Legal definition of woman is based on biological sex, UK supreme court rules

[Toni]

You know who wouldn't support that? Males who identify as women. As they've clearly demonstrated on several occasions.

Yes, and I certainly understand why. Hence why I clarified that there is a huge difference between the ideal and the practical.

Would you explain your reasoning for why males who identify as women do not support having access to a single-use, any-sex space?

Because using the "Trans Room" is not much better than using the "wrong room" in terms of attracting abuse, legal persecution, and sexual assault. Most trans kids do not feel any safer using a room that immediately outs them as a "gender activist" than they do using a single-gendered space. This isn't speculative, my high school students report the above as a frequent problem at schools where the three-room solution has already been applied.

So it is not perfect, and it helps Trump's goons with their favorite hobby (hurting children and laughing). But, it is the best option that the public will support, and I already conceded that in the above post you were quoting, so please don't waste all of our time writing yet more screeds about how I'm an insane progressive communist radical who will only accept ideal solutions. That mirror you use to imagine what other people are like can only take so much strain.

Yikes. I had not considered the ill effects possible with the all gender bathrooms. How horrible.

 

[Bomb#20]

I'm childless; and "Hit or be hit" is a description of a world where everyone takes what he thinks he needs, not a world of property rights. Property rights are what make it possible to settle resource allocation disagreements without anyone hitting anyone.

A baseball field maintained by the city isn't "your property". Neither is a public university.

You quoting somebody? Where the bejesus do you think you see me claiming the field is my property, or yours, or anyone's private property? A baseball field maintained by the city is public property, and public property is property every bit as much as private property, meaning the public that owns the field gets to decide on the access rules, meaning it gets to exclude people. What, you think a public university isn't chock full of "systemic barriers" to "everyone getting the support they need"? You think if anybody who needs a shovel is allowed to walk into a public college's gardening shed maintained by the city and help himself, who gets to use the shovel is going to be resolved without "Hit or be hit". It's going to be a scene out of Mythic Quest.

If I pay taxes to maintain something, why shouldn't I have access to every single program it has to offer?

You pay taxes to support the Capitol offering the Speaker an office, so you're on the side of the Jan. 6 rioters taking selfies on Nancy Pelosi's desk?

If one sex is not allowed to use the field, they should not have pay for it either.

My socioeconomic class is not allowed to use Medicaid; should we not have to pay for it either? Earlier you claimed to be a libertarian; I took that as your typical Humpty-Dumpty language. Maybe you were serious.

Or to put it another way, why would anyone consent, in the long run, to pay taxes to a government that formally discriminates against them when it comes to the services those taxes supposedly provide?

Are you one of those true believers in Hobbesian "social compact" mythology? People don't pay taxes because of so-called "consent of the governed". People pay taxes because government will punish them if they don't.

You pretend to be a realist, but you're not looking at the broader picture of what happens when conservative governments start to wield power more as clients to wealthy families than as servants to their people. It's not stable or ideal; it's the start of the cycle.

"Conservative"?!? "Start"?!? Governments wield power more as clients to wealthy families than as servants to their people whether they're conservative or not; and they've been doing it since forever.

And we all know how that turned out: slavery lasted thirty years longer and cost six hundred thousand more lives than it would have if America had stayed in the British Empire.

 

[Politesse]

What, you think a public university isn't chock full of "systemic barriers" to "everyone getting the support they need"?

Of course it is. But good and decent people, or just those who value their tax dollars, should be endeavoring to remove those barriers whenever possible. Not put them up.

The Union won.

 

[Politesse]

You think if anybody who needs a shovel is allowed to walk into a public college's gardening shed maintained by the city and help himself, who gets to use the shovel is going to be resolved without "Hit or be hit". It's going to be a scene out of Mythic Quest.

A pointless fantasy, irrelevant to the conversation.

 

[Politesse]

My socioeconomic class is not allowed to use Medicaid; should we not have to pay for it either? Earlier you claimed to be a libertarian; I took that as your typical Humpty-Dumpty language. Maybe you were serious.

You have a right to apply for Medicaid, and if you qualify for it according to the rules that have been set out by the law for its distribution, to receive it. I would not approve of systematically denying medicare to a class of citizens, either. You seem to be confusing not needing Medicare with not being allowed to access Medicare, but those are not the same thing.

 

[Politesse]

Are you one of those true believers in Hobbesian "social compact" mythology? People don't pay taxes because of so-called "consent of the governed". People pay taxes because government will punish them if they don't.

