Scotland passes "Gender Recognition Reform"law

[TSwizzle]

Dear oh dear;

Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon was greeted with cries of 'shame on you' today as a controversial law on gender was voted through in Holyrood.
The Scottish parliament was suspended by a demonstration in the public gallery as MSPs passed the Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill by 86 to 39 this afternoon. It was the second protest of the day, with a demonstrator earlier shouting that 'no one is listening to women'. The Bill makes it easier to obtain a gender recognition certificate (GRC) on the basis of self-declaration and removing the need for a gender dysphoria diagnosis for anyone aged 16 or older. But opponents of the Bill have said it could endanger women and girls and put single-sex spaces at risk. They also fear violent male sex offenders who transition, including rapists and child abusers, will be able to force victims to use their female pronouns in court, increasing their trauma. A bid to block this loophole by inserting a clause ensuring those on the sex offenders' register cannot obtain a GRC failed by just one vote last night, after three days of furious debates. Scottish Conservative equalities spokeswoman Rachael Hamilton said: 'We all support improving the experience for trans people but that should never come at the expense of the safety of women and girls, and their hard-won rights. 'But Nicola Sturgeon's Bill – in the form that it has been passed – does put their safety at risk.' Tonight Alister Jack, the Secretary of State for Scotland, said he was examining whether to block the legislation.

Daily Mail

Hard to believe Scotland, the source of so much of the Enlightenment would descend into the retreat of reason. Hume will be spinning in his grave.

 

[scombrid]

They also fear violent male sex offenders who transition, including rapists and child abusers, will be able to force victims to use their female pronouns in court

Find me an example of something happening that justifies this "fear" as something more than hyperbole or paranoia or an effort to mix the idea of transitioning with violent sexual behavior by the writer.

 

[Oleg]

Hard to believe Scotland, the source of so much of the Enlightenment would descend into the retreat of reason. Hume will be spinning in his grave.

Triumph of the patriarchy.

 

[Oleg]

They also fear violent male sex offenders who transition, including rapists and child abusers, will be able to force victims to use their female pronouns in court

Find me an example of something happening that justifies this "fear" as something more than hyperbole or paranoia or an effort to mix the idea of transitioning with violent sexual behavior by the writer.

Warning over transgender guidance to judges

Lawyers say guidance in Equal Treatment Bench Book fails to highlight conflicts between transgender and women's rights.

www.lawgazette.co.uk

At least one victim of violence by a transgender woman has been reprimanded in court for using male pronouns while describing the attack. Finding the defendant guilty, the judge refused the victim compensation, saying that when asked to refer to the defendant as ‘she’, the victim had done so with ‘bad grace’ or continued to use ‘he’.

Related:

 

[TSwizzle]

"HER PENIS!! you fucking bigot"

 

[Politesse]

Hard to believe Scotland, the source of so much of the Enlightenment would descend into the retreat of reason. Hume will be spinning in his grave

Hume? Hoo boy. I like the guy, but I am not taking advice from David Hume about the science of sex and gender. I take it you never read his work? The Scottish State would not survive an "ascent" to his views on marital infidelity.

Though given his famous "love" for conservative Christian moralism, I doubt he would agree with you about this legislation either. Hume did not look to Leviticus for scientific insight.

 

[scombrid]

At least one case it says. So it has happened but seems a rare thing. Perhaps an exception would be reasonable if a pronoun is demonstrably harmful to a victim but there is no reason for courts to call people by anything other than their identity. Shit why use a pronoun at all then? Just call people by their surnames? I recently sat on a two week long jury trial. Seems “the defendant” or “Dixon” without prefix would be fine language.

 

[Metaphor]

At least one case it says. So it has happened but seems a rare thing. Perhaps an exception would be reasonable if a pronoun is demonstrably harmful to a victim but there is no reason for courts to call people by anything other than their identity. Shit why use a pronoun at all then? Just call people by their surnames? I recently sat on a two week long jury trial. Seems “the defendant” or “Dixon” without prefix would be fine language.

Not of the judge decided you were doing so in 'bad grace'.

