Charlie Kirk shot at (shot?) in Utah

[Toni]

A bunch of quotes from [Charlie Kirk], including that black women lack the brain processing power to be taken seriously

Um, no, Kirk didn't say that. I watched the clip and what he said was that four specific individuals he named lack the brain processing power to be taken seriously. He did not generalize about black women. I can't say the HuffPost was actually lying -- it looks like HuffPost just uncritically reposted BuzzFeed's lie without bothering to do even the most trivial fact-checking: watching the clip to see whether Kirk said what BuzzFeed claimed he said.

In the same clip, Mr Kirk referred to them “stealing a white person’s slot”. So, while he did not specifically generalize about black women, it is a reasonable conclusion that he was, given his blatant racist comment.

To quote someone, what a dirt bag.

Sorry, but in this case he's basically correct.

It is racist to assume there is a “white person’s slot”.

Why yes, yes it is in fact racist to assume that certain ‘slots’ are for whites only.

 

[Toni]

A bunch of quotes from [Charlie Kirk], including that black women lack the brain processing power to be taken seriously

Um, no, Kirk didn't say that. I watched the clip and what he said was that four specific individuals he named lack the brain processing power to be taken seriously. He did not generalize about black women. I can't say the HuffPost was actually lying -- it looks like HuffPost just uncritically reposted BuzzFeed's lie without bothering to do even the most trivial fact-checking: watching the clip to see whether Kirk said what BuzzFeed claimed he said.

In the same clip, Mr Kirk referred to them “stealing a white person’s slot”. So, while he did not specifically generalize about black women, it is a reasonable conclusion that he was, given his blatant racist comment.

To quote someone, what a dirt bag.

Sorry, but in this case he's basically correct.

If the only reason someone got there is Affirmative Action then they stole a position that would otherwise have gone to a white or Asian. In the cases in question I do not believe that they were correct in stating they got there only because of Affirmative Action, though.

It is always interesting to read your assumptions that every good thing in society by rights belongs to whites or Asians, especially conservatives seeing that you are white and your wife is Asian…

 

[GenesisNemesis]

Whatever you may think, I do not hate or resent or have grudges against white men or men in general.

Similarly I don't "hate white men" either, however I naturally prefer to be alone, I generally avoid interactions with both genders offline if I am able (especially now that it seems society's falling apart, no thanks to those who are overly obsessed with controlling others and have overly high opinions of themselves). It's a lot more comfortable for me to converse through text, too.

I actually enjoy people in person. I find people to be infinitely interesting.

I've become grumpier and grumpier about people since 2016.

 

[southernhybrid]

I don't know if this deserves a new thread, but it's pretty creepy and/or scary fort those of us who aren't conservative Christians. You can read the entire article. I suggest we all do.

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/15/...e_code=1.mE8.KqvB.2jZqIrSS5TXm&smid=url-share

The vice president escorted Charlie Kirk’s casket home on Air Force Two. Thousands of people across the country gathered at candlelight vigils. A Republican congresswoman called for him to be allowed to lie in honor in the Capitol.

The gestures signal not only how conservatives see Mr. Kirk as a martyr, but also their view that his assassination could be a watershed moment that will propel their cause and cement both conservative and conservative Christian values in American life for decades to come.

Mr. Kirk’s death has “unleashed the dragon,” Luke Barnett, a pastor, told the congregation on Wednesday at Dream City Church in Phoenix, where Mr. Kirk had hosted monthly “Freedom Night in America” events.

He addressed young people specifically. “It is time for you to rise up because of what has happened to Charlie Kirk today,” he said to cheers. “I can just envision, right now, 10,000 Charlie Kirks rising up in campuses right across America, proclaiming the truth of Jesus Christ.”

Less than a week after Mr. Kirk was fatally shot at an event at Utah Valley University, the anger and grief remain raw for many across the country, and it’s difficult to predict the long-term political impact of Mr. Kirk’s death amid a highly charged climate.

