So if I decide that I am running late for work, speed and endanger other individuals its actually societies fault that I was late to work?
Yes, it is. Because society has failed in so many years to teach you reasons to understand that these actions are foolish, or in producing a situation where there is no option but to speed or to get to work late. It is equal.part the fault of parents who did not instill proper education as to how to get up in the morning, and in a natural world in which sometimes people.just forget to do things or are tempted insurmountably by biology to hit the snooze button too many times; by whatever course of events, a bad situation arose, and the solution to this is to produce ta few outcomes, all equally important: to educate you as to the reasons why speeding is illegal and I still in you an understanding of those reasons so you will find yourself not doing it, and to address whatever failures you have in wrangling your time properly. The bill for these corrective measures ought rest squarely on the shoulders of the society which failed to produce an adult who does not respect others enough to drive at a safe speed.
It's both a detterent and punishment for committing a wrong act. You are rewarding bad behavior. If I want to become President I don't go out and shoot him or her. If I want to be a bank teller I don't go out and rob a bank.
Do you understand how foolish this whole mess of your post is? Do you even know WHY people rob banks or kill presidents?
Read my post again, trying for comprehension this time. You can't cure cancer by punishing people who get cancer. You don't cure HIV by punishing those people who get HIV. You don't cure criminal ideation by punishing people who have criminal ideation. You cure cancer by cutting out the cancer and administering medicine. You 'cure' HIV by training people how to use condoms and by making PrEP available, and by giving medication. You cure criminal ideation by removing the situations that drive people to become criminals.
Few people WANT to be criminals. Even most of the minority that want that life are introduced to it in the first place by perceived necessity. This necessity will be present no matter how much of a punishment is present, and the *thrill* of being a criminal is increased by such a prospect of punishment.
Instead of punishing people for robbing banks we should be eliminating the benefit of the series of choices that lead to and include robbing banks. If you have food on your table, recreational choices that don't suck, and a roof over your head, skills to do a task people will praise you for, and a place to apply those skills, then robbing banks would, even to most (ex) bank robbers, look like an exercise in foolishness. If it does NOT look like an exercise in foolishness, if they 'break bad' merely to feel 'alive' then no amount of punishment will keep them from continuing to consume that drug. It is an addiction that needs to be treated or in the most concerning cases, interceded on with segration.
Yes, it is. Because society has failed in so many years to teach you reasons to understand that these actions are foolish, or in producing a situation where there is no option but to speed or to get to work late. It is equal.part the fault of parents who did not instill proper education as to how to get up in the morning, and in a natural world in which sometimes people.just forget to do things or are tempted insurmountably by biology to hit the snooze button too many times; by whatever course of events, a bad situation arose, and the solution to this is to produce ta few outcomes, all equally important: to educate you as to the reasons why speeding is illegal and I still in you an understanding of those reasons so you will find yourself not doing it, and to address whatever failures you have in wrangling your time properly. The bill for these corrective measures ought rest squarely on the shoulders of the society which failed to produce an adult who does not respect others enough to drive at a safe speed.
People do understand their acts, but if that don't get punished for those acts then there is no problem. If you reward bad behavior. You got your wish with that guy who raped a woman on campus and the judge said we couldn't take away his college for it. So maybe government should provide males with prostitutes so we won't have to rape.
People do understand their acts, but if that don't get punished for those acts then there is no problem. If you reward bad behavior. You got your wish with that guy who raped a woman on campus and the judge said we couldn't take away his college for it. So maybe government should provide males with prostitutes so we won't have to rape.
I agree that he shouldn't be barred from attending college, or prevented from getting a job in his chosen field. The caveat to that is that society just simply cannot afford to let such a person go freely among us, at least not until whatever drives him to rape rather than have real relationships is resolved. If his propensity to rape cannot be resolved, then it is our duty to ourselves and the 20 some years of work that we spent to produce a human being to give him the opportunity to finish his education in an environment where he cannot or will not rape people. If such a situation is unacceptable to him, then he can either choose to kill himself, and society takes the loss, or he does his best to make do in his situation, and we all do our best to make this unfortunate situation suck as little for them as possible. They didn't ask to be created, and they didn't ask to be shaped into a rapist. At any rate it is not rewarding his rape to let him continue to be a normal person, especially if he proves capable of it.