At least one victim of violence by a transgender woman has been reprimanded in court for using male pronouns while describing the attack. Finding the defendant guilty, the judge refused the victim compensation, saying that when asked to refer to the defendant as ‘she’, the victim had done so with ‘bad grace’ or continued to use ‘he’.

If the judge got it into his head you were using a last name or some other noun to avoid pronouns you disagree with, the judge could just decide you were doing so with 'bad grace' and get you in trouble anyway.

 

[Metaphor]

Dear oh dear;

Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon was greeted with cries of 'shame on you' today as a controversial law on gender was voted through in Holyrood.
The Scottish parliament was suspended by a demonstration in the public gallery as MSPs passed the Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill by 86 to 39 this afternoon. It was the second protest of the day, with a demonstrator earlier shouting that 'no one is listening to women'. The Bill makes it easier to obtain a gender recognition certificate (GRC) on the basis of self-declaration and removing the need for a gender dysphoria diagnosis for anyone aged 16 or older. But opponents of the Bill have said it could endanger women and girls and put single-sex spaces at risk. They also fear violent male sex offenders who transition, including rapists and child abusers, will be able to force victims to use their female pronouns in court, increasing their trauma. A bid to block this loophole by inserting a clause ensuring those on the sex offenders' register cannot obtain a GRC failed by just one vote last night, after three days of furious debates. Scottish Conservative equalities spokeswoman Rachael Hamilton said: 'We all support improving the experience for trans people but that should never come at the expense of the safety of women and girls, and their hard-won rights. 'But Nicola Sturgeon's Bill – in the form that it has been passed – does put their safety at risk.' Tonight Alister Jack, the Secretary of State for Scotland, said he was examining whether to block the legislation.

Daily Mail

Hard to believe Scotland, the source of so much of the Enlightenment would descend into the retreat of reason. Hume will be spinning in his grave.

Nicola Sturgeon has two obsessions: separating Scotland from England, and advancing gender ideology. She has failed the former so has gone full throttle on the latter.

 

[TSwizzle]

Perhaps an exception would be reasonable if a pronoun is demonstrably harmful to a victim but there is no reason for courts to call people by anything other than their identity.

Great idea. I identify as royalty, the courts must address me as “Your Highness” from now on.

 

[ZiprHead]

Great idea. I identify as royalty, the courts must address me as “Your Highness” from now on.

 

[Bomb#20]

... A bid to block this loophole by inserting a clause ensuring those on the sex offenders' register cannot obtain a GRC failed by just one vote last night, after three days of furious debates. Scottish Conservative equalities spokeswoman Rachael Hamilton said: 'We all support improving the experience for trans people but that should never come at the expense of the safety of women and girls, and their hard-won rights. 'But Nicola Sturgeon's Bill – in the form that it has been passed – does put their safety at risk.' Tonight Alister Jack, the Secretary of State for Scotland, said he was examining whether to block the legislation.

...
Hard to believe Scotland, the source of so much of the Enlightenment would descend into the retreat of reason. Hume will be spinning in his grave.

Nicola Sturgeon has two obsessions: separating Scotland from England, and advancing gender ideology. She has failed the former so has gone full throttle on the latter.

I heard a hypothesis the other day that the whole purpose of passing such an extreme bill in the first place may have been to goad the UK cabinet into blocking it, so Sturgeon could use perceived English high-handedness as an argument for independence. Do you think Sturgeon is Machiavellian enough for that?

 

[Metaphor]

... A bid to block this loophole by inserting a clause ensuring those on the sex offenders' register cannot obtain a GRC failed by just one vote last night, after three days of furious debates. Scottish Conservative equalities spokeswoman Rachael Hamilton said: 'We all support improving the experience for trans people but that should never come at the expense of the safety of women and girls, and their hard-won rights. 'But Nicola Sturgeon's Bill – in the form that it has been passed – does put their safety at risk.' Tonight Alister Jack, the Secretary of State for Scotland, said he was examining whether to block the legislation.

...
Hard to believe Scotland, the source of so much of the Enlightenment would descend into the retreat of reason. Hume will be spinning in his grave.

Nicola Sturgeon has two obsessions: separating Scotland from England, and advancing gender ideology. She has failed the former so has gone full throttle on the latter.

