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The Teletransporter Problem

PyramidHead

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From Sacramento State:

Derek Parfit’s Teletransporter Thought Experiment
from “Divided Minds and the Nature of Persons”

“Suppose that you enter a cubicle in which, when you press a button, a scanner records the states of all the cells in your brain and body, destroying both while doing so. This information is then transmitted at the speed of light to some other planet, where a replicator produces a perfect organic copy of you. Since the brain of your Replica is exactly like yours, it will seem to remember living your life up to the moment when you pressed the button, its character will be just like yours, and it will be in every other way psychologically continuous with you.”

Are you willing to press the button?

Let’s add that “you” will be paid a million dollars for participating in the experiment when “you” arrive at the other planet. (By “you”, I mean the duplicate, of course).

If you believe that you will survive pressing the button (and hence, the destruction of your body), then presumably this is because you believe that the duplicate will be you.

Are you sure it will be you? Consider the following variation:

Slight Delay. When you press the button, your body will not be destroyed right away. In fact, you are able to talk to the duplicate via satellites for a few minutes while they warm up the disintegrator. (The technology itself doesn’t require that your body be destroyed, you see, but it has to be destroyed for legal reasons). If the duplicate is you, then that would mean that you are talking to yourself. But you are talking to someone on another planet…

There are many other aspects to the problem, but I want to focus on just this one. If you were sure that the technology worked, would you press the button in both variations, or just one (or neither)?

I believe that pushing the button under either scenario would be irreversible suicide from the perspective of the person pushing the button. My argument goes something like this:

i.
The first scenario (simultaneous destruction and replication), is not different in any relevant way from the variation (slight delay between destruction and replication). That is, anything that is true about someone who presses the button in the first scenario is true in the variation as well. Thus, the variation can be used in place of the first scenario for the purposes of demonstrating a point, or revealing intuitions about personal continuity.

ii.
In the variation, after the duplicate is made but before the button-pusher is destroyed, there are two beings. This is evidenced by the fact that they can have a brief conversation with each other via satellite. At that moment, one being is experiencing the sensory data associated with sitting in front of a button in a cubicle on Earth, while the other being's sensory data is associated with sitting in a duplication chamber on Mars. By this, we can infer that it feels different to be the button-pusher versus being the duplicate. For instance, if a Martian mosquito buzzes by the duplicate's head, the button-pusher will not experience it, any more than the duplicate would experience the smell of Indian food in a room adjacent to the button-pusher's cubicle. Their first-person perspectives are completely restricted to the brains they currently occupy.

Note that it may still be true that both beings can legitimately claim to be the same person: they both have the same physical makeup as of minutes ago, so they share all the same memories, opinions, scars, personality traits, etc. But since it is obvious that, after the duplicate is created, being the button-pusher involves a vastly divergent set of first-person experiences compared to being the duplicate, they do not share a single consciousness. After the duplication event, even if the button-pusher is not destroyed, his first-person perspective will never represent what it is like to be the duplicate.

iii.
From all this, I infer that the button-pusher will not enjoy the benefits of having an extra $1 million USD. If he is unable to experience the Martian mosquito from his cubicle on Earth, he will certainly never experience spending the reward money. It is thus irrational for the button-pusher to weigh the pros and cons of pushing the button based on the expected financial reward, since from his perspective, he will not actually be the one enjoying the reward. Again, someone who can legitimately claim to be the same person as him may enjoy the reward, but that experience will not be continuous with the button-pusher's incoming flow of sense data. When his entire body is destroyed in a few minutes, the button-pusher's internal perspective will cease to exist based on uncontroversial assumptions about bodily integrity. Although the duplicate on Mars will have a nearly identical internal perspective, which contains the same sense experiences as the button-pusher's up until a few minutes ago, the fact that they were unable to access each other's direct experiences during the slight delay proves that being two identical instances of the same consciousness does not entail having the same subjective experiences.

iv.
I define death as the permanent cessation of an individual stream of subjective experience. It is what we say of a being for whom it is irreversibly no longer like anything to be, when at a prior time it was like something to be this being. Sleep is not death, as the cessation of the individual's subjective experience is only temporary, and resumes in the same body and brain upon awakening. Gradual replacement of cells and/or particles over time is not death, as the functional inter-relationships (between organs, tissues, neuronal junctions, etc.) that are necessary for bodily survival are not broken during gradual replacement. However, a being whose internal sensations progress from sitting in a cubicle, to pushing a button, to having a short conversation via satellite, and to being disintegrated on the spot, is a being that has died.

