Who's living in a bubble? "Coastal Elites" or "flyover country" "Real Americans"?

[lpetrich]

I’m a Coastal Elite From the Midwest: The Real Bubble is Rural America

I’m from the rural Midwest. I now live in Washington, D.C. All of this talk about coastal elites needing to understand more of America has it backward.

My home county in Ohio is 97 percent white. It, like a lot of other very unrepresentative counties, went heavily for Donald Trump.

My high school had about 950 students. Two were Asian. One was Hispanic. Zero were Muslim. All the teachers were white.

Author Patrick Thornton then described how he had a gay roommate in college and what that taught him. He says that he could not have gotten such experience if he had stayed home.

I have some extended family in rural New Jersey. Some of them had never been to D.C. before visiting me. They had never made the short drive to see the Constitution in person. They had not seen the Apollo moon lander, nor George Washington’s Revolutionary War uniform.

Short drive? I used Google Maps to estimate some drive times

• Wilmington, DE: 2h
• Trenton, NJ: 3h
• Newark, NJ: 3h 40m
• Port Jervis, NY: 5h

Short drives by rural-Ohio standards, maybe.

I have friends and acquaintances who are Trump supporters. They genuinely do not understand today’s shock, particularly from minorities. These Trump supporters do not understand that many minorities believe the people who voted for Trump endorse his racism and bigotry — that those voters care more about sending a message to the political establishment than they do about the rights and welfare of human beings.

And, of course, people on the coasts could stand to meet more rural and exurban people, to understand why they are anxious about a changing world and less economic opportunity. But rural and exurban people need to see more of America. People do not understand the depths of how little rural America travels and sees other people and cultures.

 

[credoconsolans]

I’m a Coastal Elite From the Midwest: The Real Bubble is Rural America

Author Patrick Thornton then described how he had a gay roommate in college and what that taught him. He says that he could not have gotten such experience if he had stayed home.

I have some extended family in rural New Jersey. Some of them had never been to D.C. before visiting me. They had never made the short drive to see the Constitution in person. They had not seen the Apollo moon lander, nor George Washington’s Revolutionary War uniform.

Short drive? I used Google Maps to estimate some drive times

• 
  [*]Wilmington, DE: 2h
  [*]Trenton, NJ: 3h
  [*]Newark, NJ: 3h 40m
  [*]Port Jervis, NY: 5h
  

Short drives by rural-Ohio standards, maybe.

I have friends and acquaintances who are Trump supporters. They genuinely do not understand today’s shock, particularly from minorities. These Trump supporters do not understand that many minorities believe the people who voted for Trump endorse his racism and bigotry — that those voters care more about sending a message to the political establishment than they do about the rights and welfare of human beings.

And, of course, people on the coasts could stand to meet more rural and exurban people, to understand why they are anxious about a changing world and less economic opportunity. But rural and exurban people need to see more of America. People do not understand the depths of how little rural America travels and sees other people and cultures.

I'm from Texas. We drive 3 hours to have lunch or attend a football game and then drive home in the same day.

A trip to the beach is either a 5 hour or 10 hour drive depending upon where you coming from. Done every year. Sometimes multiple times.

Rural areas are all similar and homogeneous. A friend lived in small town Texas. Still lives there. She left to go to college. She didn't meet her first black person until she was 15.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

The two are completely alien to each other and both consider themselves to be the real America.

Perhaps it is time for a divorce.

 

[fromderinside]

Nonsense. it take time to become other than agrarian and it takes agrarian to support suburban and urban. It takes more time for tribes to mingle and assimilate. All these are ongoing in any modern nation. Most of the surge in Republican votes this cycle came from rust belt America. They are of another generation that was more white dominated and they've been displaced by advancing technology and commerce. We need to do what need be done to bring them into the modern economy and we need to work harder to reconcile the past with the future in this ever more global world. Else we'll suffer the ignominy that is Africa and the Middle East.

Repairing broken people is one of our most important government priorities.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

"Repairing broken people". A very interesting phrase.

Which people do you think are broken and need to be repaired?

 

[credoconsolans]

"Repairing broken people". A very interesting phrase.

Which people do you think are broken and need to be repaired?

People incapable of learning. Incapable of critical thought. Incapable of accepting facts and the repercussions of their failure to do so.

That's my list for starters.

 

[skepticalbip]

"Repairing broken people". A very interesting phrase.

Which people do you think are broken and need to be repaired?

People incapable of learning. Incapable of critical thought. Incapable of accepting facts and the repercussions of their failure to do so.
.

Sorry but that sounds like you are talking about HRC supporters who invested all their hopes and dreams in the election and are now incapable of accepting the fact that their candidate lost. I have to tell you that after every election this country has ever had about half the population are disappointed. They eventually get over it. Disappointment is just a part of life. If Clinton had won then there would still be about the same number of disappointed people - only the ones happy now would be the disappointed and the ones who are disappointed now would be happy.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

"Repairing broken people". A very interesting phrase.