The movement he led may require more time to take shape without him. But many of Mr. Kirk’s allies have vowed to pick up his mantle and expand the reach of his beliefs.

“This is what happens when you make a martyr — you embolden everyone who believes like they do,” said Allie Beth Stuckey, a popular Christian conservative writer and podcaster who offered both an emotional eulogy of Mr. Kirk as a friend and a fierce condemnation of his critics on her podcast on Thursday.

“Charlie and the truth he represented will spread further and wider than they ever have before,” she said.

So much for the SCS. This is more evidence that these horrible people want to establish a Christian theocracy of some sort. Even my moderate and liberal Christian friends are upset over this.

And yes. There was another article that stated the suspect's roommate was trans, so that will give the crazies another reason to blame the trans community for murders etc. The suspect isn't trans and so far there isn't any reliable evidence that the relationship with his roommate was a romantic one, but it shouldn't matter. His roommate was shocked by what happened and is cooperating with the investigation. That is in a different article I read this morning.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

A bunch of quotes from [Charlie Kirk], including that black women lack the brain processing power to be taken seriously

Um, no, Kirk didn't say that. I watched the clip and what he said was that four specific individuals he named lack the brain processing power to be taken seriously. He did not generalize about black women. I can't say the HuffPost was actually lying -- it looks like HuffPost just uncritically reposted BuzzFeed's lie without bothering to do even the most trivial fact-checking: watching the clip to see whether Kirk said what BuzzFeed claimed he said.

In the same clip, Mr Kirk referred to them “stealing a white person’s slot”. So, while he did not specifically generalize about black women, it is a reasonable conclusion that he was, given his blatant racist comment.

To quote someone, what a dirt bag.

Sorry, but in this case he's basically correct.

If the only reason someone got there is Affirmative Action then they stole a position that would otherwise have gone to a white or Asian. In the cases in question I do not believe that they were correct in stating they got there only because of Affirmative Action, though.

It is always interesting to read your assumptions that every good thing in society by rights belongs to whites or Asians, especially conservatives seeing that you are white and your wife is Asian…

Of course, the critical words in LP's post are "If the only reason"... then yes, LP would be right. No one should get a position strictly because of their race.

The issue we have here is that this isn't strictly about race... as much as people want to assume it is. Harris didn't become a VP candidate because she was black. She did stuff, had a career. No one wants to look at anything else in the resume. LP is obsessed with the answer on the ethnicity line.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

Of course he did. It’s called dog whistling. Malign four specific black women who obviously have the brain power to be where they are,

Except that two out of four clearly did not, and the other two were still helped by racial preferences.

and you by implication malign all black women and black people in general.

Bullshit. So when you, pood, malign four specific white men, does that mean you malign all white men for being white and male?

That’s what people like you who whine about losing your white male privileges will never get, because you can’t afford to.

You and those like you need to stop with this nonsense. You're ridiculing the struggles that 90% of all humans go through. As if money and jobs are given to us simply because we're caucasian. It's not only absurd, it's deeply insulting.

Why did Trump win all the battleground states and get elected twice? One big reason is because he didn't make explicitly or implicitly go about insulting the largest voting demographics. He didn't chase away centrist white menand by extension their families. He didn't offend white women married to white men.

Bullshit like "white privilege" and "white people problems" are just that; bullshit. Women have lost identifiable rights and same sex marriage is next on the chopping block, but by all means, keep up with doing your best to drive away the two largest voting demographics in the nation.

Your ideals have been a significant part of getting us into the mess and now the very people you claim to protect are and will continue to suffer for it.

 

[pood]

Of course he did. It’s called dog whistling. Malign four specific black women who obviously have the brain power to be where they are,

Except that two out of four clearly did not, and the other two were still helped by racial preferences.

and you by implication malign all black women and black people in general.

Bullshit. So when you, pood, malign four specific white men, does that mean you malign all white men for being white and male?

