Trucker GoFundMe (split from: Covid-19 miscellany)

[TomC]

I don't know what specific acts the convoy is accused of that is illegal, but if there are some, those acts are surely carried out by some people, not all of them.

You go from big picture to minutiae, apparently to dodge issues you'd rather avoid.
I'm confident that if some people parked in the center of 2nd and Washington str. (seriously important intersection in my town) it wouldn't matter what cause they were supporting. Somebody would quickly figure out what statutes they're violating. Similarly, I don't know Canadian laws and don't know how to distinguish between the actual lawbreakers and other folks caught in the mess.
Nor do I know how GFM was expected to disburse $10M to the truckers. Hire people to walk around with wads of cash? I just don't know the small details. Nor do I care.
The main problem here is that the truckers/supporters who started a GFM page are now fundraising for criminal activities. Whatever they meant to do, or thought they were doing, that's what's happening now. It's a big game changer. I've got no sympathy for any of them. You pays your money, you takes your chance.
Tom

 

[Metaphor]

You go from big picture to minutiae, apparently to dodge issues you'd rather avoid.

I assure you, your inferences about my motivations are incorrect.

The main problem here is that the truckers/supporters who started a GFM page are now fundraising for criminal activities. Whatever they meant to do, or thought they were doing, that's what's happening now. It's a big game changer. I've got no sympathy for any of them. You pays your money, you takes your chance.

GFM stopped accepting donations for the convoy after a time, so there was no 'fundraising for criminal activities'.

You appear to have a double standard. You do not appear to care at all about GFM allowing the original fundraiser when it had the same information that the original donors had. Yet you blame the original donors for 'donating to criminals' but not GFM for setting up the infrastructure and approving a project that donated to criminals.

 

[Jarhyn]

You go from big picture to minutiae, apparently to dodge issues you'd rather avoid.

I assure you, your inferences about my motivations are incorrect.

The main problem here is that the truckers/supporters who started a GFM page are now fundraising for criminal activities. Whatever they meant to do, or thought they were doing, that's what's happening now. It's a big game changer. I've got no sympathy for any of them. You pays your money, you takes your chance.

GFM stopped accepting donations for the convoy after a time, so there was no 'fundraising for criminal activities'.

You appear to have a double standard. You do not appear to care at all about GFM allowing the original fundraiser when it had the same information that the original donors had. Yet you blame the original donors for 'donating to criminals' but not GFM for setting up the infrastructure and approving a project that donated to criminals.

I don't personally think the criminals were ever not obviously bioterrorists, but GFM has a lot going on.

People start GFM pages all the time for everything from sympathy begging to simping, to this shit.

I'm just glad they caught it once it got big enough to notice.

 

[Metaphor]

You go from big picture to minutiae, apparently to dodge issues you'd rather avoid.

I assure you, your inferences about my motivations are incorrect.

The main problem here is that the truckers/supporters who started a GFM page are now fundraising for criminal activities. Whatever they meant to do, or thought they were doing, that's what's happening now. It's a big game changer. I've got no sympathy for any of them. You pays your money, you takes your chance.

GFM stopped accepting donations for the convoy after a time, so there was no 'fundraising for criminal activities'.

You appear to have a double standard. You do not appear to care at all about GFM allowing the original fundraiser when it had the same information that the original donors had. Yet you blame the original donors for 'donating to criminals' but not GFM for setting up the infrastructure and approving a project that donated to criminals.

I don't personally think the criminals were ever not obviously bioterrorists, but GFM has a lot going on.

People start GFM pages all the time for everything from sympathy begging to simping, to this shit.

I'm just glad they caught it once it got big enough to notice.

Great double standard story, you should tell it at parties.

 

[Jarhyn]

You go from big picture to minutiae, apparently to dodge issues you'd rather avoid.

I assure you, your inferences about my motivations are incorrect.

The main problem here is that the truckers/supporters who started a GFM page are now fundraising for criminal activities. Whatever they meant to do, or thought they were doing, that's what's happening now. It's a big game changer. I've got no sympathy for any of them. You pays your money, you takes your chance.

GFM stopped accepting donations for the convoy after a time, so there was no 'fundraising for criminal activities'.

You appear to have a double standard. You do not appear to care at all about GFM allowing the original fundraiser when it had the same information that the original donors had. Yet you blame the original donors for 'donating to criminals' but not GFM for setting up the infrastructure and approving a project that donated to criminals.

