• Welcome to the Internet Infidels Discussion Board.

Are we at the 2,000th anniversary of Jesus’s death?

The Yggdrasil tree of Norse mythology is a much more sophisticated concept. One could say it is the adult version, in contrast to the Biblical tree of being the children's version.

People say shit like that all the time, like children on the playground. What would constitute the more sophisticated mythological concept? How it evolved over how long a period of time and does that tend to convolute it or clarify it? I know that the mainstream "Christian" take on the tree is probably non-existent, but it's about as simple a concept as concepts go anyway.
 
This comes just after:

Trump is just this guy, ya know?

:rofl:

I want you to pretend as if you know what you're talking about by telling me how someone like Trump or Jong-un can't be gods because in doing that either of two things would be obvious to everyone other than myself. Possibly including yourself.

Why can't Trump be a god? Or God?
 
Is there an emoji that is a question mark the size of the Empire State Building?
 
This comes just after:

Trump is just this guy, ya know?

:rofl:

I want you to pretend as if you know what you're talking about by telling me how someone like Trump or Jong-un can't be gods because in doing that either of two things would be obvious to everyone other than myself. Possibly including yourself.

Why can't Trump be a god? Or God?
What and who are you replying to here? The only post I have made in this thread is about the Yggradsil tree, I made no mention of Trump or a god.
 
It could have been worse, we could have ended up with thousands of years of Egyptian gods or Baal.


Or a Mayan god that requites human sacrifice to be appeased.

Or a sacred goat.

We need to count our blessings....we ended up wtih a dead Hebrew mystic .
 
This comes just after:

Trump is just this guy, ya know?

:rofl:

I want you to pretend as if you know what you're talking about by telling me how someone like Trump or Jong-un can't be gods because in doing that either of two things would be obvious to everyone other than myself. Possibly including yourself.

Why can't Trump be a god? Or God?

What can’t you even use quote tags correctly, to assign the correct post to the right person?

As to your ridiculous question, maybe others will gently guide you through figuring out the answer.

ETA: note also that I was posting your two completely contradictory statements on the matter, which you have conveniently ignored.
 
This comes just after:

Trump is just this guy, ya know?

:rofl:

I want you to pretend as if you know what you're talking about by telling me how someone like Trump or Jong-un can't be gods because in doing that either of two things would be obvious to everyone other than myself. Possibly including yourself.

Why can't Trump be a god? Or God?
What and who are you replying to here? The only post I have made in this thread is about the Yggradsil tree, I made no mention of Trump or a god.

Sorry, I was responding to some other infidel there and somehow put the wrong quote in the machine.
 
And chasing after wind. But if that is so, and all is vanity, I prefer to choose my own vanities.

Who doesn't? A rhetorical question.

I'm well aware my knowledge will go with me to the grave, and likely sooner than I expect, but that does not describe me any more or less than anyone else.

Yes, but I wasn't talking about the grave, I was talking about well before that.

To be more precise it involves a woman who was deceived into thinking a snake was talking
That is not what the text says.

Yes. It is what the text says.

Yes. Rivers may wander, but not without leaving traces of themselves on the landscape for discerning eyes to see, nor do they ignore the topography of the land they flow over. Four major river basins do not share their headwaters in Mesopotamia.

You say do not. You don't say did not. Are you saying they could not have?

Have you ever noticed that the creation myths of many cultures are very specific about how and when local landforms came into being, but pointedly vague about how the rest of the world was formed?

No. I haven't noticed. I'm not sure what you mean, could you give an example?
 
Yes. It is what the text says.

"Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, 'Did God really say, You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?'"

Talking snake. Not a deceived lady. If the book is mythical, then the sepent symbolizes wisdom and we have a reasonable allegory for the costs of the blind pursuit of knowledge as a possession rather than for love of wisdom. If it is history, it's a book about talking snakes, and I'll believe it when I meet one. They don't have throats, you know?