That’s what people like you who whine about losing your white male privileges will never get, because you can’t afford to.

You and those like you need to stop with this nonsense. You're ridiculing the struggles that 90% of all humans go through. As if money and jobs are given to us simply because we're caucasian. It's not only absurd, it's deeply insulting.

Why did Trump win all the battleground states and get elected twice? One big reason is because he didn't make explicitly or implicitly go about insulting the largest voting demographics. He didn't chase away centrist white menand by extension their families. He didn't offend white women married to white men.

Bullshit like "white privilege" and "white people problems" are just that; bullshit. Women have lost identifiable rights and same sex marriage is next on the chopping block, but by all means, keep up with doing your best to drive away the two largest voting demographics in the nation.

Your ideals have been a significant part of getting us into the mess and now the very people you claim to protect are and will continue to suffer for it.

Fortunately, I’m not running for office, so I can speak the truth.

 

[GenesisNemesis]

Your ideals have been a significant part of getting us into the mess and now the very people you claim to protect are and will continue to suffer for it.

This is just a bullshit narrative. People will always lie about the left no matter what we do. There is no tone whatsoever that will change that. And also no, the vast majority of the blame can be put on misinformation spread by social media as well as the Evangelicals.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Of course he did. It’s called dog whistling. Malign four specific black women who obviously have the brain power to be where they are,

Except that two out of four clearly did not, and the other two were still helped by racial preferences.

and you by implication malign all black women and black people in general.

Bullshit. So when you, pood, malign four specific white men, does that mean you malign all white men for being white and male?

That’s what people like you who whine about losing your white male privileges will never get, because you can’t afford to.

You and those like you need to stop with this nonsense. You're ridiculing the struggles that 90% of all humans go through. As if money and jobs are given to us simply because we're caucasian. It's not only absurd, it's deeply insulting.

Why did Trump win all the battleground states and get elected twice? One big reason is because he didn't make explicitly or implicitly go about insulting the largest voting demographics. He didn't chase away centrist white menand by extension their families. He didn't offend white women married to white men.

Bullshit like "white privilege" and "white people problems" are just that; bullshit.

Oversimplified, but not bullshit. We are literally seeing racial profiling with immigration. ICE aren't pulling over white folks. White privilege is a thing. It isn't a live wealthy card. Yes, white people do struggle. Lots of them due to the decisions made by the people they keep voting for. Some of them due to bad decision making. Much like everyone else, as you note. But being white in America comes with privileges

Women have lost identifiable rights and same sex marriage is next on the chopping block, but by all means, keep up with doing your best to drive away the two largest voting demographics in the nation.

These are the same people doing this though.

Your ideals have been a significant part of getting us into the mess and now the very people you claim to protect are and will continue to suffer for it.

No... not remotely close.

• ACA, led to the red tidal wave that sent massive majorities into State Legislatures that gerrymandered the fuck out of the State Districting and US House districting.
• A dirty push poll in South Carolina asking about McCain's mixed race child... which gave us W instead of McCain as President.
• Black dude getting elected president led to an astro-turfed Fox News rebellion

The alt-right, before they were the alt-right, have been pissing in their shorts since they started whining about not being able to smack secretaries on the ass and not being allowed to called people "retarded".

 

[Toni]

Of course he did. It’s called dog whistling. Malign four specific black women who obviously have the brain power to be where they are,

Except that two out of four clearly did not, and the other two were still helped by racial preferences.

and you by implication malign all black women and black people in general.

Bullshit. So when you, pood, malign four specific white men, does that mean you malign all white men for being white and male?

That’s what people like you who whine about losing your white male privileges will never get, because you can’t afford to.

You and those like you need to stop with this nonsense. You're ridiculing the struggles that 90% of all humans go through. As if money and jobs are given to us simply because we're caucasian. It's not only absurd, it's deeply insulting.

Why did Trump win all the battleground states and get elected twice? One big reason is because he didn't make explicitly or implicitly go about insulting the largest voting demographics. He didn't chase away centrist white menand by extension their families. He didn't offend white women married to white men.

