Epstein, Kiddies, And Trump. Oh, My

[Toni]

Violence is committed against prostitutes working in legalized settings, here and abroad. Coercion is alleged in the cases of sex workers in places such as Nevada, as is wage theft. In places where prostitution is legalized, there is an increase in sex trafficking, particularly of minors.

I think that 21 is a reasonable age for legalization of sex work:

21 Things You Can Do at 21 Years Old (& Not Just Drinking)

Drinking alcohol, gambling at casinos, renting a car, and more!In the United States, a 21st birthday is considered a major milestone since it marks the age that you're legally allowed to drink alcohol. But did you know that there are a ton...

www.wikihow.com

I think that it is pertinent that one cannot e gage in some activities which can/do have an adverse affect in your health until you are 21, namely legally consume alcohol or tobacco or cannabis.

I would divide sex work into solo (stripper, solo modelling, cam girl) with an 18 limit and not solo with a 21 limit.

But isn't tobacco 18 limit?

It’s 21 AFAIK.

 

[Toni]

Violence is committed against prostitutes working in legalized settings, here and abroad. Coercion is alleged in the cases of sex workers in places such as Nevada, as is wage theft. In places where prostitution is legalized, there is an increase in sex trafficking, particularly of minors.

I think that 21 is a reasonable age for legalization of sex work:

21 Things You Can Do at 21 Years Old (& Not Just Drinking)

Drinking alcohol, gambling at casinos, renting a car, and more!In the United States, a 21st birthday is considered a major milestone since it marks the age that you're legally allowed to drink alcohol. But did you know that there are a ton...

www.wikihow.com

I think that it is pertinent that one cannot e gage in some activities which can/do have an adverse affect in your health until you are 21, namely legally consume alcohol or tobacco or cannabis.

I would divide sex work into solo (stripper, solo modelling, cam girl) with an 18 limit and not solo with a 21 limit.

But isn't tobacco 18 limit?

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I write this knowing that there will always be a market for underaged sex workers of all sorts. And that some will inevitably get trafficked. But with firm age limits at 21, it will be much much harder to send yourself by claiming you thought the 15 year old was 18. It’s a much bigger stretch from 15 to 21.

 

[Derec]

Apparently, the truth hurts.

How would you know? What you wrote certainly wasn't true.

Anything that rationalizes your obsession with your narrow view of appropriate punishment does not negate the fact that teenagers (especially young teens) are neither physically nor emotionally nor psychologically developed as adults,

True, they are not as developed as adults. But they are more physically, emotionally and psychologically developed than children. Teenagers can still kill. These two teenage girls who hijacked a food delivery driver certainly deserved to be tried in criminal court, and not get a slap-on-the-wrist juvenile sentence.
Teens get maximum sentence in death of Uber Eats driver
The supposedly "maximum sentence" in completely inadequate for the serious crime they committed:

Two teenage girls who pleaded guilty for their roles in a carjacking that killed an Uber Eats driver have been sentenced to juvenile detention until they turn 21, a D.C. Superior Court spokesman said.

Policies like this get you teenage criminals who are emboldened by the lackluster consequences they are facing. But, sometimes their victims fight back.
‘Tragedy': DC officials share new details on 13-year-old killed during carjacking

Vernard Toney Jr. died Sunday after he was shot on D Street NW, in the Penn Quarter area, the previous night. Police say an off-duty federal security officer shot Toney after he and another young person tried to carjack him. One of the juveniles held his hand in his pocket as if he had a gun, police said, and then the officer opened fire. Toney was shot and the other person ran.

FAFO. He did not deserve to die, but if you try to rob people over and over again, the cumulative probability of something like this happening goes toward 1.

Toney was a seventh grader at Kelly Miller Middle School in Northeast D.C. He was smart, funny and talented, his principal said in a letter to families.
"He had a natural comedic ability and loved to make people laugh, especially when he would joke that he was the principal of Kelly Miller MS. Vernard also loved to play basketball and spend his free time on the court with his friends,” the letter said.

Except for:

Toney had been accused in a string of previous carjackings. Two sources familiar with the investigation say Toney was arrested in May in connection with a number of armed carjackings in Southeast D.C. He was 12 at the time. It wasn’t immediately clear what happened with the cases.
Mayor Muriel Bowser called Toney’s death a tragedy.