Which people do you think are broken and need to be repaired?

People incapable of learning. Incapable of critical thought. Incapable of accepting facts and the repercussions of their failure to do so.

That's my list for starters.

Which people are you talking about when you say they are incapable of learning and critical thought? I need you to be more specific. Say who exactly you are talking about.

 

[repoman]

The conspiracy theory (which actually happens sometimes) is that the globalist powers that be want to break the ethnic majority of whites in places like we are talking about. If you use 3 different types of countries as an example it may be instructive. First are the US, Canada and Australia with original inhabitants and then mostly whites coming in through very race based immigration policies. Next you have European nations with native "whites" or whatever the local ethnics were. Finally you have countries like China and Japan with little immigration and strong ethnic homogeneity.

China and Japan are not seen as evil to want to keep an ethnic status quo but the rest are. But you also have Singapore which is very mixed and functions fairly well. I think it is a matter of shit or get off the pot. It would have been ok if the US had kept with the 1950s immigration policy (150k Europeans/yr, 3k Asians/yr 2k Africans/yr) and remained very white and it can also be ok if it becomes very non-white, but the transition can be bitch when we are agonizing over it and white guilt/privilege is poorly explained and overused by loony lefties.

Should we force Han Chinese in China out of their bubble via immigration quotas? Actually, we should be glad the Han Chinese are forcing the Tibetans out of their racist bubble by having to interact with Hans that are moving into Tibet.

 

[Melange_Thief]

Short drive? I used Google Maps to estimate some drive times

• Wilmington, DE: 2h
• Trenton, NJ: 3h
• Newark, NJ: 3h 40m
• Port Jervis, NY: 5h

Short drives by rural-Ohio standards, maybe.

After living in the Twin Cities for a while, I got the impression that Midwesterners have a very different definition of "short drive" than Pacific Northwesterners do. These seem like drive times the Midwesterners I met would consider pretty short.

 

[credoconsolans]

People incapable of learning. Incapable of critical thought. Incapable of accepting facts and the repercussions of their failure to do so.
.

Sorry but that sounds like you are talking about HRC supporters who invested all their hopes and dreams in the election and are now incapable of accepting the fact that their candidate lost. I have to tell you that after every election this country has ever had about half the population are disappointed. They eventually get over it. Disappointment is just a part of life. If Clinton had won then there would still be about the same number of disappointed people - only the ones happy now would be the disappointed and the ones who are disappointed now would be happy.

Nope. Not even close. I spent a lot of time talking with rabid Trump supporters.

They were

1) incapable of accepting Trump was a bigger liar than Hillary when it was DEMONSTRABLY evident. I could prove it. They only had to look. They refused to believe it or even exert the effort to investigate for themselves.

2) Incapable of critical thought when it came to things like "we're going to force Mexico to build the wall", "we're going to deport ALL the illegals" and currently they think NAFTA is like an episode of The Apprentice where Trump is going to "fire" Mexico unless they build a wall. Without even considering the ramifications of the effect of this to our economy and the environment and our trade with the rest of the world. Trust me on this, I've been talking to them.

3) Incapable of separating fact from conspiracy rumor. The Clintons "are a cabal and they had people killed". They believe this. Period. No amount of putting out the MASSIVE amount of reasonable doubt will change their minds. One lady, when I explained that the police in Arkansas thinks the murder of those 2 boys on the railroad was similar to a crime committed in Oklahoma earlier and probably the work of drug dealers, she merely huffed and immediately extended the reach of the Clinton cabal to Oklahoma as well.

4) Incapable of clear thinking. I put out a fact about Trump's dealings and the guy I was talking to said my facts were not his facts. I was like,"No, a fact is a fact. Do you know what a fact is?" And I put the definition of the word 'fact' in the post. And his reply was "that's just your opinion." He had no clue that a fact was not an opinion. I ended the conversation telling him I hoped he never served on a jury.

Nope. These people are seriously broken and they need fixing.

 

[Angra Mainyu]

The two are completely alien to each other and both consider themselves to be the real America.

Perhaps it is time for a divorce.

How would that be done, in a way that makes things significantly better?
All states have both urban and rural areas, with significant percentages of the population. Clinton won in most major population centers in Texas. Trump won in nearly as many counties in California as Clinton, and got about 1/3 of the votes in the state.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Sorry but that sounds like you are talking about HRC supporters who invested all their hopes and dreams in the election and are now incapable of accepting the fact that their candidate lost. I have to tell you that after every election this country has ever had about half the population are disappointed. They eventually get over it. Disappointment is just a part of life. If Clinton had won then there would still be about the same number of disappointed people - only the ones happy now would be the disappointed and the ones who are disappointed now would be happy.

Nope. Not even close. I spent a lot of time talking with rabid Trump supporters.