Bullshit like "white privilege" and "white people problems" are just that; bullshit. Women have lost identifiable rights and same sex marriage is next on the chopping block, but by all means, keep up with doing your best to drive away the two largest voting demographics in the nation.

Your ideals have been a significant part of getting us into the mess and now the very people you claim to protect are and will continue to suffer for it.

It's far more than 90% of the world's population of people who struggle financially and/or with issues such as food and shelter and clothing and education and medical care, all essentials to survival in this world. I've faced those struggles myself as have family members and friends and colleagues. I think I am most keenly aware of this because my parents grew up poor during the Great Depression and while they made themselves a solid middle class life --not upper middle class but home ownership, a parent who was a stay at home parent (whether she wanted to or not) and sending kids off to college (albeit by scholarships mostly). They gave us a better shot than they ever had and I am intensely grateful.

It's absolutely true that for the past several hundred years, a smaller percentage of white people and a smaller percentage of males have had such struggles. Not zero but fewer problems with poverty compared with other groups. The biggest reason for that is the fact that Western societies have been structured to ensure that those in charge are mostly white and mostly male and they make rules from that narrow perspective. I do not believe that if it had been women or brown people or black people who made the rules for society, that those groups would not have also favored themselves, however inadvertently. THIS is the big reason that we require diversity: so that more of us can survive and thrive. We need a variety of perspectives and POVs and priorities and values to reach systems that help everyone.

 

[Jarhyn]

(I joined this thread late. Haven't read all 17 pages)
I've seen a YT vid calling Kirk a martyr. But I've not even heard of him before.
Tom Crooks should be considered a martyr.

A lot of people are saying things like 'violence is not the way'. I disagree.
Rump needs to be removed from power, Any way possable, As soon as possable. to limit his damage.
We can see in Rump that violence is the only way he is leaving power. So be it.
Yes violence is distasteful but removeing him has got to be done.

Just quote him.

Quote what he says, the ugly shit, and let the problem sort itself.

 

[Elixir]

Quote what he says, the ugly shit, and let the problem sort itself.

Been doing that for decades. MAGAts love it. When is it going to “sort itself”?
Sorry, but death is the only thing that is going to remove the orange scourge.

 

[Emily Lake]

I'm concerned about the increasing view among younger people that violence like this is justifiable and acceptable. It bodes poorly for our future.

Master of understatement.
The acceptability of “second amendment solutions” has orange roots.

Democrats have done their fair share of fanning the flames too, Elixir. If we stand any chance of halting this runaway train, you're going to have to acknowledge that this isn't a one sided problem.

 

[Emily Lake]

Accoding to Grok,

View attachment 52066

https://x.com/i/trending/1966616842283204737

And this is why we shouldn't trust AI for pretty much anything.

 

[Emily Lake]

I'm concerned about the increasing view among younger people that violence like this is justifiable and acceptable. It bodes poorly for our future.

Do you have any evidence that that view is increasing?

What Americans really think about political violence | YouGov

Most Americans say political violence is never justified, but younger and more liberal Americans are more likely to say it can be.

today.yougov.com

It seems to me that violence has been declining for centuries, despite the technical means becoming more available to render violence deadly.

I think that any appearance of increasing violence (particularly amongst young people) is partly the age-old bias against youth that we have always seen from older and supposedly wiser folks who have more to lose, and poor memories of their own younger days; And partly the consequence of the 24x7 news cycle, and the Internet, which bombards us with tales of violence, many of which would have only been reported locally in the "good old days".

 

[Emily Lake]

(I joined this thread late. Haven't read all 17 pages)
I've seen a YT vid calling Kirk a martyr. But I've not even heard of him before.
Tom Crooks should be considered a martyr.

A lot of people are saying things like 'violence is not the way'. I disagree.
Rump needs to be removed from power, Any way possable, As soon as possable. to limit his damage.
We can see in Rump that violence is the only way he is leaving power. So be it.
Yes violence is distasteful but removeing him has got to be done.

