gets health care? Or the senior who paid her taxes all these years and is on Medicare?'

And what I realized was it was disparaging people where I really didn't mean to do that.

On whether the GOP has been talking — or thinking — about poverty the wrong way

I'd say ... this isn't just Republicans. I think Republicans and Democrats have been thinking about it the wrong way. And the reason I say this is, look at the results. I do believe we need some fresh thinking on fighting poverty. That's why I put out in July a very comprehensive plan, not to suggest that I've got it all figured out but to get the conversation going, to advance it to a problem-solving mode. I spent a lot of time with Catholic Charities or Lutheran Social Services going around the country and meeting with various groups. People who are really on the front lines fighting poverty, soul to soul, eye to eye, person to person. And so it has caused me to rethink the federal role in all this. And the way I basically see it is the federal government should not be dictating the front lines in the war on poverty; it should be mining the supply lines. What the federal government really brings to the table are resources. What local communities bring are the human touch.

http://www.npr.org/2014/08/29/343434942/rep-ryan-calls-for-culture-of-inclusion-to-tackle-poverty

 

[Jayjay]

Sounds reasonable. I don't agree on the work requirement but certainly giving more power to the local governments sounds more reasonable than trying to make one size fit all.

 

[SimpleDon]

Rep. Paul Ryan (R-Wis.) on Thursday unveiled a new, highly anticipated proposal to fight poverty.

"I want to talk about how we can expand opportunity in America," the former vice presidential candidate said at the American Enterprise Institute, a conservative think tank. "I don’t have all the answers; nobody does. But by working together, we can build a healthy economy and help working families get ahead.”

The big idea in Ryan's plan would be to consolidate most of the federal government's anti-poverty programs, such as food stamps and housing vouchers, into one program that states could oversee and coordinate more closely. Ryan's "Opportunity Grant" would be voluntary -- states that want to try it could submit their own plan, so long as it includes "work requirements" for the able-bodied poor.





Though he has a well-earned reputation as tough on spending, Ryan said Thursday that the Opportunity Grant is only about reform, not reducing budget deficits.

"It would be budget neutral," Ryan said. "The state would get the same amount of money as under current law, not a penny less."

As chairman of the House Budget Committee, Ryan authored several budget documents over the years that would have drastically reduced federal spending on programs for poor people, especially food stamps. (None of his "Path to Prosperity" budgets became law.) Those proposals were designed to reflect the will of House Republicans generally, while Thursday's plan represents Ryan's thinking as an individual.

Rep. Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.), the highest-ranking Democrat on the budget committee, pooh-poohed Ryan's new ideas on Thursday, calling it the same old strategy Republicans have used in the past to cut the safety net.

"The core idea of the Ryan proposal is not a new idea at all: it’s nothing more than a block grant gussied up with some bells and whistles," Van Hollen said. "If you look at the block grant proposal in the context of the Ryan-Republican budget, it would dramatically slash the resources available to help struggling families."

Thursday's event is the culmination of a dozen visits to poor neighborhoods where religious and local nonprofits ran programs that Ryan has suggested could be models for national policy. Ryan made most of his field trips with little fanfare, in sharp contrast to his photo op in a soup kitchen during the 2012 vice presidential campaign.

Antipoverty activist Bob Woodson is the man who brought Ryan to nonprofits across the country.

"What I tried to show Paul is that the real solutions to poverty," Woodson said at AEI on Thursday, "are the people who are residents in the community experiencing the problem."

During his yearlong poverty quest, Ryan repeatedly stressed the inadequacy of federal programs, along with the need for better-off members of society to give their time to the poor. "You need to get involved yourself, whether through a good mentor program, or some religious charity, whatever it is to make a difference," Ryan said on a radio program in March, for instance. His statements echoed welfare reformers of the 1990s and charity reformers of the late 1890s, who believed "indiscriminate almsgiving" only emboldened beggars.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/24/paul-ryan-poverty_n_5616609.html

Which side is right?

Is the new Ryan plan a bold innovation or just more of the same?

More of the same. But less efficient, the bureaucracies of fifty states instead of of one federal government. Not to mention the red states run by people who think that the poor are to be blamed for poverty.

Poverty is an economic problem.

It is totally obscene to be trying to solve it with after the fact government programs. They will always be a target for people like Ryan to try to cut. They imply that there is something lacking in the make up of the people who receive the government aid, that their efforts, their work, is not worth a decent pay check.

We have to raise wages of the lower earners in society and to lower profits. The entire economy, except for that of the upper 2% is suffering because of the pronounced income inequity. Too much money is going to the already rich, not enough is going to the lower say 60%. This is a condition that we caused by the economic policies that we instituted starting more than thirty years ago. We caused it, we can change it.

 

[SimpleDon]

Sounds reasonable. I don't agree on the work requirement but certainly giving more power to the local governments sounds more reasonable than trying to make one size fit all.

Unfortunately they are not giving the authority to the local governments, they are giving it to the state governments, part of the bloated middle management of our highly redundant government structure. Arguably the least responsive level of our many government levels.