You continue trying to strawman my position; I do not suggest that we allow people to commit crimes, nor that we reward their commission.
This means that if someone comes to the police and says 'please, I think I might rape someone if left free' then they are just as deserving of the treatment and segregation as the person who has actually raped.
Eventually we will figure out what dysfunction of nurture, genetics, and inebriation that leads to the persistence of rapeist ideation and we'll be able to repair that damage. Or conversely we might figure out some manner of position in society for a rapist which does not lead to unwanted outcomes.
At any rate, your ridiculous straw man keeps failing. Please stop making such flaccid straw man arguments.
At least in this case you weren't rewarding the bad behavior, just not punishing it. So instead of going to jail for rapping a woman he has no punishment for it so in general there is no problem with a guy raping a woman.
Do you understand how foolish this whole mess of your post is? Do you even know WHY people rob banks or kill presidents?
Read my post again, trying for comprehension this time. You can't cure cancer by punishing people who get cancer. You don't cure HIV by punishing those people who get HIV. You don't cure criminal ideation by punishing people who have criminal ideation. You cure cancer by cutting out the cancer and administering medicine. You 'cure' HIV by training people how to use condoms and by making PrEP available, and by giving medication. You cure criminal ideation by removing the situations that drive people to become criminals.
Few people WANT to be criminals. Even most of the minority that want that life are introduced to it in the first place by perceived necessity. This necessity will be present no matter how much of a punishment is present, and the *thrill* of being a criminal is increased by such a prospect of punishment.
Instead of punishing people for robbing banks we should be eliminating the benefit of the series of choices that lead to and include robbing banks. If you have food on your table, recreational choices that don't suck, and a roof over your head, skills to do a task people will praise you for, and a place to apply those skills, then robbing banks would, even to most (ex) bank robbers, look like an exercise in foolishness. If it does NOT look like an exercise in foolishness, if they 'break bad' merely to feel 'alive' then no amount of punishment will keep them from continuing to consume that drug. It is an addiction that needs to be treated or in the most concerning cases, interceded on with segration.
Plenty of people choose the criminal lifestyle because they want the immediate reward crime brings rather than the hard work legal means bring.
I agree that he shouldn't be barred from attending college, or prevented from getting a job in his chosen field. The caveat to that is that society just simply cannot afford to let such a person go freely among us, at least not until whatever drives him to rape rather than have real relationships is resolved. If his propensity to rape cannot be resolved, then it is our duty to ourselves and the 20 some years of work that we spent to produce a human being to give him the opportunity to finish his education in an environment where he cannot or will not rape people. If such a situation is unacceptable to him, then he can either choose to kill himself, and society takes the loss, or he does his best to make do in his situation, and we all do our best to make this unfortunate situation suck as little for them as possible. They didn't ask to be created, and they didn't ask to be shaped into a rapist. At any rate it is not rewarding his rape to let him continue to be a normal person, especially if he proves capable of it.
You continue trying to strawman my position; I do not suggest that we allow people to commit crimes, nor that we reward their commission.
This means that if someone comes to the police and says 'please, I think I might rape someone if left free' then they are just as deserving of the treatment and segregation as the person who has actually raped.
Eventually we will figure out what dysfunction of nurture, genetics, and inebriation that leads to the persistence of rapeist ideation and we'll be able to repair that damage. Or conversely we might figure out some manner of position in society for a rapist which does not lead to unwanted outcomes.
At any rate, your ridiculous straw man keeps failing. Please stop making such flaccid straw man arguments.
At least in this case you weren't rewarding the bad behavior, just not punishing it. So instead of going to jail for rapping a woman he has no punishment for it so in general there is no problem with a guy raping a woman.
You want society to tell people that a behavior is bad but when society signals that the behavior is bad and especially how bad it is than that's wrong. The punishment for rape, jail time, etc, is society signallying to people that rape is wrong. If you don't punish rape, than it is saying that it's okay.
Justice is restitution to the victim for the crime committed. Yes they can't be un-raped but the punishment for that is a form of restitution for the person who the crime was committed upon. And you ask, why. The other women who aren't raped because of the punishment is a reason why. We can't stop all of the crime, but we certainly do try and control the amounts.
