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What is a "good" religion?

steve_bank said:
Jesus put his morality above all else. For example condemning fornication. I would assume those who identify as Christians, for example Gnostic Chrstians, also condemn fornication.
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Are you thinking of where he is says, let him without sin cast the first stone?

If you define fornication as, --- sexual intercourse between people not married to each other ---, then no, I do not condemn such, unless it is a breach of trust.

Sexual activity is necessary and good for humans.

I am lenient on sins of bed and bottle.

No harm, no foul.

I am a Gnostic Christian, not an un-natural Christian.

That is why we are called the good ones.

Regards
DL
 
steve_bank said:
Jesus put his morality above all else..
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My Jesus, yes.

Not so much the Armageddon Jesus.

We see that Jesus as Trinitarians do.

Genocidal; not moral.

See the difference and why we are good?

Do you put your morality above all else, or who is your moral guide?

Who does your thinking for you?

I am advised by my God to do my own.

Regards
DL
 
steve_bank said:
Are you thinking of where he is says, let him without sin cast the first stone?
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steve_bank said:
condemning fornication
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I have an aside for you if you like a little challenge.

In that story, Jesus wrote something in the sand, even though he is said to be illiterate, before refusing to judge.

Scriptures do not say anything.

I think I might know what he wrote.

Trade you a suggestion?

Regards
DL
 
steve_bank said:
Do you pick and choose what to follow with Jesus?
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Yes. I follow the Chrestian version.

steve_bank said:
Nobody is 'god' as much as some seem to think they are.
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If you will not step up here, you need to read my new O.P. to the more obtuse who have given their thinking responsibility, and thus moral responsibility to others.

I am thinking of trying it on atheist forum, given the better morality, the insight might help some in your religion convert the foolish.

Let me know what you think and if atheists would be interested.

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Are you a God in waiting, or have you stepped up to your destiny?

If one is created in God’s image, as you and I are, and can know good and evil, as most of us do, then if you believe the scriptures, you have reached Godhood.

Gen3;22 Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil;

Note the “Us”

Those foolish Christians who believe in the one supernatural God can never live their true naturalistic religion.

Those Christians can never be “Us”, as they see some major immoral sins as good.

Unfortunately, they will never gain a Jesus consciousness or be elected to Christ.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

I find more Jesus consciousness in non-believers, than in the right-wing believers.

This is not to say that the right are not mostly good.

Most are not quite the best good, as they have let supernatural belief have them forget their predestined legacy. There their single eye is closed.

Religiously speaking, if Christians are fearful of becoming Jesus like, it is no wonder that the only Christian denomination that does live his and her Christian religion, are Gnostic Christian.

Christian who are unaware of how he is supposed to interpret and live Christianity, should ask a Gnostic Christian.

What the inquisitors wrote into history to justify themselves, are mostly lies.

We died because we were the good Christians, who recognized our religious due and destiny.

We also died for naming the supernatural god, evil.

Jesus died for Gnostic Christians, not Constantine’s Christians.

As Jesus asked in the bible, have you forgotten that you are a God?

Step up to your destiny and single your eye.

The supernatural is killing our eco system.

Natural might be a lesser evil than un-natural supernatural.

Regards
 
OK, then you believe fornication is wrong? Homosexuality is wrong?

I fail to see any difference between you and mainstream Christianity. You claim exclusivity over Jesus, so do Baptists and Evangelicals.

It is that declaration of yours over Jesus that led to historical wars and genoicde. Sunni and Shia Muslims today are each other's throats over who are the true Muslims.

Beliefs are fine, but I reject all organized religions as corrupt and dangerous given the numbers and the political power.
 
Unknown Soldier said:
Politesse said:
Unknown Soldier said:
Thanks for informing us that some "social institutions" are not religious, as if we don't know that.
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What do you want? I thought that was pretty obvious too, which is why I didn't spell out that the CIA or whatever is not a religious institution as per your question. Don't ask dumb questions if you don't want people to answer them by stating the obvious.
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I'd recommend you see Hermit's post # 68 for an example of a post free of snarky comments. That post is also relevant to the issues being discussed.
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Are you honestly claiming not to have understood whether the CIA is a religious institution? When I say "dumb question", I mean a question that the asker knows the answer to and is just trying to play "gotcha".
 
steve_bank said:
I fail to see any difference between you and mainstream Christianity.
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If you cannot see my anti homophobe and misogynous message, as different than the Christian preaching for homophobia and misogyny, then you are to mentally blind to see.

Get your eyes checked for moral common sense.

What is it about Gnostics being universalists that you cannot get?

We have tied equality to the righteousness of God.

Gnostic Scriptures and Fragments: Epiphanes - On Righteousness

Epiphanes: On Righteousness. Part of a vast collection of materials dealing with Gnosis and Gnosticism, both ancient and modern.
gnosis.org

Regards
DL
 
Your moral dilemma not mine, is calming to be a follower of Jesus in line with mainstream Christians yet ignoring a specific moral dictate by Jesus in the gospels.

That is between you and your 'higher power' or your sense of ethics. Whatever floats your boat.

Your argument initially was Gnostic Christians ca'd hardky call the RCC morally superior, quoite the opposite.

Back in the 70s I took away some things from Buddhism that I carried forward that actually helped me, but I do not accept all of Buddhim and I would not call mtself a Buddhist. I can some of the bible and derive something useful, there are pearls of wisdom in Proverbs, Job is a perennial story. I would not derive a moral philosophy from the bible or Jesus and I would not v call myself Christian.

