Merged Gaza just launched an unprovoked attack on Israel

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

It's been more than 15 months. Has it happened yet?

Not even any bearded belly dancers.

But seriously, any reconstruction is dependent on Hamas giving up power and disarming. Instead, they are actively trying to rebuild their capabilities. You can't expect the World to spend >$70G on rebuilding Gaza (with or without a Trump Gaza resort) when there is a strong possibility that Hamas will attack Israel again in 10 or 15 years and all the money spent will go up in smoke. Again.

If that is true, then what the heck happened to the missing $1.25B taxpayer funding to the Bored of Peace?

 

[laughing dog]

So disparate outcomes are evidence!

They are certainly not evidence of discrimination. Just like disparate arrest/conviction statistics in the US are not evidence of law enforcement discriminating against blacks but are rather due to differences in crime rates, so disparate outcomes here are not evidence that IDF discriminates by age or sex. Rather, the disparate outcome can be better explained by IDF targeting terrorists and they just happen to predominately be military age males.

Nope. It can be because Gazans tend to congregate by sex and the iDF targets area with males.

In any event, your double standard on disparate outcomes as evidence is exposed.

 

[Derec]

Nope. It can be because Gazans tend to congregate by sex and the iDF targets area with males.

Why would IDF do that instead of hitting areas with terrorists? Just like with arrest statistics in the US, the you and your Ilk assume nefarious motives and actions when the evidence does not suggest that at all.

Take for example some recent hits.
IDF kills leader of central Hamas funds network who transferred millions to military wing

The IDF killed Ihab Khrizim, leader of a central Hamas funds transfer network, in a strike on Khan Yunis, the military announced on Thursday.
Khrizim was responsible for overseeing the transfer of millions of dollars to Hamas' military wing. Khrizim continued to violate the ceasefire in recent months, enabling Hamas to execute attacks against IDF soldiers and Israeli civilians, the IDF stated.
The IDF also killed Hamas unit commander Muhammad al-Habash, who took part in manufacturing weapons for the terror group.

And earlier ...

The IDF struck two senior Hamas commanders in the Gaza Strip on Wednesday evening, targeting northern Gaza brigade commander Ezz al-Din Beik and Gaza City deputy brigade commander Imad Aslim, who also serves as commander of the Zeitoun Battalion.

Add to that the recent targeting of the new Hamas chief in Gaza, Mohammed Odeh, as well as the targeting of his predecessor, Izz al-Haddad.

Are you suggesting the IDF is is randomly striking "areas with males" and just keeps hitting senior Hamas commanders through pure luck?

In any event, your double standard on disparate outcomes as evidence is exposed.

No it is not. In both cases my standards are the same - disparate outcomes are not evidence for nefarious behavior since demographic characteristics correlate with legitimate grounds for targeting/arrests. If you arrest criminals in the US, you will arrest disproportionally more blacks because they have higher crimes rates. If you target terrorists in Gaza, you will mostly hit young men and older teenagers, with some middle-aged men who are commanders. While there have been some female Palestinian terrorists, they are relatively few, especially in Islamist groups like Hamas (as opposed to Marxist groups like PFLP (splitters!)).

 

[Derec]

If that is true, then what the heck happened to the missing $1.25B taxpayer funding to the Bored of Peace?

How the fuck should I know? Am I that group's accountant?

My argument wasn't linked to BoP or any other specific plan to organize and fund Gaza reconstruction. My point was more general. UN estimates rebuilding costs of ~$70G and it could well be significantly more by the time it's finished. That money would be wasted unless Hamas is disarmed and gives up power first. There are two reasons for it. One, Hamas will undoubtedly diverty much of that money, as well as construction materials, for their own purposes. They have done this with aid for decades, which is how they built that tunnel network spanning hundreds of miles. Two, if Hamas is still in power, they will at some point decide to attack Israel again, resulting in another war and destruction of whatever has actually genuinely been rebuilt with that $70G.

 

[laughing dog]

Nope. It can be because Gazans tend to congregate by sex and the iDF targets area with males.

Why would IDF do that instead of hitting areas with terrorists?…

Males are in the areas with terrorists. That does not make the male victims terrorists. Duh. Hence your reliance on disparate outcomes as evidence in that case is open you the same criticisms you levy in other situations.

In any event, your double standard on disparate outcomes as evidence is exposed.

No it is not. In both cases my standards are the same - disparate outcomes are not evidence for nefarious behavior since demographic characteristics correlate with legitimate grounds for targeting/arrests. If you arrest criminals in the US, you will arrest disproportionally more blacks because they have higher crimes rates. If you target terrorists in Gaza, you will mostly hit young men and older teenagers, with some middle-aged men who are commanders. While there have been some female Palestinian terrorists, they are relatively few, especially in Islamist groups like Hamas (as opposed to Marxist groups like PFLP (splitters!)).

The irony is you are tacitly admitting to your double standard.

 

[Derec]

Males are in the areas with terrorists.