Moreover, whether an individual bundle of psychologically continuous experiences ceases or goes on living is a fact about that individual consciousness, unaffected by causally isolated events taking place elsewhere in the solar system. Police officers at the scene of a murder do not need to consult a telescope to check whether the victim is dead. She may have uploaded her physical composition to a scanner and shot it off to Venus minutes before being murdered, and the duplicate on Venus would make a great material witness in the court proceedings, because she has all the memories of the murder victim. But the unfortunate victim herself experienced being violently murdered followed by nothing at all forever. Her consciousness was interrupted by the physical trauma that caused her brain to irreparably shut down. Her brain did not check to see if there were any identical brains across the cosmos, into which her first-person vantage point could jump and proceed unabated. Like the button-pusher in Parfit's example, her life is over.

v.
Now that you've heard what I'm claiming, here is what I'm not claiming. I am not saying that the duplicate created by the teletransporter machine is any less the same person as the button-pusher, from the perspective of outside observers. The duplicate would be able to travel back to Earth and take his family and friends on a charming vacation with the reward money, and they would have no reason to treat him any differently than the person who stepped into the cubicle. He is not an impostor nor a fake. His wife is justified in loving him just as much as she has always loved her husband. But recall: all of those things would be true even if the button-pusher were not destroyed. Since their physiological makeups are organically and psychologically indistinguishable, the pair of beings could both enjoy the reward with their family and friends... which would probably be really awkward, but not because one of them was more authentic than the other. Yet, as their sensory input would remain restricted to spatially distinct brains and bodies, death would be permanent for either in the event of a fatal injury or debilitating disease.

For these reasons, I do not believe a teletransporter would be a beneficial technology for the people using it. For society at large, or indeed for the human race, it could turn out to be the key to spreading our species across the galaxy. But that would be at the expense of terminating the localized consciousness of anyone who pushes the button, in a manner no less real than dying in a plane crash or a hunting accident. If death is something we wish to avoid because we have preferences that can only be satisfied by continuing to live, the fact that our duplicates will be able to satisfy those preferences is little consolation in the face of my imminent oblivion. It would not be enough to say that the person who satisfies my preferences is the same person as me. It would also need to be the case that my internal, subjective, first-person conscious experiences would be continuous with the person who satisfies my preferences. Otherwise, I would never experience the satisfaction of my preferences, any more than I experience your satisfaction of your preferences. As far as we know, the only way to guarantee such continuity is to preserve its local substrate, i.e. my brain.*

*This does not rule out "uploading" consciousness to a new substrate, at least not in any way I can think of, as long as the process is slow enough that at any given time, the consciousness of the being undergoing the procedure is not fully broken down and then reconstructed.

Disclaimer:

The Teletransporter Problem is my favorite conundrum in philosophy. I find it interesting because it identifies something unique about consciousness in a way that is provocative to me, as I am also intrigued by issues about death and mortality. I gobble up fictional material that deals with the problem directly, such as the film The Prestige, or as part of its larger universe, like Star Trek.

 
Scenario 1) Its no different than going to sleep and should really be ok but feels wrong because of the possibility of scenario 2.
Scenario 2) makes it too obvious to agree to...
 
Scenario 1) Its no different than going to sleep and should really be ok but feels wrong because of the possibility of scenario 2.
Scenario 2) makes it too obvious to agree to...

Exactly. I was going to make it a poll, and ask how many people were fine with scenario 1 before reading scenario 2. As I attempted to argue, there are no real differences between the two scenarios with regards to the outcome. If scenario 1 is just like going to sleep, so is scenario 2. Adding a slight time delay should not make it any less like sleep, if the analogy truly works.
 
Scenario 1) Its no different than going to sleep and should really be ok but feels wrong because of the possibility of scenario 2.
Scenario 2) makes it too obvious to agree to...

Exactly. I was going to make it a poll, and ask how many people were fine with scenario 1 before reading scenario 2. As I attempted to argue, there are no real differences between the two scenarios with regards to the outcome. If scenario 1 is just like going to sleep, so is scenario 2. Adding a slight time delay should not make it any less like sleep, if the analogy truly works.

Exactly. the problem is how we are hardwired to feel continuity where there isnt one.
 
Me I don't see any significant difference with actual life. Your scenarios, both of them, seem definitely more dangerous than the kind of life I have (essentially because there is involved a machine which is designed by human beings rather than just my body, designed by God). So, basically, I wouldn't press anything at all, least of all the button. Money is not an issue, I don't spend much. I also already have reincarnation promised to me, by God, at some point in the future, free of charge. Still, these are minor points. The main point is that if you could assume in all certainty that the machine will work properly, you wouldn't have any rational reason for not pressing the button since there would be no difference with actual life except the money.

