Religious Conditioning

[steve_bank]

What I remember from my 50s-60s RCC school conditioning was fear and obedience. Not so much to a god but to the pope and priests who were said to be the spokespersons for god on Earth.

Priests are called father and the pope 'the holy father'. And of course the Catholics are supposed to be obedient conditioned children.

It was fearful for us kids to go into a dark closet of a confessional, kneel down, and speak to a priest through a small opening. You'd be scared to not have something to confess. Then you went to an alter, kneeled down to say paryers for atonement.

The guilt and fear started when you are baptized. You are born guilty of something and only being baptized in the RCC gets you forgiveness and into heaven.

From people I have known and stories on the forum of de conversion, the RCC may have been mild copared to other Christian groups.

Obedience to the church looking back was a conditioned response. Obey at the peril of your immortal soul and eternal damnation.

At my high school graduation ceremony when you went up to get your diploma on a stage you were supposed to kneel in full view of the audience and kiss the ring of a bishop dressed in RCC regalia.

Catholics who as adults may not follow all the moral rules like fornication and birth control, but do the rituals they are conditioned to do. Like Sunday church, Ash Wednesday, and a church marriage.

Walking around with a spot of ash on your forehead was a condtioned yearly ritual. You did it it out of habit.

Classical conditioning - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Classical conditioning (also respondent conditioning and Pavlovian conditioning) is a behavioral procedure in which a biologically potent physiological stimulus (e.g. food) is paired with a neutral stimulus (e.g. the sound of a musical triangle). The term classical conditioning refers to the process of an automatic, conditioned response that is paired with a specific stimulus.[1]

The Russian physiologist Ivan Pavlov studied classical conditioning with detailed experiments with dogs, and published the experimental results in 1897. In the study of digestion, Pavlov observed that the experimental dogs salivated when fed red meat.[2] Pavlovian conditioning is distinct from operant conditioning (instrumental conditioning), through which the strength of a voluntary behavior is modified, either by reinforcement or by punishment. However, classical conditioning can affect operant conditioning; classically conditioned stimuli can reinforce operant responses.

Classical conditioning is a basic behavioral mechanism, and its neural substrates are now beginning to be understood. Though it is sometimes hard to distinguish classical conditioning from other forms of associative learning (e.g. instrumental learning and human associative memory), a number of observations differentiate them, especially the contingencies whereby learning occurs.[3]

Together with operant conditioning, classical conditioning became the foundation of behaviorism, a school of psychology which was dominant in the mid-20th century and is still an important influence on the practice of psychological therapy and the study of animal behavior. Classical conditioning has been applied in other areas as well. For example, it may affect the body's response to psychoactive drugs, the regulation of hunger, research on the neural basis of learning and memory, and in certain social phenomena such as the false consensus effect.[4]

Operant conditioning - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Operant conditioning, also called instrumental conditioning, is a learning process where behaviors are modified through the association of stimuli with reinforcement or punishment. In it, operants—behaviors that affect one's environment—are conditioned to occur or not occur depending on the environmental consequences of the behavior.

Operant conditioning originated in the work of Edward Thorndike, whose law of effect theorised that behaviors arise as a result of whether their consequences are satisfying or discomforting. In the 20th century, operant conditioning was studied by behaviorist psychologists, who believed that much, if not all, of mind and behaviour can be explained as a result of environmental conditioning. Reinforcements are environmental stimuli that increase behaviors, whereas punishments are stimuli that decrease behaviors. Both kinds of stimuli can be further categorised into positive and negative stimuli, which respectively involve the addition or removal of environmental stimuli.

Operant conditioning differs from classical conditioning, which is a process where stimuli are paired with biologically significant events to produce involuntary and reflexive behaviors. In contrast, operant conditioning is voluntary and depends on the consequences of a behavior.

The study of animal learning in the 20th century was dominated by the analysis of these two sorts of learning,[1] and they are still at the core of behavior analysis. They have also been applied to the study of social psychology, helping to clarify certain phenomena such as the false consensus effect.[2]

Brainwashing - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Brainwashing (also known as mind control, menticide, coercive persuasion, thought control, thought reform, and forced re-education) is the concept that the human mind can be altered or controlled by certain psychological techniques. Brainwashing is said to reduce its subject's ability to think critically or independently, to allow the introduction of new, unwanted thoughts and ideas into their minds,[1] as well as to change their attitudes, values, and beliefs.[2][3]

The term "brainwashing" was first used in English by Edward Hunter in 1950 to describe how the Chinese government appeared to make people cooperate with them during the Korean War. This was the year after George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-Four was published, in which O'Brien said to Winston Smith in the Ministry of Love, "we make the brain perfect before we blow it out...Everyone is washed clean."[4] Research into the concept also looked at Nazi Germany, at some criminal cases in the United States, and at the actions of human traffickers. In the late 1960s and 1970s, the CIA's MKUltra experiments failed with no operational use of the subjects. Scientific and legal debate followed, as well as media attention, about the possibility of brainwashing being a factor when Lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD) was used,[5] or in the conversion of people to groups which are considered to be cults.[6]

The concept of brainwashing is generally not accepted as a scientific fact.[7][8] In casual speech, "brainwashing" and its verb form, "brainwash", are used figuratively to describe the use of propaganda to persuade or sway public opinion.[9]

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

"And stay away from the priests. All they have a key to is the shit house".
- William S. Burroughs

 

[DBT]

"Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by rulers as a useful tool." - Seneca

 

[DBT]

''Think of the egotism of a man who believes that an infinite being wants his praise!'' - Robert Ingersoll

''Every pulpit is a pillory, in which stands a hired culprit, defending the justice of his own imprisonment.'' - Robert Ingersoll

 

[Gospel]

Seriously, Steve? You were so close to being indoctrinated that we might've seen you cruising the streets of New York in your sanctified bubble-mobile, looking like a celestial action figure in it's packaging?

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

Religion, n. A daughter of Hope and Fear, explaining to Ignorance the nature of the Unknowable.”
― Ambrose Bierce, The Unabridged Devil's Dictionary

 

[steve_bank]

Seriously, Steve? You were so close to being indoctrinated that we might've seen you cruising the streets of New York in your sanctified bubble-mobile, looking like a celestial action figure in it's packaging?

Not close at all. It never really took root for me.

The point is conditioning from birth to 12th grade runs deep, Below conscious awareness. A Pavlovian conditioned response to the image of priests and the alleged power of the pope.

I never really went through a de-conversion process. it just fell away when I got off on my own.

Nothing recent, there have been de-conversion stories on the secular forum. Some of them pretty grim and painful.

 

[Angry Floof]

And Yahweh (or somebody) spake thusly:

Therefore thus saith the Lord, Behold, I will bring evil upon them, which they shall not be able to escape; and though they shall cry unto me, I will not hearken unto them. Jeremiah 11:11

Just saw this verse mentioned in a movie and then came by this thread about people not fearing an All-Loving Father God.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

"And stay away from the priests. All they have a key to is the shit house".
- William S. Burroughs

I remember a Catholic priest here in my hometown who seemed to be a genuinely nice guy. The locals, and not just the Catholic locals, really seemed to like him. He was "cool" and rode a Harley Davidson. Yes, there have been a lot of bad clergy, but we should take care not to use too broad a brush. After all, there are many atheists we should not take keys from too.