Yet another war, this time with Iran

[barbos]

Have you forgotten about Epstein yet?

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Here's my guess. Congress is going to make a war powers resolution starting Monday. It is going to be much, much weaker than planned. Republicans will frame it as permission for the war and Democrats will frame it as strict with checks and balances. The reality is no one can stop him.

 

[steve_bank]

As in Iraq the problem is not about a mutably win. It is about what happens next.

The Republican Guard will not disarm and will likely go out in blaze of glory.

In Iraq it quickly became civil war between factions.

Iran is split between regime supporters and proponents of degeneracy.

 

[ZiprHead]

We are a bigger threat to Iran.

If you mean the Tehran regime, then I sure hope so.

If you mean the Iranian people, then no. The Tehran regime is the biggest threat to them.
Not just brutally murdering civilians, but the IRGC is also corrupt af which leaves infrastructure in shambles.
Iran’s sinking cities: how IRGC corruption and regime negligence are engineering a national catastrophe
At least Mussolini made the trains run on time. The Mullahs are not even competent fascists.

The the country to the USA. Change the regime to Trump and Republicans. The statement works quite well that way too.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Live Updates: U.S. and Israel Attack Iran as Trump Calls for Change in Government

Israel joined the major U.S.-led assault as President Trump pledged to eliminate Iran’s nuclear program and devastate its military. Iran vowed retaliation and several Arab states that host U.S. military bases said they had been attacked.

www.nytimes.com

Israel and US are attacking Iran. Trump called for Iranians to get slaughtered and seize power. Trump is a fucking idiot. How the US bombs Iran into submission seems unlikely. No boots on ground means we likely can't achieve any viable goal. And this happened during negotiations.

So US wastes munitions, gains nothing, and Iran remains Iran.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

The Ayatollah can stay in power if he promises to give Trump oil like Venezuela. Americans deserve to have our oil back that Iran stole. Trump loves peace. This is why he won the FIFA Nobel Peace Prize.

 

[steve_bank]

It has always been about oil.

The unwritten agreement has always been the US and Europe as well provides security in ex chge for the Arab oil states keeping global oil prices stable.

The restraint on attacking Iran has probably been the threat to global oi prices if Iran manages to block the Straights Of Hormuz. Trump is playing a risky game.

Approximately 20 to 21 million barrels of crude oil, condensate, and petroleum products transit the Strait of Hormuz daily, representing roughly 20% of global petroleum consumption and about one-third of all global seaborne oil trade. This crucial, narrow waterway is the primary route for oil exports from Saudi Arabia, Iran, Iraq, the UAE, and Qatar.

Where are UK military bases in the Middle East?
Most of these are in the Arab states of the Persian Gulf, like Saudi Arabia, which is home to fifteen sites, and Oman, which has sixteen of them. There are two sites in the United Arab Emirates and one main base, the United Kingdom Naval Support Facility, in Bahrain.

France maintains a strategic military presence in the Middle East, with its primary hub at the
Implantation militaire française aux Émirats arabes unis (IMFEAU), known as "Peace Camp" in Abu Dhabi, established in 2009. This base includes air, naval, and training facilities. Additional significant French bases exist in Djibouti.

 

[Elixir]

Uh … did you forget?
IT’S NOT EPSTEIN!

Russia, China, NK and Iran have a common interest; destroying NATO. This makes it easy, and gives Cheato’s plan to thwart the November election a strong foothold.
Emergency declarations are coming: Pootie guarantees it.

 

[crazyfingers]

And this happened during negotiations.

I recall the US getting really pissed off Dec 7 1941 when it was attacked during peace negotiations.

 

[steve_bank]

JFK, Cuba and The Bay Of Pigs disaster.

LBJ, the bogus Tonkin Gulf attack an Navy ships by NK that led to the Tonkin Gulf Resolution giving the president broad militray powers to oppose communism in South East Asia. The expanded VN War.

Reagan, the invasion of Granada. Marines to Lebanon and the bombing of the barracks. My brother was on his way back when it happened.

During the Obama administration, U.S. troops were deployed to Africa primarily for targeted security assistance, counter-terrorism, and humanitarian missions rather than large-scale direct combat. Key operations included deploying ~100 special forces to Central Africa to fight the Lord's Resistance Army (2011)
and up to 4,000 personnel to West Africa for the Ebola response (2014).

Clinton, cruise missile attacks.

Al-Shifa pharmaceutical factory - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The al-Shifa pharmaceutical factory (Arabic: الشفاء, romanized: aš-šifāʔ, lit. 'remedy') in Kafouri, Khartoum North, Sudan, was constructed between 1992 and 1996 with components imported from Germany, India, Italy, Sweden, Switzerland, Thailand and the United States. It was opened on 12 July 1997[3][4] and bombed by the United States on 20 August 1998. The industrial complex was composed of four buildings. It was the largest pharmaceutical factory in Khartoum and employed over 300 workers, producing medicine both for human and veterinary use.

The factory was destroyed in 1998 by a missile attack launched by the United States, killing one employee and wounding eleven.[1][2] The U.S. government claimed that the factory was used for the processing of VX nerve agent and that the owners of the plant had ties to the terrorist group al-Qaeda.[5]

Trump is more extreme and irrational, but nothing new.