You say do not. You don't say did not. Are you saying they could not have?
I am, yes. And confidently. Rivers and the land they flow over are in a mutually affective relationship, you cannot change one without the other bearing the signs of it. Rivers flow in channels. They leave deposits. They are physical entities that follow physical laws, no more magical than snakes. Especially events that happened only five thousand years ago! The blink of an eye, in geological time. There are varves from older lake basins not twenty miles from my house, I could take you on a short drive and hike to see one of them with your own eyes.

No. I haven't noticed. I'm not sure what you mean, could you give an example?
Nearly all cultures have stories about how the world came to be, but they always involve local landforms, local animals, local gods. Mongolians believe their people were the offspring of a wolf and a doe, at a place known to them on their sprawling steppes. The Japanese tell a story of kami raising up Nippon from the depths, at a point still known to them and marked by a little shrine iin Hyogo prefecture. The Nuwuvi tell a story not dissimilar to the Christian one, of a paradise created for man by Coyote, not far from the banks of Diamond Bar in Arizona. The Ohlone tell a similar story, but it was Condor who did the gifting, gazing down from his perch above Mount Diablo in California. We could go on and on, here.
 
Last edited:
This is 2025 and literate Americans are discussing whether Genesis 2 through 5 is an accurate description of the first marriage? That's why, for me, satire is the appropriate response to religion.
BTW Adam lived to be 930 yeeeeears old. No one knows how long Eve lived, because of course who gives a shit, but if the male/female life span back then was like it is now, she was a millenium gal. That also tells you that there's a lot of back story we'll never get about that marriage. Like almost all of it. My instinct is that they had plenty of discussions about the incestuous backwoods babies their kids were bringing into the world. I also think Adam kept a pet snake, just to rub it in. "See, honey. I named him Speedo. 'Cause he's the reason we don't have a pool where you could lie around and sunbathe all day."
"Yeah, but you ate it, too, big boy. Nobody made you."
At least he never had to hear the refrain about "My mother told me you were bad news."
 
This is 2025 and literate Americans are discussing whether Genesis 2 through 5 is an accurate description of the first marriage? That's why, for me, satire is the appropriate response to religion.
BTW Adam lived to be 930 yeeeeears old. No one knows how long Eve lived, because of course who gives a shit, but if the male/female life span back then was like it is now, she was a millenium gal. That also tells you that there's a lot of back story we'll never get about that marriage. Like almost all of it. My instinct is that they had plenty of discussions about the incestuous backwoods babies their kids were bringing into the world. I also think Adam kept a pet snake, just to rub it in. "See, honey. I named him Speedo. 'Cause he's the reason we don't have a pool where you could lie around and sunbathe all day."
"Yeah, but you ate it, too, big boy. Nobody made you."
At least he never had to hear the refrain about "My mother told me you were bad news."
And those same people are failing to discuss whether The Beast of the Sea is an accurate depiction of the Trump regime.
 
Yes. It is what the text says.

"Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, 'Did God really say, You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?'"

Talking snake. Not a deceived lady.

It amazes me when intelligent skeptics, thinking the Bible is nonsense of some sort, thinks their baseless criticism can be as ignorant as they imagine the text to be. You read what you've quoted above and think "Talking snake. Not a deceived lady."'

They

want

to

make

it

say

what

they

want

it

to

say.

They don't care what it says. They don't care about an argument. There's no point in debating them. They don't care about the . . .

DATA!

Let me demonstrate. Mark 16:9 says: "When Jesus rose early on the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had driven seven demons."

The Bible says this happened, correct? It didn't. How do we know? It's spurious. There are two later additions to the sudden ending of Mark chapter 16. The later part of verse 8 through verse 20 are spurious. The Codex Regius of the eighth century includes both the short and the long ending adding that they are current in some quarters while not recognizing either as authoritative.