In practice, we are not rational people, though.
EB
 
Me I don't see any significant difference with actual life. Your scenarios, both of them, seem definitely more dangerous than the kind of life I have (essentially because there is involved a machine which is designed by human beings rather than just my body, designed by God). So, basically, I wouldn't press anything at all, least of all the button. Money is not an issue, I don't spend much. I also already have reincarnation promised to me, by God, at some point in the future, free of charge. Still, these are minor points.

They are also false statements, but that's the topic for another thread.

The main point is that if you could assume in all certainty that the machine will work properly, you wouldn't have any rational reason for not pressing the button since there would be no difference with actual life except the money.

What does 'work properly' mean in this context? If the machine works as described, the person who pushes the button will die from being dematerialized. The duplicate will get to spend the money. If he doesn't press the button, the duplicate is never created, so nobody gets the money. Either way, from the perspective of the guy pushing the button, there is no possible way he (the button-pusher) can get the money.
 
What does 'work properly' mean in this context? If the machine works as described, the person who pushes the button will die from being dematerialized. The duplicate will get to spend the money. If he doesn't press the button, the duplicate is never created, so nobody gets the money. Either way, from the perspective of the guy pushing the button, there is no possible way he (the button-pusher) can get the money.

But what's the difference between the person who presses the button and the person who gets the money? He dies, gets brought back from the dead and then gets a million bucks.
 
What does 'work properly' mean in this context? If the machine works as described, the person who pushes the button will die from being dematerialized. The duplicate will get to spend the money. If he doesn't press the button, the duplicate is never created, so nobody gets the money. Either way, from the perspective of the guy pushing the button, there is no possible way he (the button-pusher) can get the money.

But what's the difference between the person who presses the button and the person who gets the money? He dies, gets brought back from the dead and then gets a million bucks.

Their sense experiences are vastly different. In the variation scenario, they were both conscious on separate planets for the few minutes it took to warm up the disintegrator. During this period, the guy who pushed the button is not experiencing anything that happens to the duplicate created on Mars. He is still experiencing the sensation of sitting in front of a button in a cubicle on Earth, waiting to be disintegrated. The duplicate on Mars is experiencing whatever it feels like to be on Mars. This is proof that they are two separate consciousnesses, so what happens to one will not necessarily be experienced by the other. If the duplicate on Mars stubs his toe, the button-pusher on Earth will not feel it, and vice versa. Ergo, if the duplicate on Mars gets a million bucks, the button-pusher will not experience that either.
 
But what's the difference between the person who presses the button and the person who gets the money? He dies, gets brought back from the dead and then gets a million bucks.

Their sense experiences are vastly different. In the variation scenario, they were both conscious on separate planets for the few minutes it took to warm up the disintegrator. During this period, the guy who pushed the button is not experiencing anything that happens to the duplicate created on Mars. He is still experiencing the sensation of sitting in front of a button in a cubicle on Earth, waiting to be disintegrated. The duplicate on Mars is experiencing whatever it feels like to be on Mars. This is proof that they are two separate consciousnesses, so what happens to one will not necessarily be experienced by the other. If the duplicate on Mars stubs his toe, the button-pusher on Earth will not feel it, and vice versa. Ergo, if the duplicate on Mars gets a million bucks, the button-pusher will not experience that either.

Ya, I agree with you that if the former has experiences that the latter does not, then they become different people as a result of those experiences. However, if one stops and then the other starts, then there's zero difference between the guy stepping into a wormhole and being transported to Mars and the guy being disintegrated and reintegrated on Mars. There's no information lost.
 
Their sense experiences are vastly different. In the variation scenario, they were both conscious on separate planets for the few minutes it took to warm up the disintegrator. During this period, the guy who pushed the button is not experiencing anything that happens to the duplicate created on Mars. He is still experiencing the sensation of sitting in front of a button in a cubicle on Earth, waiting to be disintegrated. The duplicate on Mars is experiencing whatever it feels like to be on Mars. This is proof that they are two separate consciousnesses, so what happens to one will not necessarily be experienced by the other. If the duplicate on Mars stubs his toe, the button-pusher on Earth will not feel it, and vice versa. Ergo, if the duplicate on Mars gets a million bucks, the button-pusher will not experience that either.

Ya, I agree with you that if the former has experiences that the latter does not, then they become different people as a result of those experiences. However, if one stops and then the other starts, then there's zero difference between the guy stepping into a wormhole and being transported to Mars and the guy being disintegrated and reintegrated on Mars. There's no information lost.