Justice is restitution to the victim for the crime committed. Yes they can't be un-raped but the punishment for that is a form of restitution for the person who the crime was committed upon. And you ask, why. The other women who aren't raped because of the punishment is a reason why. We can't stop all of the crime, but we certainly do try and control the amounts.
So in other words, his rape of her justifies her incarceration of him. One bad turn deserves another. That his suffering is justified by the happy drugs her body gives her when he suffers, in addition to the drugs your body gives you in seeing her make him suffer. That sounds an awful lot like rape to me, namely the justifications rapists give for it. Your argument is telling in that her abuse of her rapist is entirely aside from your goal.of segregating the rapist, which could be accomplished without his having to suffer.
So in other words, his rape of her justifies her incarceration of him. One bad turn deserves another. That his suffering is justified by the happy drugs her body gives her when he suffers, in addition to the drugs your body gives you in seeing her make him suffer. That sounds an awful lot like rape to me, namely the justifications rapists give for it. Your argument is telling in that her abuse of her rapist is entirely aside from your goal.of segregating the rapist, which could be accomplished without his having to suffer.
The rapist should be thankful that the state incarcerates for the crime for punishment. Without that, the victim and the victim's family will find the offender and inflict justice of their own.
The rapist should be thankful that the state incarcerates for the crime for punishment. Without that, the victim and the victim's family will find the offender and inflict justice of their own.
So the rapist should be thankful that they don't literally murdering him to get high on the feeling they get when they murder him.
That he should be thankful that they merely torture him *despite the fact that he can probably be repaired*.
How can you not see how vile and sick the mind that thinks these things is?
So the rapist should be thankful that they don't literally murdering him to get high on the feeling they get when they murder him.
That he should be thankful that they merely torture him *despite the fact that he can probably be repaired*.
How can you not see how vile and sick the mind that thinks these things is?
If you desire an ordered society, people expect criminals to be punished. If the state treats criminals with kid gloves, then people will step in and do the punishment. You may not like that, but advancing policies which ignore reality and human behavior is a recipe for disaster. And if the state does shirk its monopoly on violence, then the consequence of seeking retribution against a criminal is nothing. A cycle of blood feuds and tit-for-tat civil violence would be unavoidable.
If you desire an ordered society, people expect criminals to be punished. If the state treats criminals with kid gloves, then people will step in and do the punishment. You may not like that, but advancing policies which ignore reality and human behavior is a recipe for disaster. And if the state does shirk its monopoly on violence, then the consequence of seeking retribution against a criminal is nothing. A cycle of blood feuds and tit-for-tat civil violence would be unavoidable.
You say that, but the fact of the matter is, reality itself proves you are wrong. We've tried things my way and it's worked. I don't see Norway devolving into an orgy of anarchy and violence.
If you desire an ordered society, people expect criminals to be punished. If the state treats criminals with kid gloves, then people will step in and do the punishment. You may not like that, but advancing policies which ignore reality and human behavior is a recipe for disaster. And if the state does shirk its monopoly on violence, then the consequence of seeking retribution against a criminal is nothing. A cycle of blood feuds and tit-for-tat civil violence would be unavoidable.
You say that, but the fact of the matter is, reality itself proves you are wrong. We've tried things my way and it's worked. I don't see Norway devolving into an orgy of anarchy and violence.
The rapist should be thankful that the state incarcerates for the crime for punishment. Without that, the victim and the victim's family will find the offender and inflict justice of their own.
So the rapist should be thankful that they don't literally murdering him to get high on the feeling they get when they murder him.
That he should be thankful that they merely torture him *despite the fact that he can probably be repaired*.
How can you not see how vile and sick the mind that thinks these things is?
You say that, but the fact of the matter is, reality itself proves you are wrong. We've tried things my way and it's worked. I don't see Norway devolving into an orgy of anarchy and violence.
Using Norway as a foil is silly. Very different demographics. Very different crime rates. But if the consequence of me killing my daughter's rapist is a slap on the wrist, then I'll kill the fucker.
I posted videos earlier in the thread showing how people treat criminals where there is weak law and order. How would Norway's system deter people from doing that?