Bowser and politicians like her, who keep giving these teens a pass for adult crimes are a big part of the problem. Her fellow mayor of New Orleans even attended a court case where she advocated for leniency for a teenage carjacker.
Being 12 at the time, the consequences should be different than for, say, a 15 year old who did the same thing. But armed carjackings, especially multiple instances thereof, are still a very serious thing and he should have faced some consequences that would made him think twice about doing it again. Had that happened, perhaps he would have decided not to attempt the carjacking that cost him his life. Instead, all he learned that he can do it over and over again without consequences. Until a would-be victim decided to fight back.

 

[Derec]

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I do not think coddling and sheltering young people well into adulthood is very helpful. Not related to sex, but I know some young people, well into their 20s, who struggle with basic adult skills, like how banking works.

I write this knowing that there will always be a market for underaged sex workers of all sorts. And that some will inevitably get trafficked.

And yet your response is to ban having sex with, or even looking at, young adults. At least as long as some kind of overt payment is involved.

But with firm age limits at 21, it will be much much harder to send yourself by claiming you thought the 15 year old was 18. It’s a much bigger stretch from 15 to 21.

So, in case your illiberal legislation were to pass: what would you do with the copious amounts of 18+ porn in existence? Would you ban its possession? Will you call anybody attracted to a 20 year old a "pedophile"?

 

[Toni]

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I do not think coddling and sheltering young people well into adulthood is very helpful. Not related to sex, but I know some young people, well into their 20s, who struggle with basic adult skills, like how banking works.

I write this knowing that there will always be a market for underaged sex workers of all sorts. And that some will inevitably get trafficked.

And yet your response is to ban having sex with, or even looking at, young adults. At least as long as some kind of overt payment is involved.

But with firm age limits at 21, it will be much much harder to send yourself by claiming you thought the 15 year old was 18. It’s a much bigger stretch from 15 to 21.

So, in case your illiberal legislation were to pass: what would you do with the copious amounts of 18+ porn in existence? Would you ban its possession? Will you call anybody attracted to a 20 year old a "pedophile"?

Let's clarify some things that you totally misrepresent:

I do not think that it should be illegal to have consensual sex with someone under 21 or 18, depending on the circumstances, basically related to age difference and power difference. Most states have so called Romeo/Juliet statutes and they seem appropriate.

OTOH: A freshly minted high school teacher or coach who is 22 should NOT be having sex with 18 year old students in that school or school district or anywhere, tbh. I definitely get that there is not much age difference nor much, if any, emotional difference between say, an average 22 year old male and a fairly mature 18 year old but still--by 22 you should have some self control and some ability to care about others enough to avoid doing anything that would lead to entanglements that are unwise for 18 or younger.

What I have said, and I thought explicitly, was that I do not think that anyone under the age of 21 should be allowed to engage in any sort of sex work. Full stop.

I realize that you do not agree. I think that you are coddling so called adults over 21 by allowing them to pursue sex (any type) from minors. They need to be able to control their own bodies enough not to foist their needs on adolescents who are not emotionally or intellectually able to separate out desire from reasonable foreseeable consequences.

Yes, I've known young adults (20's) who became involved with under 18 students and who are now in prison because of it. Not something I would have ever guessed would happen but in retrospect, I can see the immaturity and insecurity and some family circumstances that clouded judgement where it should not have done.

Allowing adolescents to grow into actual adults before allowing them to be sexually exploited by others is hardly coddling. Lots of kids get damaged by adults who think they are old enough because the adult gets aroused around them. Too many 'adults' are emotionally arrested in their own adolescence and are not able to consider the well being of other people, especially if it interferes with their own needs or wants.

Giving adults a pass to have sex with under aged persons is coddling the presumed adults.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Violence is committed against prostitutes working in legalized settings, here and abroad. Coercion is alleged in the cases of sex workers in places such as Nevada, as is wage theft. In places where prostitution is legalized, there is an increase in sex trafficking, particularly of minors.