The Greek Codex Alexandrinus, and Ephraemi rescriptus from the fifth century C.E., as well as the Greek and Latin Bezae Codices from the fifth and sixth centuries C.E., Jerome's Latin Vulgate c. 400 C.E., Curetonian Syriac, Old Syriac and Syriac Peshitta, Christian Aramaic both from the fifth century C.E. add the long conclusion, but the Greek Codex Sinaiticus and Vatican ms 1209, both from the fourth century C.E. as well as the Cinaitic Syriac codex from the fourth and fifth century C.E., and Armenian Version from the fourth to thirteenth century C.E. omits them. It would seem, especially when examining the context, that these verses were added sometime during this period.

So reading talking snake in the Bible leads us to what conclusion? 1. The Bible says a snake talked. 2. The Bible was quoting Eve, who was decieved into thinking a snake talked. We read that at 2 Corinthians 11:3, when Paul said "I am afraid, however, that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent's cunning, your minds may be led astray from your simple and pure devotion to Christ." 3. The Bible throughout says that the spirit being known as Satan (Hebrew satan meaning resister with the definite article) is blamed for the deception of Eve. Not a literal serpent.

If the book is mythical, then the sepent symbolizes wisdom and we have a reasonable allegory for the costs of the blind pursuit of knowledge as a possession rather than for love of wisdom.

How is the literal serpent described? Cunning, crafty, shrewd, subtil (archaic; subtle), sneaky, clever. Compare translations of Genesis 3:1.

more crafty
עָר֔וּם (‘ā·rūm)
Adjective - masculine singular
Strong's 6175: Crafty, shrewd, sensible

That is why saying "the Bible says" doesn't necessarily mean "the Bible means" in this case, a snake talked even though it says a snake talked. There are multiple possibilities, including, like Aesop's fables, animals talking is metaphorical, or it is a mistranslation, spurious, someone other than the author's perspective is given, etc.

If it is history, it's a book about talking snakes, and I'll believe it when I meet one. They don't have throats, you know?

Heh. They actually do, you know? They have a small opening called the glottis, which opens into the trachea. They don't have a uvula, and their mouth and throat are one continuous chamber, allowing them to swallow large items whole.

I know virtually nothing about snakes. I did a quick search and there was some answers given in my AI thingy, which I didn't bother to confirm or research in any real way. It may be right or it may be Answers in Genesis. It doesn't matter to me because I'm not putting forth the proposition that, according to the Bible at least one literal serpent spoke to one literal person.

I am, yes. And confidently. Rivers and the land they flow over are in a mutually affective relationship, you cannot change one without the other bearing the signs of it. Rivers flow in channels. They leave deposits. They are physical entities that follow physical laws, no more magical than snakes. Especially events that happened only five thousand years ago! The blink of an eye, in geological time. There are varves from older lake basins not twenty miles from my house, I could take you on a short drive and hike to see one of them with your own eyes.





Videos summary in case the excrement past tense wants to knit pick.

The evidence is clear—massive, planetary-scale floods shaped our world. Yet some still dismiss it as “local flooding.” What would be left of our civilization if it happened again? Not much.

The sheer scale of ancient megafloods in Eastern Washington defies comprehension. These catastrophic flows, triggered by glacial ice dam failures, dwarf all modern rivers combined. Even if the total discharge of every river on Earth — from the Amazon to the Mississippi — were added together, it would represent only a fraction of the water released during one of these events. These floods reshaped landscapes, carving massive features like the Channeled Scablands, and remain one of the most dramatic geological phenomena ever recorded.
 
Last edited:
Nice to be a tarred as a crazed atheist instead of a brainless theist for a change! I should chat with evangelicals more often. Get some variety in my insults.
 
So reading talking snake in the Bible leads us to what conclusion? 1. The Bible says a snake talked. 2. The Bible was quoting Eve, who was decieved into thinking a snake talked. We read that at 2 Corinthians 11:3, when Paul said "I am afraid, however, that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent's cunning, your minds may be led astray from your simple and pure devotion to Christ." 3. The Bible throughout says that the spirit being known as Satan (Hebrew satan meaning resister with the definite article) is blamed for the deception of Eve. Not a literal serpent.
My bolding. Paul's quote also makes it clear that a talking serpent was the deceiver of Eve. He makes no mention of Satan either, just the snake.

