Raise your hand if you're surprised by this.

[Cheerful Charlie]

So much for the Kavanaugh GOP benefit effect?

They probably thought that a certain amount of women would be upset, but not that many Republican women. Everybody would get mad, stamp their feet a bit, have a good cry, and things would drift back to normal. That may have been a miscalculation.

I suspect the idea they could pass massive tax cuts, then use the resulting deficits to justify hacking SS, Medicare and Medicaid will be accepted by the American public at large. They live in a bubble. Oh, and back to eliminating ACA. If the Democrats retake the House, which is now looking likely, all these bad plans may be derailed. But the fact that the leader of the GOP senate openly championed this will be an issue in 2020. It is going to be a mean, vicious and savage election year.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

As someone who has paid FICA all my life and is about to become a social security recipient in the not too distant future (I am currently 61), these are my thoughts.

Its not really important what McConnell or the Republicans or the Democrats decide to do anymore. Because that ship sailed right around when Clinton was still in office. This country now has a serious deficit problem and getting redder by the hour. So if the Republicans decide to cut benefits I'm going to get screwed. And if the Democrats don't cut benefits.....I'm still preparing to get screwed......unless someone has around $21 Trillion dollars to give to Uncle Sam. Either way I'm planning getting screwed.

The only light I can see at all right now is President Trump getting high value jobs back to this country. Something that is actually happening as we speak. I figure if younger people can find quality jobs and pay into the system again, there may be some possible chance I won't have to eat dog food after I am too old to work.

U no gud wit the maths r u?

 

[none]

you aren't to old you are just lazy

 

[RVonse]

As someone who has paid FICA all my life and is about to become a social security recipient in the not too distant future (I am currently 61), these are my thoughts.

Its not really important what McConnell or the Republicans or the Democrats decide to do anymore. Because that ship sailed right around when Clinton was still in office. This country now has a serious deficit problem and getting redder by the hour. So if the Republicans decide to cut benefits I'm going to get screwed. And if the Democrats don't cut benefits.....I'm still preparing to get screwed......unless someone has around $21 Trillion dollars to give to Uncle Sam. Either way I'm planning getting screwed.

The only light I can see at all right now is President Trump getting high value jobs back to this country. Something that is actually happening as we speak. I figure if younger people can find quality jobs and pay into the system again, there may be some possible chance I won't have to eat dog food after I am too old to work.

U no gud wit the maths r u?

What does math have to do with this? Look at this graph and see if there can possibly be a way out. The hockey stick goes up just like Al Gores CO2 curve. Uncle Sam is broke and bankrupt now.

http://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/budget-ceiling.png

 

[RVonse]

you aren't to old you are just lazy

It seems the older I become, the more I just want to sit around and do nothing. Mostly because my joints no longer function quite like they should and it feels so much better when they aren't moving around so much. My brain does still feels like it is 18 years old but when I try to do something my body says differently now.

 

[laughing dog]

As someone who has paid FICA all my life and is about to become a social security recipient in the not too distant future (I am currently 61), these are my thoughts.

Its not really important what McConnell or the Republicans or the Democrats decide to do anymore. Because that ship sailed right around when Clinton was still in office. This country now has a serious deficit problem and getting redder by the hour. So if the Republicans decide to cut benefits I'm going to get screwed. And if the Democrats don't cut benefits.....I'm still preparing to get screwed......unless someone has around $21 Trillion dollars to give to Uncle Sam. Either way I'm planning getting screwed.

The only light I can see at all right now is President Trump getting high value jobs back to this country. Something that is actually happening as we speak. I figure if younger people can find quality jobs and pay into the system again, there may be some possible chance I won't have to eat dog food after I am too old to work.

U no gud wit the maths r u?

What does math have to do with this? Look at this graph and see if there can possibly be a way out. The hockey stick goes up just like Al Gores CO2 curve. Uncle Sam is broke and bankrupt now.

http://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/budget-ceiling.png

Looking at debt by itself is meaningless. A relevant comparison is debt vs ability to repay. And, an even more relevant comparison is debt owned by others vs ability to repay, because repayment of debt from US taxpayers to US citizens is just a transfer of purchasing power that stays within the country.
If my memory is correct, as of 2014, roughly 2/3 of total US debt was owned by either US citizens, US firms or the US gov'ts (SS, and state and local pension funds) and about 1/3 is owned by foreigners.

 

[RVonse]

What does math have to do with this? Look at this graph and see if there can possibly be a way out. The hockey stick goes up just like Al Gores CO2 curve. Uncle Sam is broke and bankrupt now.

http://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/budget-ceiling.png

Looking at debt by itself is meaningless. A relevant comparison is debt vs ability to repay. And, an even more relevant comparison is debt owned by others vs ability to repay, because repayment of debt from US taxpayers to US citizens is just a transfer of purchasing power that stays within the country.
If my memory is correct, as of 2014, roughly 2/3 of total US debt was owned by either US citizens, US firms or the US gov'ts (SS, and state and local pension funds) and about 1/3 is owned by foreigners.