Because vast majority of terrorists in Gaza are male. Duh.
That does not mean that every area with a lot of males is a terrorist haunt.

That does not make the male victims terrorists.

But it makes terrorists predominately military-age males. Which fits the actual fatality data very well.

Duh. Hence your reliance on disparate outcomes as evidence in that case is open you the same criticisms you levy in other situations.

No, it does not. In both cases you (and your Ilk) assume that disparate outcome is due to unwarranted discrimination, and not because of specific demographics of the guilty.

The irony is you are tacitly admitting to your double standard.

I am not admitting anything. You fail to understand despite me explaining it several times already.

 

[laughing dog]

Males are in the areas with terrorists.

Because vast majority of terrorists in Gaza are male. Duh.
That does not mean that every area with a lot of males is a terrorist haunt.

No one said it was.

That does not make the male victims terrorists.

But it makes terrorists predominately military-age males. Which fits the actual fatality data very well.

Duh. Hence your reliance on disparate outcomes as evidence in that case is open you the same criticisms you levy in other situations.

No, it does not. In both cases you (and your Ilk) assume that disparate outcome is due to unwarranted discrimination, and not because of specific demographics of the guilty.

The irony is you are tacitly admitting to your double standard.

I am not admitting anything. You fail to understand despite me explaining it several times already.

And the irony goes on. At least you shoehorned in a false ad hom. Good show.

 

[Derec]

No one said it was.

So what exactly are you saying?

And the irony goes on. At least you shoehorned in a false ad hom. Good show.

What ad hom?

 

[Derec]

Child marriages in Gaza:
War and displacement in Gaza are fueling a rise in early marriage

Majda was destitute. Her husband and eldest son had been killed by Israeli airstrikes. Living in a ragged tent in Gaza with rats and the stench of sewage, she couldn’t support her children and feared her daughters would be harassed going to the communal latrine in a camp with hundreds of strangers.

So she made a decision she now deeply regrets. She married off her 13- and 14-year-old daughters to men who promised safety and support.

I wonder what people who are obsessing over the Epstein Files have to say about this.

For the girls, it meant a loss of their childhood and future — and, often, dangerous pregnancies. For Majda’s daughters, it meant horrific physical abuse.
[...]
Before the war, child marriage had been slowly declining in Gaza, according to the Palestinian Central Bureau of Statistics. In 2022, the last tally released by the bureau, 17.8% of marriages involved a girl under the age of 18, down from more than 22% in 2015.
The minimum legal age for marriage in Gaza is 17, with some exceptions allowed; the U.N. and most humanitarian groups categorize marriages of girls under 18 as early marriage.
That trend appears to have reversed.
After an Associated Press request, the Supreme Shariah Court in Gaza, where marriages are registered, gathered data from court employees. According to its figures, 20.6% of the 35,474 marriages recorded in 2024 and 2025 involved a girl under 18, including 627 marriages of girls under 15.

I know the usual suspects will blame Israel for this, but note that even before this war there were substantial number of marriages to minor girls. And things are even worse in Afghanistan, and there is no Israel there to blame.

Two brothers in their 20s, from a family that had been their neighbors in Gaza City before they were all forced to flee, asked to marry her daughters.
Majda, who got married at 14, didn’t want a similar fate for her girls. But her father joined the brothers’ family in insisting it was the only way. They promised, Majda said, that they could sign the marriage contracts but wait until after the war to bring the girls to live with their husbands.
“I was not in my right mind. I am still not in my right mind,” Majda said. “I don’t know how I agreed to this.”
Majda’s eldest daughter, who was 14 at the time, didn’t want to accept. “I felt lost,” the daughter said. “I thought if I got married, someone would be financially responsible for me … I truly regretted it.”

Note that the girls' mother was also married at 14. It's a cultural thing, not just something due to this war.

By marrying, they were counted with their husbands as a separate family to receive aid from relief groups, rather than being under their parents’ allotment. Several girls also said that since schools largely shut down during the war, they saw no hope of continuing their education.

Did you get this part? The "relief groups" are tacitly encouraging early marriages by distributing aid not by number of people, but by number of families. Now, why are they doing it this way?

One girl said she and her parents and seven brothers and sisters were displaced more than 25 times during the war. Her father had been totally against early marriage and wanted her to enroll in university. But the family was so desperate that he agreed to a suitor.

Another thing is this incredibly huge number of children Gazans have, like this family with eight (8) children. That not only causes hardship for individual families, but also caused unsustainable population explosion that stretches resources such as water (the Coastal Aquifer has been hopelessly overdrawn for years). Note that the population of Gaza has been <500k in 1967 and is about 2.3-2.4M now.

Now 17, she was five months pregnant when she spoke to the AP.

And she wasted no time to add to the unsustainable population growth herself.

The law in Gaza allows exceptions to the minimum age of 17 with parental consent and authorization by a judge. The Supreme Shariah Court has rules for court officials not to approve exceptions below the age of 14 years and seven months.