Nothing on a grand scale, in my work as an engineer I was faced with ethics and morality. Ethics and morality are not what yiu call out and say, it is how yiu interact with the world around you when you are faced with ethics that have acyual comsequnces for you and oters based in what yiou do and say.

'I do charity work therefore I am good and moral' does not cut it for me. I read a piece by Twain on what he called The Big Lie. People who wear morality on their sleeve for show,

Or as Jesus said

"And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. ... But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen.
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Ethics is how you adhere to the morality you say yopu follow.
 
steve_bank said:
Your moral dilemma not mine, is calming to be a follower of Jesus in line with mainstream Christians yet ignoring a specific moral dictate by Jesus in the gospels.
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You are inventing my moral dilemma.

The Jesus I follow is the opposite to mainstream Christianity, as we do not discriminate against gays and women, nor would we accept substitutional punishment as justice.

We are the moral Christians, not the immoral garbage Christians.

The mainstream believes in the supernatural. Gnostic Christians are not that stupid.

Regards
DL
 
Gnostic Christian Bishop said:
steve_bank said:
Your moral dilemma not mine, is calming to be a follower of Jesus in line with mainstream Christians yet ignoring a specific moral dictate by Jesus in the gospels.
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You are inventing my moral dilemma.

The Jesus I follow is the opposite to mainstream Christianity, as we do not discriminate against gays and women, nor would we accept substitutional punishment as justice.

We are the moral Christians, not the immoral garbage Christians.

The mainstream believes in the supernatural. Gnostic Christians are not that stupid.

Regards
DL
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Hmmm. Very strange. A follower of Jesus certainly implies doing what Jesus said and did. To me that is unethical.

What do you think of the Jesus quote about wearing faith for show relative to your proclanatins of moral superiority? I saw one of your trreds on anotherr forum.

More affirmation from your words that Gnostic Christians like all Christians make Jesus into the image that suits them, and claim they are the true Christians.

It is not just Christians. Many who identify as Buddhist in the west do not follow the fundamental rules in the 8 Fold Path. Buddhist empathy for all living thins and universal compassion is attractive to many, and it predates Jesus by about 300 years.

There was speculation Jesus actually traveled to India before he showed up in the gospels, 'Jesus the missing yearss'. IDepending how yiu interpret the gospes you cab derive an eastern mystic. There is a NT reference that says Jesus had special teachings to his close followers.

Faith healing and levitaion aka walking on water. The Tibetan Buddhist saint Milarepa was said to 'fly through the air like an arrow'. The supernatural-mystcal Jesus is not original.
 
The only good religion is a 'dead' religion'.....
 
steve_bank said:
What do you think of the Jesus quote about wearing faith for show relative to your proclanatins of moral superiority?
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My proclamations are issue related and have arguments.

My superior position is always shown, and if I go by the Christians who run from moral debates, I win the arguments by default.

Did Jesus show moral superiority?

Yes. So do I so I am living his ideology.

Regards
DL
 
Gnostic Christian Bishop said:
steve_bank said:
What do you think of the Jesus quote about wearing faith for show relative to your proclanatins of moral superiority?
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My proclamations are issue related and have arguments.

My superior position is always shown, and if I go by the Christians who run from moral debates, I win the arguments by default.

Did Jesus show moral superiority?

Yes. So do I so I am living his ideology.

Regards
DL
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Not if you accept the gospels as valid words of Jesus. Marriage between 1 man and 1 woman, no fornication. Meek shall inheritbthe Earth. Bear your burdens, the reward is in the afterlife.

A much better ritual is the Japanese penis festival. We all have penis and vagina, it is what binds us all together, no? A much better object of worship. Worship fertility.
 
I am starting a .org. The Anachronistic Religion Society. TARS for short.

We meet, dress in ancient clothes, and impress each other quoting dead prophets. We give ourselves titles. Favorites are prophet, elder, and bishop. We have a few popes and one or two messiahs.

One member actually brought a camel to a meeting, one showed up riding a donkey.
 
I've thought a good deal about this thread, off and on, lately. It's taken me a while to formulate thoughts on what it means to be a good religion, within @Unknown Soldier parameters.

I think the best answer, short and simplistic, is "facilitates moral and supportive community". Of course, all those words are vague and subjective. So is almost everything else on the subject.

For almost all of human history, for the overwhelming majority, religion and government and culture and ethical codes all came in one big package. That world has been going away slowly for a long time. The human race isn't adapting particularly well to that huge shift in the world view. We are a not a social species, so much as a tribal species. The abusable qualities of a culture based on well intentioned fiction is huge. That's where the list in the OP comes from.

But those unfortunate abuses are a side effect of the community building aspects of religion. People value those communities enormously, especially in the modern world where nothing seems to last, or be what it seems to be. People cling to them, and forgive them many sins, because they provide a more stable and supportive community than anyone else does.
Tom
 
In the American colonies church was a center of a community. Social services, counseling, charity. There were no govt programs. It provided a social glue.

It still does.

We focus on the negatives in the forum.

Religion is a reflection of our human nature. So is politics. To me all human social organizations are the same to some degree. Power structures and corruption. Abuse of power.

Religion made up of us humans will always be the same. What is new in our modern liberal democracies is te idea of separation of church and state. Freedom of relgion bounded by civil law.

Both Russian and Chinese communism tried to eradicate religion and failed.
 
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