Congress has long ceded war powers to the president.

 

[pood]

We now see what the U.S. is: a kakistocracy, a kleptocracy and an oligarchy, just like Russia under Trump’s buddy Putin.

And we see the difference between at least most of us and @barbos: When the U.S. does wrong we call it out. When Russia commits barbaric aggression Barbos unreservedly cheers it on.

 

[Elixir]

Trump is more extreme and irrational, but nothing new.

None of the above mentioned former presidents was trying to destroy American democracy or NATO. None of them was a Russian asset. None of them grifted billions for themselves personally. None of them staffed their governments with insurrectionist criminals and pedophiles …
But equivocate away if it comforts you.

 

[pood]

Trump is more extreme and irrational, but nothing new.

None of the above mentioned former presidents was trying to destroy American democracy or NATO. None of them was a Russian asset. None of them grifted billions for themselves personally. None of them staffed their governments with insurrectionist criminals and pedophiles …
But equivocate away if it comforts you.

I don’t think he is equivocating. Trump’s current actions may be particularly egregious but it is nothing new. Congress has ceded war powers to the president since 1950 and Korea. The last constitutional declaration of war was in 1941.

 

[barbos]

We now see what the U.S. is: a kakistocracy, a kleptocracy and an oligarchy, just like Russia under Trump’s buddy Putin.

And we see the difference between at least most of us and @barbos: When the U.S. does wrong we call it out. When Russia commits barbaric aggression Barbos unreservedly cheers it on.

But you did not call it out when US started proxy war with Russia.
You only call it when a guy you don't like does something, when it your guy (Obama/Biden/Clinton/Carter) you don't call it.

 

[steve_bank]

The attack on Iran indirectly helps Ukraine.

Iran will expend all its drones and missiles, and its capacity to make more will be destroyed.

Iranian weapons, particularly Shahed-type drones and ballistic missiles, have been crucial to Russia's Ukraine war effort, with over $2.7 billion in military equipment supplied since 2021. While essential for sustaining high-volume attacks and overcoming initial logistical shortages, Russia is rapidly reducing its dependence by producing these drones domestically and increasing its own missile manufacturing capacity by 2026.

\
Russia has a a labor shortage due to men going to the front, and dying.

High school kids in Russia are assembling and learning to pilot drones. Saw in video in a reprt from Russia.

Russian school children and teenagers are increasingly being involved in the development and assembly of drones, including, in some cases, military-grade drones, as part of a broader, Kremlin-backed effort to boost domestic drone production and militarize the youth

.
Sounds like the end in Nazi Germany Men werer fighting or dead leaving kids put into uniforms and given a rfle.

 

[pood]

We now see what the U.S. is: a kakistocracy, a kleptocracy and an oligarchy, just like Russia under Trump’s buddy Putin.

And we see the difference between at least most of us and @barbos: When the U.S. does wrong we call it out. When Russia commits barbaric aggression Barbos unreservedly cheers it on.

But you did not call it out when US started proxy war with Russia.
You only call it when a guy you don't like does something, when it your guy (Obama/Biden/Clinton/Carter) you don't call it.

Absolute bullshit as usual. And the four presidents you mentioned did not start any wars.

The U.S. did not start a “proxy war” with Russia. Russia invaded an independent state.

And look at the results of your Nazi regime and its paper-tiger military. Before becoming Nazi itself, Russia fought a four-year war against Nazi Germany and defeated it with the help of its allies.

What has Russia done against Ukraine?

It has now fought longer against Ukraine than it did against Nazi Germany and has minor territorial gains.

Your pathetic nation is an absolute joke.

 

[Elixir]

I don’t think he is equivocating. Trump’s current actions may be particularly egregious but it is nothing new. Congress has ceded war powers to the president since 1950 and Korea. The last constitutional declaration of war was in 1941.

Also, all those previously mentioned presidents had two arms and two legs.

And there are other similarities.

But -
What is new are the things I pointed out.

Those are things that are designed to, and are having the effect of destroying America’s democracy and changing its allegiances from the democracies of the world to the most vile and powerful dictatorships of the world. All for the benefit of one sociopath rapist fraud.

That shit has never happened here before.

 

[steve_bank]

Use of militray force has always been framed in protecting the homeland.

In the Cold War it was fight communism over there before we have to fight it here.

In part the invasion of Iraq and toppling Hussein was supposed to be about denying a place for terrorists to plot angst us.

 

[Elixir]

Use of militray force has always been framed in protecting the homeland.

In the Cold War it was fight communism over there before we have to fight it here.

In part the invasion of Iraq and toppling Hussein was supposed to be about denying a place for terrorists to plot angst us.

Ok Steve, this is “normal”?
Pointing out the usual aspects of the situation while ignoring the exceptional aspects, reeks of denial.

 

[steve_bank]

I would call it more 'business as usual'.

Trump on Venezuela and attacking boats was likened to the past American 'gun boat diplomacy'.

I am no Trump supporter, but he really is nothing new. He is pushing the envelope a lot farther than predecessors. This is where Congress is supposed to step in and reign in the president.