Lula defeats Bolsonaro

[T.G.G. Moogly]

FUCK!!!

Tension has risen in the country after Mr Bolsonaro broke with the tradition of acknowledging defeat.

Some of his supporters are refusing to recognise the results, and have erected roadblocks across the country.

Police said they had cleared more than 300 roadblocks so far, but 267 remain.
Dozens of flights in and out of São Paulo's international airport had to be cancelled after a key access road was cut off by protesters.

Blockages have been reported in all but two states, causing considerable disruption and affecting food supply chains.

Travellers on busses reported running low on water and food as they spent hours stuck in queues.

Bolsonaro is allegedly due to speak. We await to see whether Brazil becomes a formal dictatorship or if he indicates he'll abide by the election results.

The Trumptardism is strong in this one...

 

[Elixir]

He spent the night wooing the military. guess we’ll find out if he succeeded.
Reuters says no.

Brazil's Bolsonaro to break silence and accept defeat, minister says

Brazil's far-right President Jair Bolsonaro will not contest his electoral defeat and plans to address the nation later on Tuesday, his Communications Minister Fabio Faria told Reuters, as a growing number of political allies advised him to concede.

www.reuters.com

BRASILIA/SAO PAULO, Nov 1 (Reuters) - Brazil's far-right President Jair Bolsonaro will not contest his electoral defeat and plans to address the nation later on Tuesday, his Communications Minister Fabio Faria told Reuters, as a growing number of political allies advised him to concede.

 

[Elixir]

Now, Bolsonaro has refused to admit that he lost, but has allowed the transfer of power to proceed.
His suckers are still blocking roads, flights are cancelled etc.
I guess that’s one way to avoid Trump’s wrath, if it matters to him.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Trumpo had them standing by and then attacking the Capitol while Bolso has them performing acts of civil disobedience. Okay.

 

[Elixir]

Trumpo had them standing by and then attacking the Capitol while Bolso has them performing acts of civil disobedience. Okay.

He probably saw some of the Committee hearings and rightly concluded that he might end up imprisoned or executed if he did what Cheato did.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Trumpo had them standing by and then attacking the Capitol while Bolso has them performing acts of civil disobedience. Okay.

He probably saw some of the Committee hearings and rightly concluded that he might end up imprisoned or executed if he did what Cheato did.

As much as I detest right wing populism it seems Bolso possesses a degree of civility that is alien to someone like Trumpo or Pewstain.

 

[Shadowy Man]

Trumpo had them standing by and then attacking the Capitol while Bolso has them performing acts of civil disobedience. Okay.

He probably saw some of the Committee hearings and rightly concluded that he might end up imprisoned or executed if he did what Cheato did.

As much as I detest right wing populism it seems Bolso possesses a degree of civility that is alien to someone like Trumpo or Pewstain.

Or he realized he couldn’t get the military support needed for a successful coup.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

I have heard Brazilian prisons are rather nasty.

 

[lpetrich]

Right Wing Terrorism | Internet Infidels Discussion Board - notes some Bolsonaro supporters who tried to take over some Brazilian government buildings earlier this year, in imitation of Donald Trump's supporters trying that two years ago.

Jair Bolsonaro’s Son Dismisses Idea of Father’s Extradition Back to Brazil by US - Bloomberg

• Senator Flávio Bolsonaro said former president is resting
• Bolsonaro doesn’t have a date to return to Brazil, son said

...
Bolsonaro traveled to the US late last month, two days before the end of his term, skipping the inauguration of President Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva. Congressional Democrats have pushed President Joe Biden to kick Bolsonaro out of the US after his supporters vandalized government buildings in Brasilia on Jan. 8, protesting Lula’s victory and trying to unseat him.

“The far left in the US plays the role of the far left here. They push for a political issue,” Senator Flávio Bolsonaro told reporters in Brasilia. “I believe that the US is a serious country that won’t do anything illegal.”

Flávio Bolsanaro said that his father entered the US with a diplomatic visa and that, if he hasn’t already converted to a tourist visa, he will do so.

The State Department says an individual has 30 days to depart the US or change visa status after leaving government service.

 

[lpetrich]

Lula visited DC recently, and he showed us his taste in friends. Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva (@lulaoficial) • Instagram photos and videos - the text is in Portuguese, but I am fluent in autotranslator.