Go back to one of your business professors and tell him that you as a CEO want to reorganize your massive, unresponsive corporation by increasing the responsibilities and numbers of your middle management. What will he say? This is what Ryan is proposing.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Blaming poverty on the poor is a lot like blaming hurricane victims for wind and rain.

Poverty in a societal condition stemming from the accumulation of wealth into fewer and fewer hands.

The growth and accumulation isn't the problem, the fewer and fewer hands part is the problem

"Money is like manure. It doesn't do any good unless you spread it around." Hello Dolly

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Blaming poverty on the poor is a lot like blaming hurricane victims for wind and rain.

Poverty in a societal condition stemming from the accumulation of wealth into fewer and fewer hands.

The growth and accumulation isn't the problem, the fewer and fewer hands part is the problem

"Money is like manure. It doesn't do any good unless you spread it around." Hello Dolly

Except the amount of poverty goes down as the amount of money goes up.

Furthermore, I see immigrants come here very poor--but climb out on their own despite even greater handicaps. Poverty is an outlook on life.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Blaming poverty on the poor is a lot like blaming hurricane victims for wind and rain.

Poverty in a societal condition stemming from the accumulation of wealth into fewer and fewer hands.

The growth and accumulation isn't the problem, the fewer and fewer hands part is the problem

"Money is like manure. It doesn't do any good unless you spread it around." Hello Dolly

Except the amount of poverty goes down as the amount of money goes up.

Furthermore, I see immigrants come here very poor--but climb out on their own despite even greater handicaps. Poverty is an outlook on life.

wrong conclusion, as usual

As for what you see, I see immigrants who come here and live here decades and die poor and struggling

so there.

 

[Jayjay]

Some immigrant vs. native poverty statistics:

http://cis.org/node/3876

Curiously, if you are a black immigrant, you are less likely to be poor than a US-born black person.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Some immigrant vs. native poverty statistics:

http://cis.org/node/3876

Curiously, if you are a black immigrant, you are less likely to be poor than a US-born black person.

why do you find that curious?

Immigrants are self selected and many come over here with college degrees, and none of them come with the baggage of US history.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Except the amount of poverty goes down as the amount of money goes up.

Furthermore, I see immigrants come here very poor--but climb out on their own despite even greater handicaps. Poverty is an outlook on life.

wrong conclusion, as usual

As for what you see, I see immigrants who come here and live here decades and die poor and struggling

so there.

Some remaining poor isn't a counter.

The fact is that an awful lot of immigrants manage to climb out of being poor despite greater barriers than the native-born have is evidence that climbing out is possible.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Some immigrant vs. native poverty statistics:

http://cis.org/node/3876

Curiously, if you are a black immigrant, you are less likely to be poor than a US-born black person.

why do you find that curious?

Immigrants are self selected and many come over here with college degrees, and none of them come with the baggage of US history.

You just shot yourself in the foot here. If they don't come with the baggage then whatever that baggage is must not affect them. Therefore it's not anything society is doing to them, but rather attitudes they learned while growing up.

 

[untermensche]

The only thing Ryan is planning is a run for the presidency in 2016.

 

[Jayjay]

Some immigrant vs. native poverty statistics:

http://cis.org/node/3876

Curiously, if you are a black immigrant, you are less likely to be poor than a US-born black person.

why do you find that curious?

Immigrants are self selected and many come over here with college degrees, and none of them come with the baggage of US history.

To a non-US person that baggage is not so obvious. One of the most surprising things I had when living in the US was that you guys still keep indians in reservations, for example. (And also that everyone believes in ghosts but that's a different thing.)

 

[AthenaAwakened]

why do you find that curious?

Immigrants are self selected and many come over here with college degrees, and none of them come with the baggage of US history.

You just shot yourself in the foot here.

no, I didn't.

If they don't come with the baggage then whatever that baggage is must not affect them.

and if I don't have the flu virus, I don't get the flu.

Therefore it's not anything society is doing to them,

unless society is giving them a benefit of the doubt it doesn't give native born black folk.

Happens quite a bit. Friends and family of mine when they travel abroad have all, at one time or another, found themselves treated with distrust, until they reveal they are American. Europeans tends to like American blackfolk, but not the black folk from their former colonies. Over there, we are "the good ones."

but rather attitudes they learned while growing up.

Such attitudes would be shaped by the society in which they lived. If in Kenya, you are not constantly told by family, teachers, employers, the police, media, etc., that you are bound to be a thug, but you are told you can be a doctor, guess what? Ya get to be a doctor.

Duh.

 

[untermensche]

In America we don't say Indian. We use the polite term, Redskin.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

wrong conclusion, as usual

As for what you see, I see immigrants who come here and live here decades and die poor and struggling

so there.

Some remaining poor isn't a counter.

The fact is that an awful lot of immigrants manage to climb out of being poor despite greater barriers than the native-born have is evidence that climbing out is possible.

Loren you can make the argument that I can change my circumstance and can get myself out of poverty, but you can't then extrapolate that into meaning the I or even all the poor people cause poverty. Poverty.comes from an insufficient distribution of resources and poor folk don't control distribution of resources..

Duh.