I think that 21 is a reasonable age for legalization of sex work:

21 Things You Can Do at 21 Years Old (& Not Just Drinking)

Drinking alcohol, gambling at casinos, renting a car, and more!In the United States, a 21st birthday is considered a major milestone since it marks the age that you're legally allowed to drink alcohol. But did you know that there are a ton...

www.wikihow.com

I think that it is pertinent that one cannot e gage in some activities which can/do have an adverse affect in your health until you are 21, namely legally consume alcohol or tobacco or cannabis.

I would divide sex work into solo (stripper, solo modelling, cam girl) with an 18 limit and not solo with a 21 limit.

But isn't tobacco 18 limit?

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I write this knowing that there will always be a market for underaged sex workers of all sorts. And that some will inevitably get trafficked. But with firm age limits at 21, it will be much much harder to send yourself by claiming you thought the 15 year old was 18. It’s a much bigger stretch from 15 to 21.

But but but... what about the guy that wants to have plausible deniability? Why aren't you thinking about his feelings?

 

[Toni]

Apparently, the truth hurts.

How would you know? What you wrote certainly wasn't true.

Anything that rationalizes your obsession with your narrow view of appropriate punishment does not negate the fact that teenagers (especially young teens) are neither physically nor emotionally nor psychologically developed as adults,

True, they are not as developed as adults. But they are more physically, emotionally and psychologically developed than children. Teenagers can still kill. These two teenage girls who hijacked a food delivery driver certainly deserved to be tried in criminal court, and not get a slap-on-the-wrist juvenile sentence.
Teens get maximum sentence in death of Uber Eats driver
The supposedly "maximum sentence" in completely inadequate for the serious crime they committed:

Two teenage girls who pleaded guilty for their roles in a carjacking that killed an Uber Eats driver have been sentenced to juvenile detention until they turn 21, a D.C. Superior Court spokesman said.

Policies like this get you teenage criminals who are emboldened by the lackluster consequences they are facing. But, sometimes their victims fight back.
‘Tragedy': DC officials share new details on 13-year-old killed during carjacking

Vernard Toney Jr. died Sunday after he was shot on D Street NW, in the Penn Quarter area, the previous night. Police say an off-duty federal security officer shot Toney after he and another young person tried to carjack him. One of the juveniles held his hand in his pocket as if he had a gun, police said, and then the officer opened fire. Toney was shot and the other person ran.

FAFO. He did not deserve to die, but if you try to rob people over and over again, the cumulative probability of something like this happening goes toward 1.

Toney was a seventh grader at Kelly Miller Middle School in Northeast D.C. He was smart, funny and talented, his principal said in a letter to families.
"He had a natural comedic ability and loved to make people laugh, especially when he would joke that he was the principal of Kelly Miller MS. Vernard also loved to play basketball and spend his free time on the court with his friends,” the letter said.

Except for:

Toney had been accused in a string of previous carjackings. Two sources familiar with the investigation say Toney was arrested in May in connection with a number of armed carjackings in Southeast D.C. He was 12 at the time. It wasn’t immediately clear what happened with the cases.
Mayor Muriel Bowser called Toney’s death a tragedy.

Bowser and politicians like her, who keep giving these teens a pass for adult crimes are a big part of the problem. Her fellow mayor of New Orleans even attended a court case where she advocated for leniency for a teenage carjacker.
Being 12 at the time, the consequences should be different than for, say, a 15 year old who did the same thing. But armed carjackings, especially multiple instances thereof, are still a very serious thing and he should have faced some consequences that would made him think twice about doing it again. Had that happened, perhaps he would have decided not to attempt the carjacking that cost him his life. Instead, all he learned that he can do it over and over again without consequences. Until a would-be victim decided to fight back.

Being locked up for years when you are 12-14 is not getting a slap on the wrist.

Yes, children can and do sometimes kill. But they still do not have the mental or emotional maturity to engage in long term thinking or in appreciating the long term consequences for their actions.

Personally I don’t think locking kids up and then releasing them at 18 or 21 is enough. I think that if you are ever going to release any one convicted of a serious crime, you must do a lot of counseling, education, therapy to allow these young offenders to have a decent shot at not offending again. And to protect society.

 

[laughing dog]

Apparently, the truth hurts.

How would you know? What you wrote certainly wasn't true.

Whatever helps you cope with reality.