So you are saying that the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies? You don't find that mechanism a little strange?
 
Ya, I agree with you that if the former has experiences that the latter does not, then they become different people as a result of those experiences. However, if one stops and then the other starts, then there's zero difference between the guy stepping into a wormhole and being transported to Mars and the guy being disintegrated and reintegrated on Mars. There's no information lost.

So you are saying that the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies? You don't find that mechanism a little strange?

No, not at all. It has to do with whether or not there is any information lost between the original and the copy. If there's not, then there's no difference between the original continuing as the original or the original continuing as the copy. The guy is ressurected exactly as he was and just continues. If the original sticks around, then the copy is a former version of himself and not a continuation of himself.
 
So you are saying that the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies? You don't find that mechanism a little strange?

No, not at all. It has to do with whether or not there is any information lost between the original and the copy. If there's not, then there's no difference between the original continuing as the original or the original continuing as the copy. The guy is ressurected exactly as he was and just continues. If the original sticks around, then the copy is a former version of himself and not a continuation of himself.

Yes, but it really kinda ignores the human factor right? Isn't this akin to say, having two hard drives. Now, I take the info stored in hard drive A and cut it and paste it into hard drive B. There's no information lost. Now I take a hammer and destroy a perfectly good hard drive A. There is a loss, because hard drive A can no longer store data. I wouldn't want to be hard drive A. :p
 
No, not at all. It has to do with whether or not there is any information lost between the original and the copy. If there's not, then there's no difference between the original continuing as the original or the original continuing as the copy. The guy is ressurected exactly as he was and just continues. If the original sticks around, then the copy is a former version of himself and not a continuation of himself.

Yes, but it really kinda ignores the human factor right? Isn't this akin to say, having two hard drives. Now, I take the info stored in hard drive A and cut it and paste it into hard drive B. There's no information lost. Now I take a hammer and destroy a perfectly good hard drive A. There is a loss, because hard drive A can no longer store data. I wouldn't want to be hard drive A. :p

You're hard drive B at this point, so no worries. The only human factor it ignores is the fictional dualistic one where we are somehow more than the sum of our parts.

The computer gets turned off and then the computer gets turned on with identical data in the hard drive. Why would it matter either way if it was A or B in there?
 
So you are saying that the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies? You don't find that mechanism a little strange?

No, not at all. It has to do with whether or not there is any information lost between the original and the copy. If there's not, then there's no difference between the original continuing as the original or the original continuing as the copy. The guy is ressurected exactly as he was and just continues. If the original sticks around, then the copy is a former version of himself and not a continuation of himself.

That's exactly the same thing as saying the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies. Any gap, no matter how small, will contain information not captured by the duplicate. A millisecond delay between duplication and disintegration is the difference between the original person reaping the benefits of $1 million USD and ceasing to exist forever. I don't really see how that concept holds up to scrutiny. It's much more parsimonious to say that, regardless of when the original is terminated, he can never be aware of what is going on in the duplicate's sensory environment because they are two different beings.
 
Yes, but it really kinda ignores the human factor right? Isn't this akin to say, having two hard drives. Now, I take the info stored in hard drive A and cut it and paste it into hard drive B. There's no information lost. Now I take a hammer and destroy a perfectly good hard drive A. There is a loss, because hard drive A can no longer store data. I wouldn't want to be hard drive A. :p

You're hard drive B at this point, so no worries. The only human factor it ignores is the fictional dualistic one where we are somehow more than the sum of our parts.

The computer gets turned off and then the computer gets turned on with identical data in the hard drive. Why would it matter either way if it was A or B in there?

It wouldn't, because it doesn't feel like anything to be hard drive. It makes no sense to ask what would take place from the perspective of hard drive A, but it does make sense to ask what would take place from the perspective of a person. It's not dualism, it's just acknowledging that people have perspectives and computers don't. The difference is one of degree, not type, but the difference is still real.
 
No, not at all. It has to do with whether or not there is any information lost between the original and the copy. If there's not, then there's no difference between the original continuing as the original or the original continuing as the copy. The guy is ressurected exactly as he was and just continues. If the original sticks around, then the copy is a former version of himself and not a continuation of himself.

That's exactly the same thing as saying the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies. Any gap, no matter how small, will contain information not captured by the duplicate. A millisecond delay between duplication and disintegration is the difference between the original person reaping the benefits of $1 million USD and ceasing to exist forever. I don't really see how that concept holds up to scrutiny. It's much more parsimonious to say that, regardless of when the original is terminated, he can never be aware of what is going on in the duplicate's sensory environment because they are two different beings.