I'm frequently flabbergasted by the willingness of people to advocate for violence and assassination.

Seriously, do you not understand that your view is a two-edged blade? Heck, it's worse than that, it's a two-edged blade without a hilt! The approach you advocate for now, against your political opponent, is just as justified in the future against your party's representative. If you advocate for removing Trump by violence and assassination, your same argument can be used against the next Democrat in office, and the next anybody at all after that. It does not solve a problem, it only leads to civil war.

 

[Jarhyn]

Quote what he says, the ugly shit, and let the problem sort itself.

Been doing that for decades. MAGAts love it. When is it going to “sort itself”?
Sorry, but death is the only thing that is going to remove the orange scourge.

The magats might love it. If they do, publicly and openly, it lets me sort the people who say "yes" from the ones who say "ew, what? I was sad over that?!? Not anymore!"

 

[Emily Lake]

I watched Bill Maher last night (Ben Shapiro is so goddamn annoying) and he said it doesn't matter who started it. I interpreted that as a reference to the tension and downward spiral in norms and discourse.

The notion is appealing but it's simplistic. When your kids get into a spat about who did what first, that's when it doesn't matter. However, when we have what we have now, it's absolutely necessary to trace things back to identify when the breakdown really took off. If we don't trace it back, we learn nothing and therefore won't have anyway to deal with it in the future (see Nazi Germany, germ theory, etc.)

With respect to who started It, it was Trump who gave voice to what we see now. To one degree or another there have always been ragtag fringe groups on both extremes, but Trump and subsequently the GOP gave all of them a place to coalesce around. The Dems, as limp dicked and ineffective as they have been, didn't give a voice to hate and violence. They've helped perpetuate a lot of problems, but at least it came from a place of empathy, no matter how stupid or foreseeably hopeless it was.

Hate and ineptitude are not the same thing.

If this country ever wants to return to respectability then it has to begin with the right. They had the opportunity and many wanted to be done with the Trump era like it had been a crazy whiskey and meth-fueled weekend in Vegas. It was a fun for a while, but now it was time to go home, but they couldn't get the meth dealer to leave. They're still going and there's no indication that treatment is going to be sought.

Until the come-down hits, if it ever does, they're going to have to step up and take responsibility for starting this shit.


***Note: Yes, I understand that many believe, and I think rightly so, that Japan began WW2 in 1933.

The Democrats haven't exactly been sitting here twiddling their thumbs singing kumbaya, you know. Democratic politicians have been treating not just opposing politicians but citizens as if they're evil to the core for years now. We just went through an election cycle where Democrats repeatedly referred to Trump as a fascist, repeatedly referred to all Republicans as fascists, and suggested that the US needs an armed uprising to combat Republicans.

Republicans are only half of the problem.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I'm concerned about the increasing view among younger people that violence like this is justifiable and acceptable. It bodes poorly for our future.

Do you have any evidence that that view is increasing?

What Americans really think about political violence | YouGov

Most Americans say political violence is never justified, but younger and more liberal Americans are more likely to say it can be.

today.yougov.com

Was there a point to your cite? What I found interesting is that among Democrats the range of them who thought political violence was a big deal ranged from 44% to 58%. And that was mixed regardless of who was targeted... and yes it is a big deal because I forgot about the arson at Shapiro's residence. It is becoming like school shootings. Regardless, for Republicans, that range was 31 to 67 percent and heavily biased on the party targeted.

That graph seems more accurate than that 'being happy' after a death graph. However, there are some younger liberals that need to be sat down and talked to.

 

[Derec]

Why yes, yes it is in fact racist to assume that certain ‘slots’ are for whites only.

You (and ld) are misinterpreting Kirk's point here. What he obviously meant is a slot that would have likely went to somebody white if not for the pernicious practice of racial preferences, and people were treated as individuals.