No population can be controlled indefinitely through coercion alone. Strongly authoritarian governments that have no support from public sentiment collapse quickly. Decades, if not years. I do not see Hobbes as greatly relevant here. There doesn't have to be a mythical "compact" for human behavior to be predictable.

 

[Politesse]

"Conservative"?!? "Start"?!? Governments wield power more as clients to wealthy families than as servants to their people whether they're conservative or not; and they've been doing it since forever.

Which is why we know what the beginning, middle, and end of the cycle look like.

How are those Hapsburgs doing these days?

 

[TomC]

Yikes. I had not considered the ill effects possible with the all gender bathrooms. How horrible.

He was referring to high school age kids.
People who are among the stupidest and meanest among us.
Old enough to get good as bullying. Too young to have outgrown the tendency.

C'mon Toni, you're a parent. You know what I am talking about.
Tom

 

[Politesse]

And we all know how that turned out: slavery lasted thirty years longer and cost six hundred thousand more lives than it would have if America had stayed in the British Empire.

What difference does it make what might have happened? The British lost their empire. Your opinion of what ought to happen is not relevant to what does happen.

 

[Politesse]

He was referring to high school age kids.

And their adult parents and teachers.

 

[TomC]

He was referring to high school age kids.

And their adult parents and teachers.

Were they bullying kids?
Maybe so, I went to better schools than that.
Tom

 

[Politesse]

A baseball field maintained by the city is public property, and public property is property every bit as much as private property, meaning the public that owns the field gets to decide on the access rules, meaning it gets to exclude people

This is true, but you seem to be the one confused about it. Of course there can be rules about how a public institution or service is used. They do have to apply equally to all citizrns, though. And if you value equity as a principle, there shouldn't be undue barriers for some groups as opposed to others. In the more educated states, we do tend to value equity, so we've tended to vote for politicians and ballot measures accordingly. And why shouldn't we? The idea that the whole nation will fall to the Bolsheviks if the minimum wage goes up by a buck or a baseball ticket goes down by the same is batshit crazy.

 

[Politesse]

He was referring to high school age kids.

And their adult parents and teachers.

Were they bullying kids?
Maybe so, I went to better schools than that.
Tom

Maybe you weren't trans.

 

[TomC]

He was referring to high school age kids.

And their adult parents and teachers.

Were they bullying kids?
Maybe so, I went to better schools than that.
Tom

Maybe you weren't trans.

Fuck off you Californian from your ivory tower.

I was a seriously faggoty nerd. The schools my parents popped for had discipline.

But pretending that I don't understand high school bullying is stupid and kinda makes me angry.
Tom

 

[Politesse]

A baseball field maintained by the city is public property, and public property is property every bit as much as private property, meaning the public that owns the field gets to decide on the access rules, meaning it gets to exclude people

So why are you opposed to the public deciding what the rules should be? If you want to axe Title IX, write your House representative and ask them to introduce a bill. If enough people agree, you can vivisect the law and discriminate against whomever you like.

 

[Politesse]

But pretending that I don't understand high school bullying is stupid and kinda makes me angry.
Tom

You just claimed that adults never participated in bullying students at your school, because your school was "better" than mine. If that's true, I'm not the one who grew up in an ivory tower. Or if I was, ivory towers suck. I came pretty close to being killed by a gang of fellow students at the age of twelve, and that wasn't because I was gay, I was just "weird" and my parents were from out of town. Broken rib, internal bleeding. Are little kid bones the "ivory"?

 

[TomC]

You just claimed that adults never participated in bullying students at your school, because your school was "better" than mine.

I said no thing.
You claimed that kids using the non-sexed restroom in California was causing a problem.
Tom

 

[Toni]

He was referring to high school age kids.

And their adult parents and teachers.

Were they bullying kids?
Maybe so, I went to better schools than that.
Tom

Maybe you weren't trans.

Or out.

 

[Politesse]

Oh, they'll find you.

 

[TomC]

He was referring to high school age kids.

And their adult parents and teachers.

Were they bullying kids?
Maybe so, I went to better schools than that.
Tom

Maybe you weren't trans.

Or out.

FU
I wasn't out because I was terrified of the other teens I couldn't avoid.

The high school ones. Also because of my family and myself.

People like you and Poli are why I was in the closet until my late 20s.

My conservative depression baby Catholic mother kept trying to tell me that she loved me no matter what. She did her best!

It was a struggle.
Tom