If by "different" you mean "exactly the same" then I agree with you.
 
That's exactly the same thing as saying the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies. Any gap, no matter how small, will contain information not captured by the duplicate. A millisecond delay between duplication and disintegration is the difference between the original person reaping the benefits of $1 million USD and ceasing to exist forever. I don't really see how that concept holds up to scrutiny. It's much more parsimonious to say that, regardless of when the original is terminated, he can never be aware of what is going on in the duplicate's sensory environment because they are two different beings.

If by "different" you mean "exactly the same" then I agree with you.

As I say in my OP, I do not dispute that they are both the same person, but there is a separate concern of whether they share the same consciousness. Clearly, since it is possible for one being to experience life on Mars while the other waits to be disintegrated, they are capable of experiencing different things, and this would be true even if there were no time delay. Since they are capable of experiencing mutually exclusive things at the same time, they cannot possibly be the same consciousness, so there is no mechanism to establish continuity between them.
 
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That's exactly the same thing as saying the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies. Any gap, no matter how small, will contain information not captured by the duplicate. A millisecond delay between duplication and disintegration is the difference between the original person reaping the benefits of $1 million USD and ceasing to exist forever. I don't really see how that concept holds up to scrutiny. It's much more parsimonious to say that, regardless of when the original is terminated, he can never be aware of what is going on in the duplicate's sensory environment because they are two different beings.

If by "different" you mean "exactly the same" then I agree with you.

One person is destroyed at x1,y1,z1,t1 and another begins at the same time and in the exact same location, okay. Even if there is absolutely no trace that the person was "replaced", there is still a difference. The original was destroyed, and the clone was created.

However, the reality is that anything that happens will have a physical "record" in the universe that exists objectively. So there will always be information that one person was destroyed and another created. Information can be lost for an observer, but it must exist somewhere.
 
Additionally (Tom Sawyer):

Let's suppose that the person is replaced with a clone and someway somehow there is no information in the universe that exists to show that this happened, okay.

Now you have a bigger problem. You now have to choose between truth/logic/mind and scientific observation / physicalism. If it is indeed true that the person were replaced, then physicalism is false, or at best it is limited in explaining the universe.
 
No, not at all. It has to do with whether or not there is any information lost between the original and the copy. If there's not, then there's no difference between the original continuing as the original or the original continuing as the copy. The guy is ressurected exactly as he was and just continues. If the original sticks around, then the copy is a former version of himself and not a continuation of himself.

That's exactly the same thing as saying the timing of killing the button-pusher, and nothing else, decides what will happen after he dies. Any gap, no matter how small, will contain information not captured by the duplicate. A millisecond delay between duplication and disintegration is the difference between the original person reaping the benefits of $1 million USD and ceasing to exist forever. I don't really see how that concept holds up to scrutiny. It's much more parsimonious to say that, regardless of when the original is terminated, he can never be aware of what is going on in the duplicate's sensory environment because they are two different beings.

So if I go out on a pub-crawl, and get out of my tree, then come home and pass out; and when i wake up the following afternoon, I have no recollection whatsoever of anything that happened after 10pm, despite having pictures and witness evidence and a road cone in my bed and some unexplained bruises as proof that I did stuff during that time period between buying another round at 10pm and collapsing into bed at 5am, then you are saying that the discontinuity in my consciousness means that I am not the same person any more?

Because that scenario leads to exactly the same result. bilby A gets in the machine; presses the button, then bilby A goes for a cup of coffee, chats up the pretty transporter technician, and then gets disintegrated. bilby B steps out of the transporter station on Mars with no recollection of the coffee or the transporter technician.

Perhaps they have a Skype chat. bilby A spends a few minutes cursing and swearing at bilby B for murdering him and stealing his money, wife and bank account; and then dies. bilby B takes a trip to Mars, gets an abusive Skype call from someone who looks familiar and apparently has a seriously bad attitude, and then gets on with his life.

That bilby B has no recollection of anything bilby A does is not particularly important; bilbys A and B have huge gaps in their knowledge of what bilby did before he ever set foot in the teleportation corporation building.

The teleporter takes one person, splits him into two indistinguishable parts whose only difference is their location, and then kills one of them. The survivor is the same person who walked into the transporter to begin with - and so is the deceased.

Discontinuity of consciousness and loss of memory are already things we have experience of. Nothing that the machine does is distinguishable from these familiar phenomena.
 
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