He had several pictures and videos of him with President Biden, like this one, titled "Lula e Joe Biden no Salão Oval" - "Lula and Joe Biden in the Oval Office": O encontro entre Lula e @JoeBiden na Casa Branca. - "The meeting between Lula and @JoeBiden at the White House."

Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva on Instagram: “Verified
Encontro com o senador @berniesanders. Falamos sobre democracia, movimento sindical, oportunidades e melhores condições de trabalho para a população.” - "Meeting with Senator @berniesanders. We talk about democracy, trade union movement, opportunities and better working conditions for the population." - yes, Bernie Sanders.

Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva on Instagram: “Estive com os deputados dos EUA @RepJayapal, @AOC e @RoKhannaUSA. Falamos de programas sociais que desenvolvemos no Brasil, a preocupação que compartilhamos sobre o meio ambiente e futuro do mundo e o enfrentamento à extrema-direita e fake news nas redes sociais.
@ricardostuckert”
Google Translate: "I was with US Representatives @RepJayapal, @AOC and @RoKhannaUSA. We talk about social programs that we develop in Brazil, the concern we share about the environment and the future of the world and the confrontation with the extreme right and fake news on social networks." - Pramila Jayapal, AOC, Ro Khanna

Also on Twitter: Lula on Twitter: "Estive com os deputados dos EUA @RepJayapal, @AOC e @RoKhanna. Falamos de programas sociais que desenvolvemos no Brasil, a preocupação que compartilhamos sobre o meio ambiente e futuro do mundo e enfrentamento à extrema-direita e fake news nas redes sociais. : @ricardostuckert (pic link)" / Twitter
Twitter's autotranslator (Google): "I've been with US Deputies @RepJayapal, @AOC and @RoKhanna . We talk about social programs that we develop in Brazil, the concern we share about the environment and the future of the world and the confrontation with the extreme right and fake news on social networks."

The phrase "fake news" was in English.

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "It was a true honor meeting with you @LulaOficial and discussing global solidarity for the planet and working people.
Obrigada!" / Twitter - Portuguese for "Thanks".

 

[lpetrich]

Anielle Franco on Instagram: “Encontro com a incrível @aoc! Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, de origem latina, a congressista mais jovem da história dos EUA, defensora dos direitos da classe trabalhadora, negra e imigrante, é uma das maiores referências e inspirações hoje na política de esquerda norte-americana.

Criar essa conexão foi muito fortalecedor. Que sigamos trabalhando para retomar o respeito ao nosso Brasil e apoiar a maior inserção de mulheres na política em todas as partes do mundo.

Foto: Ricardo Stuckert
Google Translate:

Meeting with the amazing @aoc! Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, of Latin origin, the youngest congresswoman in US history, defender of the rights of the working class, black and immigrants, is one of the greatest references and inspirations today in American left-wing politics.

Creating that connection was very empowering. May we continue working to regain respect for our Brazil and support the greater insertion of women in politics in all parts of the world.

Photo: Ricardo Stuckert

Anielle Franco on Twitter: "Encontro com a incrível @AOC! De origem latina, Ocasio é a congressista mais jovem da história dos EUA, defensora dos direitos da classe trabalhadora, negra e imigrante, é uma das maiores referências e inspirações hoje na política de esquerda norte-americana. (pic link)" / Twitter

Twitter's autotranslator (Google): Date with the amazing @AOC ! Of Latin origin, Ocasio is the youngest congresswoman in US history, defender of the rights of the working class, black and immigrants, is one of the greatest references and inspirations today in American left-wing politics."

Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on Twitter: "An absolute honor to meet you, @aniellefranco! Obrigada " / Twitter

I didn't edit any of these translations. "Deputado" is literally "deputy", but is also used for members of legislatures.

 

[lpetrich]

Lula Knows Exactly Who His Political Allies Are - Jacobin magazine

Noting Bernie Sanders on Twitter: "A pleasure to welcome @LulaOficial to Washington. We discussed the importance of defending democracy, advancing workers’ rights, and increasing environmental and climate cooperation around the world. (pic link)" / Twitter

Lula is as close as any current world leader to being an icon on the international left. While he has detractors on the Brazilian left and elsewhere, he is overwhelmingly seen as a model of working-class organizing and governance. He is the face of a political project that has blended electoral politics with working-class organization for more than forty years. His deliberate intention to meet with Bernie and AOC — these were the two figures explicitly cited by individuals close to Lula who planned his Washington trip — signals Lula’s support and ideological affinity with the pair.