They were

1) incapable of accepting Trump was a bigger liar than Hillary when it was DEMONSTRABLY evident. I could prove it. They only had to look. They refused to believe it or even exert the effort to investigate for themselves.

2) Incapable of critical thought when it came to things like "we're going to force Mexico to build the wall", "we're going to deport ALL the illegals" and currently they think NAFTA is like an episode of The Apprentice where Trump is going to "fire" Mexico unless they build a wall. Without even considering the ramifications of the effect of this to our economy and the environment and our trade with the rest of the world. Trust me on this, I've been talking to them.

3) Incapable of separating fact from conspiracy rumor. The Clintons "are a cabal and they had people killed". They believe this. Period. No amount of putting out the MASSIVE amount of reasonable doubt will change their minds. One lady, when I explained that the police in Arkansas thinks the murder of those 2 boys on the railroad was similar to a crime committed in Oklahoma earlier and probably the work of drug dealers, she merely huffed and immediately extended the reach of the Clinton cabal to Oklahoma as well.

4) Incapable of clear thinking. I put out a fact about Trump's dealings and the guy I was talking to said my facts were not his facts. I was like,"No, a fact is a fact. Do you know what a fact is?" And I put the definition of the word 'fact' in the post. And his reply was "that's just your opinion." He had no clue that a fact was not an opinion. I ended the conversation telling him I hoped he never served on a jury.

Nope. These people are seriously broken and they need fixing.

So when I asked you which people in particular, your answer is "people who disagree with you" and you want the state to fix them.

 

[credoconsolans]

Nope. Not even close. I spent a lot of time talking with rabid Trump supporters.

They were

1) incapable of accepting Trump was a bigger liar than Hillary when it was DEMONSTRABLY evident. I could prove it. They only had to look. They refused to believe it or even exert the effort to investigate for themselves.

2) Incapable of critical thought when it came to things like "we're going to force Mexico to build the wall", "we're going to deport ALL the illegals" and currently they think NAFTA is like an episode of The Apprentice where Trump is going to "fire" Mexico unless they build a wall. Without even considering the ramifications of the effect of this to our economy and the environment and our trade with the rest of the world. Trust me on this, I've been talking to them.

3) Incapable of separating fact from conspiracy rumor. The Clintons "are a cabal and they had people killed". They believe this. Period. No amount of putting out the MASSIVE amount of reasonable doubt will change their minds. One lady, when I explained that the police in Arkansas thinks the murder of those 2 boys on the railroad was similar to a crime committed in Oklahoma earlier and probably the work of drug dealers, she merely huffed and immediately extended the reach of the Clinton cabal to Oklahoma as well.

4) Incapable of clear thinking. I put out a fact about Trump's dealings and the guy I was talking to said my facts were not his facts. I was like,"No, a fact is a fact. Do you know what a fact is?" And I put the definition of the word 'fact' in the post. And his reply was "that's just your opinion." He had no clue that a fact was not an opinion. I ended the conversation telling him I hoped he never served on a jury.

Nope. These people are seriously broken and they need fixing.

So when I asked you which people in particular, your answer is "people who disagree with you" and you want the state to fix them.

No, they are people who are wrong. DEMONSTRABLY wrong. Period.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

So which people who disagree with you aren't broken?

 

[TV and credit cards]

Short drive? I used Google Maps to estimate some drive times

• Wilmington, DE: 2h
• Trenton, NJ: 3h
• Newark, NJ: 3h 40m
• Port Jervis, NY: 5h

Short drives by rural-Ohio standards, maybe.

Short when considering the objective perhaps.

The two are completely alien to each other and both consider themselves to be the real America.

Perhaps it is time for a divorce.

How many times? Half the marriages in the US end in divorce. And that's just two people.



If people cannot afford the learning experiences travel brings, they should at least read about other cultures. To intentionally wallow in ignorance is completely the fault of the individual. A person cannot possibly assess what is best for a nation when their only benchmark is their own tight-knit community.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

The two are completely alien to each other and both consider themselves to be the real America.

Perhaps it is time for a divorce.

How many times? Half the marriages in the US end in divorce. And that's just two people.

I'm obviously talking about part of the country divorcing another part of the country, not individuals divorcing individuals.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Also, there's the advantage that if the US splits up into three or four smaller countries, the consequences of one of them doing something like electing Trump will be less severe for the rest of the world and they can just sit there and be as happily stupid and crazy as they want without anybody else needing to give much of a shit.

 

[credoconsolans]

So which people who disagree with you aren't broken?

Are you changing the question?

This seems to be a new question.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

So which people who disagree with you aren't broken?

Are you changing the question?

This seems to be a new question.

It's actually an attempt to make you as explicit as possible, which you are trying very hard to not do. In fact when I first asked you which people you were talking about, you replied to skepticalbip instead of me.

Which people are broken, be explicit. Don't dance around the issue. So far all I can tell is that you think anyone who didn't vote for Hillary is one of these broken people, but you said that isn't what you meant.

So, be more explicit.