Anything that rationalizes your obsession with your narrow view of appropriate punishment does not negate the fact that teenagers (especially young teens) are neither physically nor emotionally nor psychologically developed as adults,

True, they are not as developed as adults. But they are more physically, emotionally and psychologically developed than children. Teenagers can still kill. These two teenage girls who hijacked a food delivery driver certainly deserved to be tried in criminal court, and not get a slap-on-the-wrist juvenile sentence.
Teens get maximum sentence in death of Uber Eats driver
The supposedly "maximum sentence" in completely inadequate for the serious crime they committed:

Two teenage girls who pleaded guilty for their roles in a carjacking that killed an Uber Eats driver have been sentenced to juvenile detention until they turn 21, a D.C. Superior Court spokesman said.

Policies like this get you teenage criminals who are emboldened by the lackluster consequences they are facing. But, sometimes their victims fight back.
‘Tragedy': DC officials share new details on 13-year-old killed during carjacking

Vernard Toney Jr. died Sunday after he was shot on D Street NW, in the Penn Quarter area, the previous night. Police say an off-duty federal security officer shot Toney after he and another young person tried to carjack him. One of the juveniles held his hand in his pocket as if he had a gun, police said, and then the officer opened fire. Toney was shot and the other person ran.

FAFO. He did not deserve to die, but if you try to rob people over and over again, the cumulative probability of something like this happening goes toward 1.

Toney was a seventh grader at Kelly Miller Middle School in Northeast D.C. He was smart, funny and talented, his principal said in a letter to families.
"He had a natural comedic ability and loved to make people laugh, especially when he would joke that he was the principal of Kelly Miller MS. Vernard also loved to play basketball and spend his free time on the court with his friends,” the letter said.

Except for:

Toney had been accused in a string of previous carjackings. Two sources familiar with the investigation say Toney was arrested in May in connection with a number of armed carjackings in Southeast D.C. He was 12 at the time. It wasn’t immediately clear what happened with the cases.
Mayor Muriel Bowser called Toney’s death a tragedy.

Bowser and politicians like her, who keep giving these teens a pass for adult crimes are a big part of the problem. Her fellow mayor of New Orleans even attended a court case where she advocated for leniency for a teenage carjacker.
Being 12 at the time, the consequences should be different than for, say, a 15 year old who did the same thing. But armed carjackings, especially multiple instances thereof, are still a very serious thing and he should have faced some consequences that would made him think twice about doing it again. Had that happened, perhaps he would have decided not to attempt the carjacking that cost him his life. Instead, all he learned that he can do it over and over again without consequences. Until a would-be victim decided to fight back.

One of linked stories is from 2021, the other 2023. Do you personally file these away into your "lenient treatment outrage" folder or is there a website catering to your obsession?

BTW, according to your own links, Toney did not get a pass since he was never convicted. I thought people were innocent until proven guilty, or is that only for alleged rapists?

There are always anecdotes on any side of an issue. Using them as a hammer for one's obsessions is immature.

 

[Toni]

Violence is committed against prostitutes working in legalized settings, here and abroad.

And that is horrible and should be prosecuted. As should violence by sex workers against clients of course.

Coercion is alleged in the cases of sex workers in places such as Nevada, as is wage theft.

Define "coercion". Your prohibitionist friends tend to define it very broadly, with taking up sex work because one needs money being called "coercive". Of course, under that definition, any job is "coercive"!

As to allegations of wage theft, allegation itself does not mean that it happened in every instance. And of course, you are not using "wage theft" to argue that other industries where it happens should be outlawed, so why should sex work?

In places where prostitution is legalized, there is an increase in sex trafficking, particularly of minors.

[citation needed]
Preferably, not by a prohibitionist source.
What is possible is that legalization increases the number of reports of trafficking (particularly of minors) without increasing (or even while decreasing) the actual prevalence. And that is obviously a good thing. Law enforcement can act on those reports, and they are not wasting time and resources harassing consenting adults.

I think that 21 is a reasonable age for legalization of sex work:

I think 18 is fine, but then again, I think 18 is fine for drinking and other things you Helen Lovejoys are trying to protect young adults from. By the way, drinking age is another thing US is out of step with most of the developed world on.