I heard a hypothesis the other day that the whole purpose of passing such an extreme bill in the first place may have been to goad the UK cabinet into blocking it, so Sturgeon could use perceived English high-handedness as an argument for independence. Do you think Sturgeon is Machiavellian enough for that?

No - I think Sturgeon is a True Believer in both Causes - but that one might aid the other is a welcome side effect, I should imagine.

 

[Juma]

Dear oh dear;

Scottish First Minister Nicola Sturgeon was greeted with cries of 'shame on you' today as a controversial law on gender was voted through in Holyrood.
The Scottish parliament was suspended by a demonstration in the public gallery as MSPs passed the Gender Recognition Reform (Scotland) Bill by 86 to 39 this afternoon. It was the second protest of the day, with a demonstrator earlier shouting that 'no one is listening to women'. The Bill makes it easier to obtain a gender recognition certificate (GRC) on the basis of self-declaration and removing the need for a gender dysphoria diagnosis for anyone aged 16 or older. But opponents of the Bill have said it could endanger women and girls and put single-sex spaces at risk. They also fear violent male sex offenders who transition, including rapists and child abusers, will be able to force victims to use their female pronouns in court, increasing their trauma. A bid to block this loophole by inserting a clause ensuring those on the sex offenders' register cannot obtain a GRC failed by just one vote last night, after three days of furious debates. Scottish Conservative equalities spokeswoman Rachael Hamilton said: 'We all support improving the experience for trans people but that should never come at the expense of the safety of women and girls, and their hard-won rights. 'But Nicola Sturgeon's Bill – in the form that it has been passed – does put their safety at risk.' Tonight Alister Jack, the Secretary of State for Scotland, said he was examining whether to block the legislation.

Daily Mail

Hard to believe Scotland, the source of so much of the Enlightenment would descend into the retreat of reason. Hume will be spinning in his grave.

oh my... had forgot all theese old dustrats running around here at iidb...

 

[TSwizzle]

I heard a hypothesis the other day that the whole purpose of passing such an extreme bill in the first place may have been to goad the UK cabinet into blocking it, so Sturgeon could use perceived English high-handedness as an argument for independence. Do you think Sturgeon is Machiavellian enough for that?

Not really but she would certainly welcome that.

 

[TSwizzle]

An interesting development;

Rishi Sunak will block Nicola Sturgeon's controversial gender identity legislation from becoming law, it was confirmed tonight. In an unprecedented move, the Prime Minister will prevent the Holyrood legislation from receiving royal assent after warnings it would cause UK-wide legislative chaos. Mr Sunak's dramatic action swiftly set up a fresh row with Ms Sturgeon's SNP-led administration in Edinburgh.
His decision was announced just hours after the First Minister insisted it would be an 'outrage' if Westminster halted reforms passed by the Scottish Parliament last month. In the wake of the PM's move, Ms Sturgeon this evening hit out at a 'full-frontal attack' on Holyrood and vowed her Scottish Government would continue to defend the gender legislation.

Daily Mail

 

[Oleg]

An interesting development;

Rishi Sunak will block Nicola Sturgeon's controversial gender identity legislation from becoming law, it was confirmed tonight. In an unprecedented move, the Prime Minister will prevent the Holyrood legislation from receiving royal assent after warnings it would cause UK-wide legislative chaos. Mr Sunak's dramatic action swiftly set up a fresh row with Ms Sturgeon's SNP-led administration in Edinburgh.
His decision was announced just hours after the First Minister insisted it would be an 'outrage' if Westminster halted reforms passed by the Scottish Parliament last month. In the wake of the PM's move, Ms Sturgeon this evening hit out at a 'full-frontal attack' on Holyrood and vowed her Scottish Government would continue to defend the gender legislation.

Daily Mail

Conservatives are way down in the polls (they weren't governing like conservatives, anyway). This might help them in 2025. Could even fracture Labour.

Keir Starmer says 16 is too young for gender self-identification for trans people

The Labour leader has said he has 'concerns' about a controversial bill passed in Scotland that makes it easier to legally change gender.

uk.news.yahoo.com

 

[TSwizzle]

Starmer can't even say what a woman is. Labour are unelectable.