I don't personally think the criminals were ever not obviously bioterrorists, but GFM has a lot going on.

People start GFM pages all the time for everything from sympathy begging to simping, to this shit.

I'm just glad they caught it once it got big enough to notice.

Great double standard story, you should tell it at parties.

I mean their whole goal was to block highways so they could cross borders more readily as potential carrier vectors, under the bad faith guise of "freedumb".

That's pretty obviously evil, terroristic shit, when you say all that out loud without spin.

It's just easy to miss sometimes in the spin of the language that goes up around such full-court presses from evil.

 

[Metaphor]

I mean their whole goal was to block highways so they could cross borders more readily as potential carrier vectors, under the bad faith guise of "freedumb".

That's pretty obviously evil, terroristic shit, when you say all that out loud without spin.

It's just easy to miss sometimes in the spin of the language that goes up around such full-court presses from evil.

Hi Deep End, here's Jarhyn. Of course, you're well acquainted with each other already.

 

[Jarhyn]

I mean their whole goal was to block highways so they could cross borders more readily as potential carrier vectors, under the bad faith guise of "freedumb".

That's pretty obviously evil, terroristic shit, when you say all that out loud without spin.

It's just easy to miss sometimes in the spin of the language that goes up around such full-court presses from evil.

Hi Deep End, here's Jarhyn. Of course, you're well acquainted with each other already.

The deep end is not even seeing what they are being hammered into. We are back to "people who are fucked up and evil".

You have often enough expressed doubt in the principles I espouse which amount to "be yourself, but don't be a dick about it!"

The fact that you think that's off the deep end when actually pursued is telling.

 

[Trausti]

I don't know whether GoFundMe tried to steal money or just handled the situation badly. But what can be said is that its cancellation of the Truckers campaign was in bad faith. It cited illegal activity; yet, it had no problem with campaigns supporting the 2020 riots. The silver lining is that a competitor, givesendgo, got a lot of free advertising. A parallel economy is in our future.

 

[Metaphor]

The deep end is not even seeing what they are being hammered into. We are back to "people who are fucked up and evil".

The fact that you think opposing the government forcing medical procedures on unconsenting adults, procedures solely for the benefit of other people, is 'fucked up and evil', tells everyone what they need to know about you and your moral values.

 

[RVonse]

I don't know whether GoFundMe tried to steal money or just handled the situation badly. But what can be said is that its cancellation of the Truckers campaign was in bad faith. It cited illegal activity; yet, it had no problem with campaigns supporting the 2020 riots. The silver lining is that a competitor, givesendgo, got a lot of free advertising. A parallel economy is in our future.

That's the beauty of capitalism. You make enough bad moves and mistakes and your competitors can and will take over the market share. Even if you hold a monopoly position. Example: Kodak.

 

[ZiprHead]

I bolded it above.

Oh, I see. You think
Do you think GFM should have automatically refunded the donators, or do you think they should have stuck to their original announced position of disbursing it to charities of its choosing?

is an unacceptable lie of omission, because, I presume, I did not append 'for funds that had not been manually refunded by application of the donors', even though I make multiple references to that situation in other posts and could not possibly be deceiving anybody reading the thread.

I will endeavour to make my posts less succinct in future.

You only addressed it after you were called out on your omission.

 

[Toni]

GFM had a well documented process for refunding monies. When GFM determined that the truckers protest did not fall within the parameters of GFM’s business model, it announced how it would handle those donated funds according to corporate policy. Very quickly, but not instantaneously, it said it would refund all donations without the usual procedures GFM had in place for handling refunds.

I doubt very much if anyone posting here is familiar with the systems and complexities of refunding $10M, split among thousands of donors, correctly identifying those donors and all of their individual ccs, PayPal accts. etc. on such a scale as this in such a short time frame. GFM’s reversal happened very quickly. I think they deserve some props here.

But alt-right’s gonna rage like alt-right’s gonna do.

 

[TomC]

GFM had a well documented process for refunding monies. When GFM determined that the truckers protest did not fall within the parameters of GFM’s business model, it announced how it would handle those donated funds according to corporate policy. Very quickly, but not instantaneously, it said it would refund all donations without the usual procedures GFM had in place for handling refunds.

I doubt very much if anyone posting here is familiar with the systems and complexities of refunding $10M, split among thousands of donors, correctly identifying those donors and all of their individual ccs, PayPal accts. etc. on such a scale as this in such a short time frame. GFM’s reversal happened very quickly. I think they deserve some props here.