Here is a link to things you cannot do until you are 21. Personally, I would raise the age to join the military or any branch of law enforcement until 21.

Of course you would.

It is true that the US is out of step re: under 21 yo’s consuming alcohol compared with some other countries. But the US, we tend to be out of step with those countries re: our own attitudes towards drinking. Here, there are too many people who think that drinking until you are fall down drunk is a normal part of being a teenager/20 year old or college student. It’s not and the long term consequences can be serious, even if you are only looking at the number of classes that must be repeated because Joe College couldn’t reign it in well enough to be able to pass required classes. Of course, this is just another example of kids college age and younger largely not being mature enough to make good decisions re: knowing limits. It’s potentially very dangerous. I live in a college town and every year there is at least one student who dies of acute alcohol poisoning and otters who are injured or killed when they drown or decide to walk along train tracks oblivious to the train that is coming.

 

[Jarhyn]

otters who are injured or killed when they drown

 

[ZiprHead]

Violence is committed against prostitutes working in legalized settings, here and abroad.

And that is horrible and should be prosecuted. As should violence by sex workers against clients of course.

Coercion is alleged in the cases of sex workers in places such as Nevada, as is wage theft.

Define "coercion". Your prohibitionist friends tend to define it very broadly, with taking up sex work because one needs money being called "coercive". Of course, under that definition, any job is "coercive"!

As to allegations of wage theft, allegation itself does not mean that it happened in every instance. And of course, you are not using "wage theft" to argue that other industries where it happens should be outlawed, so why should sex work?

In places where prostitution is legalized, there is an increase in sex trafficking, particularly of minors.

[citation needed]
Preferably, not by a prohibitionist source.
What is possible is that legalization increases the number of reports of trafficking (particularly of minors) without increasing (or even while decreasing) the actual prevalence. And that is obviously a good thing. Law enforcement can act on those reports, and they are not wasting time and resources harassing consenting adults.

I think that 21 is a reasonable age for legalization of sex work:

I think 18 is fine, but then again, I think 18 is fine for drinking and other things you Helen Lovejoys are trying to protect young adults from. By the way, drinking age is another thing US is out of step with most of the developed world on.

Here is a link to things you cannot do until you are 21. Personally, I would raise the age to join the military or any branch of law enforcement until 21.

Of course you would.

It is true that the US is out of step re: under 21 yo’s consuming alcohol compared with some other countries. But the US, we tend to be out of step with those countries re: our own attitudes towards drinking. Here, there are too many people who think that drinking until you are fall down drunk is a normal part of being a teenager/20 year old or college student. It’s not and the long term consequences can be serious, even if you are only looking at the number of classes that must be repeated because Joe College couldn’t reign it in well enough to be able to pass required classes. Of course, this is just another example of kids college age and younger largely not being mature enough to make good decisions re: knowing limits. It’s potentially very dangerous. I live in a college town and every year there is at least one student who dies of acute alcohol poisoning and otters who are injured or killed when they drown or decide to walk along train tracks oblivious to the train that is coming.

I certainly remember when 18 year olds were allowed to consume alcohol in Michigan. They didn't know how to handle it very well and caused a lot of trouble at bars. I was a regular at a little dive bar down the street from where I lived. One night the owner, a woman, was followed into the bathroom by a bunch of young girls and attacked, among other incidents. It was partially the bars and lounges that wanted the age of alcohol consumption raised.

Maybe limiting their consumption to beer and wine would have been a better compromise. Or maybe limit it to in homes but not in public. But here we are.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I do not think coddling and sheltering young people well into adulthood is very helpful. Not related to sex, but I know some young people, well into their 20s, who struggle with basic adult skills, like how banking works.

The real issue is it should be gradual.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Violence is committed against prostitutes working in legalized settings, here and abroad. Coercion is alleged in the cases of sex workers in places such as Nevada, as is wage theft. In places where prostitution is legalized, there is an increase in sex trafficking, particularly of minors.

I think that 21 is a reasonable age for legalization of sex work:

21 Things You Can Do at 21 Years Old (& Not Just Drinking)

Drinking alcohol, gambling at casinos, renting a car, and more!In the United States, a 21st birthday is considered a major milestone since it marks the age that you're legally allowed to drink alcohol. But did you know that there are a ton...

www.wikihow.com

I think that it is pertinent that one cannot e gage in some activities which can/do have an adverse affect in your health until you are 21, namely legally consume alcohol or tobacco or cannabis.