Before continuing, I decided to take a look at Brazil's electoral system.

Consulting  List of electoral systems by country - Brazil has a Chamber of Deputies (513 members, something like the US House), a Senate (81 members, something like the US Senate), and a President, elected in nonpartisan top-two fashion (two-round system).

The President serves four-year terms, and after elected for one term, may only be elected for one additional consecutive term. But if he/she is out of office for at least one term, he/she can be elected for an additional term.

There are three Senators for each federative unit, Brazil's 26 states and its Federal District, containing Brasília, the nation's capital. They serve eight-year terms, with elections every four years, alternating between one Senator and two Senators per state.

The Chamber of Deputies is elected by party-list proportional representation, counted up by state. Each state has a number of Deputies in proportion to its population, except with a minimum of 8 and a maximum of 70. They serve four-year terms.

Brazil has a strong multiparty system in its legislature, though they have two main coalitions of parties.

The Chamber of Deputies:
Total: tot=513 num=19 efn=9.2
Gov't: tot=228 num=10 efn=4.8
Oppo: tot=168 num=5 efn=2.3
Ind: tot=117 num=4 efn=2.6

The Senate:
Total: tot=81 num=13 efn=8.8
Gov't: tot=42 num=6 efn=4.
Oppo: tot=30 num=6 efn=4.1
Ind: tot=9 num=1 efn=1.

tot = total number of members, num = number of parties, efn = effective number calculated from how many members in each party.

Gov't = government, Oppo = opposition, Ind = independent.

 

[lpetrich]

Back to Jacobin. Then noting the difference between the parties that they are members of.

Lula’s PT is the largest, most influential, and most successful leftist party in Latin America, retaining an enduring core of support among poor and working-class Brazilians through scandals, defeats, and defections. By comparison, the Democratic Party is a hollow shell, devoid of ideological consistency thanks to its discordant mix of wealthy donors, upper-middle-class supporters, and working-class voters.

That's in good part due to the nature of each nation's electoral system. Brazil's electoral system permits the existence of a multitude of parties, while the US one does not. If the US had proportional representation, it would likely have a Brazil-like multitude of parties. Instead, it has two big coalition parties. AOC was not exaggerating much when she said that in any other nation, she and Joe Biden would be in different parties.

Still, it’s telling that Lula flagged Sanders and AOC — who detractors insist are Democratic lackeys and purveyors of a thin-gruel electoralism hostile to genuine working-class politics — as tribunes of the Left in the United States. This gesture is of a piece with Lula’s long-standing insistence that electoral politics are a crucial vehicle for social progress — and that building political power to deliver substantive improvements to poor and working-class people is more important than ideological purity plays.

What would these detractors prefer? It's rather hard to tell.

 

[Derec]

Lula Knows Exactly Who His Political Allies Are - Jacobin magazine

Of course he does. Birds of a feather and all that.
I don't know how Brazilians can be so stupid as to elect this guy again. After he went to prison for corruption after the first time around. He also only has a second grade education. He is a friend of oppressive regimes such as the Iranian theocracy.
Not that Bolsonaro is much better himself, but you'd think in a country as big as Brazil, they'd find two better people to run.

Lula is as close as any current world leader to being an icon on the international left.

Uneducated and corrupt. That tracks.

Brazil has a strong multiparty system in its legislature, though they have two main coalitions of parties.

A 10 party coalition is crazy!
They really need something like the German 5% hurdle to get rid of the microparties.

Another thing, Lula won the runoff with 50.90%. That is not exactly a mandate for massive change. Like the US, Brazil seems about evenly divided politically.

 

[Derec]

Lula’s PT is the largest, most influential, and most successful leftist party in Latin America, retaining an enduring core of support among poor and working-class Brazilians through scandals, defeats, and defections. By comparison, the Democratic Party is a hollow shell, devoid of ideological consistency thanks to its discordant mix of wealthy donors, upper-middle-class supporters, and working-class voters.