Any more "data" to present?

Heh. They actually do, you know? They have a small opening called the glottis, which opens into the trachea. They don't have a uvula, and their mouth and throat are one continuous chamber, allowing them to swallow large items whole.

I know virtually nothing about snakes.
Obviously not. My point is that snakes cannot, physically, produce human language no matter how hard they try, having no apparatus that could even begin to replicate the phonemes with of which our spoken languages are composed. Nor could they really hear the response if they did, they have "hearing" but it works quite differently for snakes.

And if you think anything in those Youtube videos bears repeating, you'll have to summarize it.
 
Paul's quote also makes it clear that a talking serpent was the deceiver of Eve. He makes no mention of Satan either, just the snake.

Any more "data" to present?

So, you mean to contend that the entire Bible indicates that sin, the deception of Eve, was caused by a literal serpent? The snake is the serpent that not only deceived Eve, but is the father of all lies, the God of the world, the cherub that was assigned to protect the garden, the most beautiful of angels, deceiving the entire world, who will be destroyed, and warred with his demons, in heaven with Michael, is that correct?

Obviously not. My point is that snakes cannot, physically, produce human language no matter how hard they try, having no apparatus that could even begin to replicate the phonemes with of which our spoken languages are composed. Nor could they really hear the response if they did, they have "hearing" but it works quite differently for snakes.

And if you think anything in those Youtube videos bears repeating, you'll have to summarize it.

I did summarize them both, and you didn't say that was your point, you SAID snakes don't have throats.

Just another uninformed ideologue with delusions of intelligence. Pity.
 
Nice to be a tarred as a crazed atheist instead of a brainless theist for a change! I should chat with evangelicals more often. Get some variety in my insults.
IKR?

It's weird. I would post threads about what magic believers believe about magic, and the Tinkerbell effect, but I'm afraid it will go over many folks' heads here, and that people would accuse me of supernatural or non-naturalistic beliefs.

Perhaps this speaks poorly on my resolve "to see weird things talked about in a light that makes them seem less weird and reveals that previous language was just insufficient to handle it", that I do not more often do so.

Why are we talking about Genesis when the discussion is about Jesus and a 2000 year anniversary, though? What's next, Ye Olde Fluddie?

Or did they already bring that up?

I swear... At least Sayed was kinda funny sometimes, like comic relief.
 
Why are we talking about Genesis when the discussion is about Jesus and a 2000 year anniversary, though?
Because my post so perfectly encapsulated the matter that no one is brave enough to try and add to it? *optimistic grin?*
 
So, you mean to contend that the entire Bible indicates that sin, the deception of Eve, was caused by a literal serpent?
Of course not. Snakes don't talk. But it is very clear to me that the passage under discussion is about a talking snake.

Not Satan, who isn't mentioned in the story at all.
 
Why are we talking about Genesis when the discussion is about Jesus and a 2000 year anniversary, though?
Because my post so perfectly encapsulated the matter that no one is brave enough to try and add to it? *optimistic grin?*
To be honest, I don't even know what reply that was... I really just dropped in to see what happened since that quip about "they care so much about the beginning and completely ignored the stuff right before the very end", to find... More discussion about the beginning and not about what is supposed to happen after.

I mean there's little else to say other than "if Jesus lived and thus died as was recorded in the gospels, it was around 2000 years ago, give or take a year or ten."

At that point I would think the conversation would pivot to "what was supposed to happen afterwards", not "what happened earlier".
 
At that point I would think the conversation would pivot to "what was supposed to happen afterwards", not "what happened earlier".
Apocalypse.

The day when "there is nothing hidden that will not be revealed."

Alas, we're still waiting.

Well, some of us are. The funny thing is, I never really stopped believing in the promise. But somewhere along the line, I stopped waiting for it. It's like waiting for a parent to love you, the wound never quite heals, but the pain becomes more familiar with time.
 
Back
Top Bottom