$21 Trillion in outstanding debt even before Social Security and Medicare entitlements are included? And graphing upward like a hocky stick? Either the dollar becomes worthless or it wont be paid back.

But I pray that you are right and I am wrong. It is one time I hope to be wrong.

 

[Harry Bosch]

What does math have to do with this? Look at this graph and see if there can possibly be a way out. The hockey stick goes up just like Al Gores CO2 curve. Uncle Sam is broke and bankrupt now.

http://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/budget-ceiling.png

Looking at debt by itself is meaningless. A relevant comparison is debt vs ability to repay. And, an even more relevant comparison is debt owned by others vs ability to repay, because repayment of debt from US taxpayers to US citizens is just a transfer of purchasing power that stays within the country.
If my memory is correct, as of 2014, roughly 2/3 of total US debt was owned by either US citizens, US firms or the US gov'ts (SS, and state and local pension funds) and about 1/3 is owned by foreigners.

$21 Trillion in outstanding debt even before Social Security and Medicare entitlements are included? And graphing upward like a hocky stick? Either the dollar becomes worthless or it wont be paid back.

But I pray that you are right and I am wrong. It is one time I hope to be wrong.

Yea, I'd plan for some dramatic inflation hedges to protect yourself. I wish that we could get all the republicans in a room and just explain to them that if spending goes up, tax revenues goes down, that the deficit goes up. They don't understand that. It's seems pretty damn simple. A person should be unfit for office if they don't understand such a simple equation.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

As someone who has paid FICA all my life and is about to become a social security recipient in the not too distant future (I am currently 61), these are my thoughts.

Its not really important what McConnell or the Republicans or the Democrats decide to do anymore. Because that ship sailed right around when Clinton was still in office. This country now has a serious deficit problem and getting redder by the hour. So if the Republicans decide to cut benefits I'm going to get screwed. And if the Democrats don't cut benefits.....I'm still preparing to get screwed......unless someone has around $21 Trillion dollars to give to Uncle Sam. Either way I'm planning getting screwed.

The only light I can see at all right now is President Trump getting high value jobs back to this country. Something that is actually happening as we speak. I figure if younger people can find quality jobs and pay into the system again, there may be some possible chance I won't have to eat dog food after I am too old to work.

U no gud wit the maths r u?

What does math have to do with this?

FICA taxes times total income below a certain threshold of a declining number of works does not lend itself to really make up the difference simply because of new blue collar jobs coming into existence.

Look at this graph and see if there can possibly be a way out. The hockey stick goes up just like Al Gores CO2 curve. Uncle Sam is broke and bankrupt now.

http://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/budget-ceiling.png

Yup, you not gud with the maths. The GOP simply doesn't have a sustainable path for the US.

 

[DrZoidberg]

And Social Security is not just the old. It is the disabled, the blind, the mentally dysfunctional.

This is taking money from the most vulnerable to give tax breaks to those who need the money least.

It is as contemptible as a thing could be.

If rich people didn't need money more than other people, they wouldn't work for it so hard.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

And Social Security is not just the old. It is the disabled, the blind, the mentally dysfunctional.

This is taking money from the most vulnerable to give tax breaks to those who need the money least.

It is as contemptible as a thing could be.

If rich people didn't need money more than other people, they wouldn't work for it so hard.

Some people haven't worked hard for it.

 

[southernhybrid]

The latest bit of hypocrisy and lying from the GOP.

Of course, McConnel the shitstain wants to cut social security and medicare now to pay for the big tax break they gave to all their rich friends.

We all predicted it. Saw it coming, warned the old people, and they mostly voted GOP anyway. Hard to feel sorry for them. I only feel bad for the ones who didn't sign up for this major screwage.

It's mostly the very old white people who vote for Republicans. A good percentage of boomers and most older black adults didn't vote for the Republicans. But, here's the thing. If these cuts take place, they are unlikely to hurt those of us who are already over 65 and receiving these benefits. It's those who are under 60 that will be hurt the most. Younger people don't often realize how much they will need these programs until they get close to retirement age. And, younger people who don't like these programs, and voted Republican, partly because of these programs, haven't really given thought to the fact that they might be asked to help support their parents if it wasn't for these programs. So, these programs are important for all ages.

The nasty lie that some Republicans are now using in their campaigns is pretending that those Democrats who support Medicare for all, are going to destroy Medicare for the older adults. Of course this is nonsense, but some of the less educated older adults will believe what the Republicans are saying.

The only bright side is that if Trump were to go along with the Republicans and allow the programs to be cut, he would lose a significant part of his own base. For that reason, many people think ( hope ) that Trump will never agree to cut SS and Medicare.

Medicaid is the primary payment source for supporting frail older or disabled adults who need long term care. When I was still working in long term care, about half of my patients were on Medicaid. Most of them never bothered to vote, not even the ones that didn't suffer from any cognitive impairment. The ones who did vote were the oldest old. They were easily manipulated by the Republican propaganda.