Well, as you said before, it is a very different political and electoral system. Democratic Party has to be a big tent. PT only got 12% of the votes and 69 seats. That will probably make governing for Lula that much more difficult, unless he pulls a page out of Salvador Allende's book and tries to bypass the legislature and govern by decree.

That's in good part due to the nature of each nation's electoral system. Brazil's electoral system permits the existence of a multitude of parties, while the US one does not. If the US had proportional representation, it would likely have a Brazil-like multitude of parties.

Not if there were measures in place to prevent such splintering, like the German 5% rule.

Instead, it has two big coalition parties. AOC was not exaggerating much when she said that in any other nation, she and Joe Biden would be in different parties.

She is exaggerating. Certainly not any other nation. In Brazil, for sure. But not all other countries have such a splintered system.

Still, it’s telling that Lula flagged Sanders and AOC — who detractors insist are Democratic lackeys and purveyors of a thin-gruel electoralism hostile to genuine working-class politics — as tribunes of the Left in the United States.

Tribunes of the Left?

What would these detractors prefer? It's rather hard to tell.

Proletarian revolution?

 

[Derec]

Meeting with the amazing @aoc! Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, of Latin origin, the youngest congresswoman in US history, defender of the rights of the working class, black and immigrants,

... mother of dragons?

is one of the greatest references and inspirations today in American left-wing politics.

I don't think so. I think her star has peaked. Even your AOC thread is seeing less and less play these days.

Creating that connection was very empowering. May we continue working to regain respect for our Brazil and support the greater insertion of women in politics in all parts of the world.

Insertion? Sounds painful.

I didn't edit any of these translations. "Deputado" is literally "deputy", but is also used for members of legislatures.

Yes. Some systems use the term " chamber of deputies" for their parliament.

 

[lpetrich]

Brazil has a strong multiparty system in its legislature, though they have two main coalitions of parties.

A 10 party coalition is crazy!
They really need something like the German 5% hurdle to get rid of the microparties.

Brazil uses a 2% threshold. With a 5% threshold, I find
Total: tot=413 num=7 efn=6.2
Gov't: tot=165 num=3 efn=2.7
Oppo: tot=148 num=2 efn=1.8
Ind: tot=100 num=2 efn=1.9

Still a lot of parties.

Another thing, Lula won the runoff with 50.90%. That is not exactly a mandate for massive change. Like the US, Brazil seems about evenly divided politically.

But when a right-winger gets a squeaker of a victory, it's an absolute mandate, right?

Instead, it has two big coalition parties. AOC was not exaggerating much when she said that in any other nation, she and Joe Biden would be in different parties.

She is exaggerating. Certainly not any other nation. In Brazil, for sure. But not all other countries have such a splintered system.

One would have to be a Foxbot to think that AOC and Joe Biden are essentially alike ideologically.

is one of the greatest references and inspirations today in American left-wing politics.

I don't think so. I think her star has peaked. Even your AOC thread is seeing less and less play these days.

She's becoming less in the news, yes, but she isn't going away. But to her credit, she doesn't feel upstaged by the likes of Cori Bush and Pramila Jayapal.

Creating that connection was very empowering. May we continue working to regain respect for our Brazil and support the greater insertion of women in politics in all parts of the world.

Insertion? Sounds painful.

Seems like a rather literal sort of translation. That was unedited autotranslator output.

 

[lpetrich]

Brazil's Jair Bolsonaro is barred from running for office until 2030 | AP News

A panel of judges voted Friday to render far-right former Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro ineligible to run for office again after concluding that he abused his power and cast unfounded doubts on the country’s electronic voting system.

The decision forbids Bolsonaro from running until 2030, upending the 68-year-old’s political future and likely erasing any chance for him to regain power.

Five judges on the nation’s highest electoral court agreed that Bolsonaro abused his authority by using government communication channels to promote his campaign and sowing doubts about the vote. Two judges voted against.

However,

Speaking to reporters in Minas Gerais, Bolsonaro lamented that the trial was unfair and politically motivated.

“We’re going to talk with the lawyers. Life goes on,” he said when asked what his next step would be. He called the ruling an attack on Brazilian democracy. “It’s a rather difficult moment.”