But alt-right’s gonna rage like alt-right’s gonna do.

I'm completely unfamiliar with GFM or anything like it. But even cynical me was quite sure the reality was something like this.
Tom

 

[Toni]

GFM had a well documented process for refunding monies. When GFM determined that the truckers protest did not fall within the parameters of GFM’s business model, it announced how it would handle those donated funds according to corporate policy. Very quickly, but not instantaneously, it said it would refund all donations without the usual procedures GFM had in place for handling refunds.

I doubt very much if anyone posting here is familiar with the systems and complexities of refunding $10M, split among thousands of donors, correctly identifying those donors and all of their individual ccs, PayPal accts. etc. on such a scale as this in such a short time frame. GFM’s reversal happened very quickly. I think they deserve some props here.

But alt-right’s gonna rage like alt-right’s gonna do.

I'm completely unfamiliar with GFM or anything like it. But even cynical me was quite sure the reality was something like this.
Tom

I've used GFM to help out a couple of friends who had accts. set up or had them set up on their behalf. I heard directly from recipients so I know that they got the funds although to be frank, we never mentioned dollar amounts. It was very, very, very difficult for them to have to admit they needed help. GFM is just a ...convenient way to help someone. I don't know if GFM takes a cut of what is donated but you DO have the option to 'tip.' Actually, I think there is a small percentage fee....It's been a while so I don't remember.

 

[ZiprHead]

I've used GFM to help out a couple of friends who had accts. set up or had them set up on their behalf. I heard directly from recipients so I know that they got the funds although to be frank, we never mentioned dollar amounts. It was very, very, very difficult for them to have to admit they needed help. GFM is just a ...convenient way to help someone. I don't know if GFM takes a cut of what is donated but you DO have the option to 'tip.' Actually, I think there is a small percentage fee....It's been a while so I don't remember.

Yup, like Paypal, they take a small fee for every transaction. But when you're doing tens of thousands of transactions daily those small fees add up to big bucks.

 

[Metaphor]

But alt-right’s gonna rage like alt-right’s gonna do.

Even GFM did not propose Lists of Names of Dissenters to be sent to the Proper Authorities, like one poster here did.

 

[Toni]

But alt-right’s gonna rage like alt-right’s gonna do.

Even GFM did not propose Lists of Names of Dissenters to be sent to the Proper Authorities, like one poster here did.

Dissenters?

You can call me out directly, you know. I am not offended.

 

[Metaphor]

But alt-right’s gonna rage like alt-right’s gonna do.

Even GFM did not propose Lists of Names of Dissenters to be sent to the Proper Authorities, like one poster here did.

Dissenters?

You can call me out directly, you know. I am not offended.

Toni, I already did, multiple times, in this thread.

 

[Derec]

[starts thread about Canadian truckers protesting vax mandates by blocking highways]

Lpetrich, why do you think these protesters blocking highways are different than #BLMers blocking highways?
When #BLMers started with this tactic I told you guys that if you support this tactic, there is nothing from prevent others from using it as well.
What's the difference?

Seems to me that the right-wingers will howl over Big-Tech "persecution", even though they loudly claim that anything goes when it's a business that does it.

As far as GoFundMe, they have in the past been rather biased as to which causes they would allow and which not.

I think businesses like GoFundMe, but also Facebook and Twitter, should have clear rules that are applied equally. Not this ideological favoritism.

 

[Derec]

People donated to the convoy, via GoFundMe, with the understanding that GoFundMe would give the money to the convoy.
GoFundMe gave 1/10 of the total donated funds to the convoy before it decided, unilaterally, that the convoy violated its terms of usage.

What "terms of usage" did the truckers violate and how come "terms of use" weren't applied to the Seattle occupation?
FLASHBACK: GoFundMe supported Antifa-occupied ‘CHAZ/CHOP’ even after people were murdered

GoFundMe should either have donated the money as per the original understanding to the convoy, or automatically issued refunds without the need for people to apply via a form. Their plan to not automatically refund or give to the convoy was theft.
Thankfully (probably because of the tide of public opinion against them) they decided to automatically refund.

Yes, it was attempted theft. GoFundMe is a garbage company.

I do not support the anti-vax trucker's aims or goals. But they should not be treated differently than left-wing groups doing the same thing.

People on here have defended #BLM when they blocked highways and even when they occupied parts of cities for weeks. What's the difference?