I read this morning that Trump wants to cut the entire budget by 5%, but that doesn't include the military. No surprise there.

 

[untermensche]

And Social Security is not just the old. It is the disabled, the blind, the mentally dysfunctional.

This is taking money from the most vulnerable to give tax breaks to those who need the money least.

It is as contemptible as a thing could be.

If rich people didn't need money more than other people, they wouldn't work for it so hard.

They looked at chimps and the use of a currency (poker chips) to get things like bananas and grapes.

They were given enough chips to survive just fine.

But some of the chimps stole the chips of the weaker chimps and hid them and hoarded them.

Crazy?

I don't know why humans do similar things.

 

[jonatha]

I'm still preparing to get screwed......unless someone has around $21 Trillion dollars to give to Uncle Sam

If Uncle Sam really needs it Uncle Sam can print it, since Uncle Sam controls the printing presses....

 

[DrZoidberg]

And Social Security is not just the old. It is the disabled, the blind, the mentally dysfunctional.

This is taking money from the most vulnerable to give tax breaks to those who need the money least.

It is as contemptible as a thing could be.

If rich people didn't need money more than other people, they wouldn't work for it so hard.

Some people haven't worked hard for it.

Lol... I was joking. I thought it would be obvious

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

As someone who has paid FICA all my life and is about to become a social security recipient in the not too distant future

I don’t understand. You said:

$21 Trillion in outstanding debt even before Social Security and Medicare entitlements are included?

If you paid for them, how can they be “entitlements”?

 

[laughing dog]

What does math have to do with this? Look at this graph and see if there can possibly be a way out. The hockey stick goes up just like Al Gores CO2 curve. Uncle Sam is broke and bankrupt now.

http://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/budget-ceiling.png

Looking at debt by itself is meaningless. A relevant comparison is debt vs ability to repay. And, an even more relevant comparison is debt owned by others vs ability to repay, because repayment of debt from US taxpayers to US citizens is just a transfer of purchasing power that stays within the country.
If my memory is correct, as of 2014, roughly 2/3 of total US debt was owned by either US citizens, US firms or the US gov'ts (SS, and state and local pension funds) and about 1/3 is owned by foreigners.

$21 Trillion in outstanding debt even before Social Security and Medicare entitlements are included? And graphing upward like a hocky stick? Either the dollar becomes worthless or it wont be paid back.

The graph is pointless since it excludes the ability to repay the debt. If we taxed the US economy over the next 10 years to repay the 14 trillion owed to ourselves, that 14 trillion (1.4 trillion per year) would simply move from one group of taxpayers to another group of taxpayers, but there is zero effect on the net wealth or income of the US. The only possible drain is the 7 trillion owed to foreigners. And the extent of that drain depends on how fast the repayment would occur.

Really, your analysis is based on an irrational premise and a lack of financial understanding.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Some people haven't worked hard for it.

Lol... I was joking. I thought it would be obvious

These days? Nothing is obvious.

 

[RVonse]

$21 Trillion in outstanding debt even before Social Security and Medicare entitlements are included? And graphing upward like a hocky stick? Either the dollar becomes worthless or it wont be paid back.

The graph is pointless since it excludes the ability to repay the debt. If we taxed the US economy over the next 10 years to repay the 14 trillion owed to ourselves, that 14 trillion (1.4 trillion per year) would simply move from one group of taxpayers to another group of taxpayers, but there is zero effect on the net wealth or income of the US. The only possible drain is the 7 trillion owed to foreigners. And the extent of that drain depends on how fast the repayment would occur.

Really, your analysis is based on an irrational premise and a lack of financial understanding.

A hyperbolic curve means it can not be re-paid doesn't it? I know that much about hyperbolic curves that they eventually reach upwards at near straight vertical. I suppose you could cheat the graph for a while with a logarithmic scale of sorts but eventually a fixed social security income will collapse. More to the point, it won't matter who owes who because things will be just like Venezuela.

To be fair, what I describe is really a currency crises and not a SS obligation crises. But the end result will be the same for the elderly with no other means of support.

 

[laughing dog]

$21 Trillion in outstanding debt even before Social Security and Medicare entitlements are included? And graphing upward like a hocky stick? Either the dollar becomes worthless or it wont be paid back.

The graph is pointless since it excludes the ability to repay the debt. If we taxed the US economy over the next 10 years to repay the 14 trillion owed to ourselves, that 14 trillion (1.4 trillion per year) would simply move from one group of taxpayers to another group of taxpayers, but there is zero effect on the net wealth or income of the US. The only possible drain is the 7 trillion owed to foreigners. And the extent of that drain depends on how fast the repayment would occur.

Really, your analysis is based on an irrational premise and a lack of financial understanding.

A hyperbolic curve means it can not be re-paid doesn't it?

Only if it is not attempted to be repaid. BTW. a hockey stick is not a hyperbolic curve. And your "curve" ignores the ability to repay. In other words, a better graph would be debt/(gov't net assets) or (interest payments + annual debt repayment)/income.