I would divide sex work into solo (stripper, solo modelling, cam girl) with an 18 limit and not solo with a 21 limit.

But isn't tobacco 18 limit?

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I write this knowing that there will always be a market for underaged sex workers of all sorts. And that some will inevitably get trafficked. But with firm age limits at 21, it will be much much harder to send yourself by claiming you thought the 15 year old was 18. It’s a much bigger stretch from 15 to 21.

But but but... what about the guy that wants to have plausible deniability? Why aren't you thinking about his feelings?

Which isn't how it should be. No "said they were legal", but proved it. Due diligence, not strict liability.

And let's make it easier to verify IDs: there's a 2D barcode on the back, modern scanners have no problem with it. Simple app, scan the back of a license, it either comes back with the picture, comes back with a picture + "expired", comes back with a picture + "replaced" (lost, found by someone else), or comes back "invalid". And note that this provides a way to age-gate without automatically showing a name. A malicious version of the app could still get the info (it's all in plaintext) but it doesn't automatically identify you like showing the front would.

 

[Toni]

otters who are injured or killed when they drown

Decent down fir me between when I posted and when I tried to fix my typo

 

[Jarhyn]

otters who are injured or killed when they drown

Decent down fir me between when I posted and when I tried to fix my typo

I'm sorry, it was just too good a typo.

 

[Toni]

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I do not think coddling and sheltering young people well into adulthood is very helpful. Not related to sex, but I know some young people, well into their 20s, who struggle with basic adult skills, like how banking works.

The real issue is it should be gradual.

Exactly. Transitioning from child to adult takes years and physical size and secondary sex characteristics are not in perfect sync with intellectual or emotional maturity. Which, in my experience can best be described as a type of see saw: two steps forward, one back or the other way around multiple times over the course of a week, day, hour or minute. Summersaults, cartwheels and back flips included.

 

[Toni]

otters who are injured or killed when they drown

Decent down fir me between when I posted and when I tried to fix my typo

I'm sorry, it was just too good a typo.

Yeah….it really was!

 

[TV and credit cards]

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I do not think coddling and sheltering young people well into adulthood is very helpful. Not related to sex, but I know some young people, well into their 20s, who struggle with basic adult skills, like how banking works.

It has nothing to do with "coddling and sheltering". The prefrontal cortex is not fully developed until the early/mid twenties. You're asking a teen to perform a function they are simply incapable of. It makes no more sense to expect a sixteen year old to make sound judgements than it does to expect a toddler not to be upset when they've lost their favorite toy. And adding state sanctioned alcohol use certainly does not help.
Old enough to fight, old enough to make all other adult decisions was and is a false comparison. And perhaps the answer rational adults were suppose to come to was not to send teenagers off to war. If you want to know if a person is capable of making sound decisions, devise a testing procedure. Once in place, start testing politicians first.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Girls, at least in the US, already grow up with tremendous pressure to look a certain way and already have a lot of people obsessing over their bodies and sexuality. Delaying the potential for ANY sex work can only help.

I do not think coddling and sheltering young people well into adulthood is very helpful. Not related to sex, but I know some young people, well into their 20s, who struggle with basic adult skills, like how banking works.

I write this knowing that there will always be a market for underaged sex workers of all sorts. And that some will inevitably get trafficked.

And yet your response is to ban having sex with, or even looking at, young adults. At least as long as some kind of overt payment is involved.

But with firm age limits at 21, it will be much much harder to send yourself by claiming you thought the 15 year old was 18. It’s a much bigger stretch from 15 to 21.

So, in case your illiberal legislation were to pass: what would you do with the copious amounts of 18+ porn in existence? Would you ban its possession? Will you call anybody attracted to a 20 year old a "pedophile"?

Jebus... you are too damned old to be whining about the threat against not being able to have sex with 18 year olds!

 

[Elixir]

Jebus... you are too damned old to be whining about the threat against not being able to have sex with 18 year olds!

Did you ever wonder what the archetypal “dirty old man” was like when they were younger?