At least it's not 9 like in some Islamic countries, but still way too low.

Majda said the in-laws broke their promise and soon demanded her elder daughter be brought to her 23-year-old husband, who was living in his family’s tents in Deir al-Balah.
For the first 10 days, the girl screamed whenever her husband approached her. “I kept screaming and he hit me,” the elder daughter said.
Eventually, his mother “tied up my hands above my head,” the daughter said. The husband then raped her.
After that, he repeatedly threatened to bring his mother to tie her up if she screamed, she said. She recounted repeated instances of rape and said on one occasion, she had to be taken to the hospital with bleeding.

What. The. Fuck.

A few months later, the family came to take her 13-year-old sister to join her 21-year-old husband. She “kept screaming that she did not want to get married,” Majda recalled.
The younger sister told the AP that she too was tied up by her mother-in-law and raped by her husband. She said she had two miscarriages, both after her husband kicked her while she was pregnant.

Monstrous. From both the mother and the grooms' families.

Majda’s elder daughter gave birth to a son. Months later, in November, she fled, carrying her son for 15 kilometers (9 miles) to her mother’s tent.
Not long after that, the younger sister also fled back to Majda. They then discovered that she was pregnant.
[...]
Majda was coming under heavy pressure from her father and her in-laws, who said she couldn’t afford to care for her daughters, the grandson and the baby on the way.
Women can divorce their husbands in Gaza, but the process is expensive and complicated. Divorce also carries stigma, mainly for women, and would make it difficult for the girls to ever remarry.
The in-laws assured Majda that her daughters would be treated well.
Feeling she had no choice, she relented. The girls returned to their husbands, now in Gaza City, in early May. Majda hasn’t been able to contact her daughters since then.
“They did not want to return,” she said. “They were crying.”

What a note to end the article on.
Still, I know that the usual suspects will blame Israel for all of it, and refuse to condemn Palestinian and Islamic culture.

 

[laughing dog]

No one said it was.

So what exactly are you saying?

Contrary to your disparate outcome assumption, dead Gazan males are not necessarily terrorists.

And the irony goes on. At least you shoehorned in a false ad hom. Good show.

What ad hom?

“Ilk”

 

[Patooka]

Palestinians attacked, raped, and mutilated Israeli civilians without provocation. It was the single deadliest day in Israel's history. But hey, cutting off women's breasts, putting nails in their vaginas, raping them, and taking hundreds of hostages is a-okay as long as theocratic authoritarians did it because the U.S. government supported the Shah in the 1970s.

Only 8% of Gaza voted for Hamas in the last election. Blaming all Palestinians is collective punishment at its finest.

Okay. But then all of war is collective punishment.

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

 

[TomC]

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

The Palestinians are the only people I am aware of in modern history that regularly attacks a neighbor and then uses their own people for human shields.
Tom

 

[Patooka]

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

The Palestinians are the only people I am aware of in modern history that regularly attacks a neighbor and then uses their own people for human shields.
Tom

Only if you think the Jewish Settlements are legal, which they aren't FYI.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Palestinians attacked, raped, and mutilated Israeli civilians without provocation. It was the single deadliest day in Israel's history. But hey, cutting off women's breasts, putting nails in their vaginas, raping them, and taking hundreds of hostages is a-okay as long as theocratic authoritarians did it because the U.S. government supported the Shah in the 1970s.

Only 8% of Gaza voted for Hamas in the last election. Blaming all Palestinians is collective punishment at its finest.

Okay. But then all of war is collective punishment.

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

First you need to prove genocide.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

The Palestinians are the only people I am aware of in modern history that regularly attacks a neighbor and then uses their own people for human shields.
Tom

Only if you think the Jewish Settlements are legal, which they aren't FYI.

Not relevant.

 

[Patooka]

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

The Palestinians are the only people I am aware of in modern history that regularly attacks a neighbor and then uses their own people for human shields.
Tom

Only if you think the Jewish Settlements are legal, which they aren't FYI.

Not relevant.

It is the single biggest recruitment tool for groups like Hamas and Hezbollah. It couldn't be any more relevant.

 

[Tigers!]

Palestinians attacked, raped, and mutilated Israeli civilians without provocation. It was the single deadliest day in Israel's history. But hey, cutting off women's breasts, putting nails in their vaginas, raping them, and taking hundreds of hostages is a-okay as long as theocratic authoritarians did it because the U.S. government supported the Shah in the 1970s.

Only 8% of Gaza voted for Hamas in the last election. Blaming all Palestinians is collective punishment at its finest.

I know it has been asked before but if you could tell anyone how to separate Hamas from Gazans that would be most useful.

 

[Tigers!]

Palestinians attacked, raped, and mutilated Israeli civilians without provocation. It was the single deadliest day in Israel's history. But hey, cutting off women's breasts, putting nails in their vaginas, raping them, and taking hundreds of hostages is a-okay as long as theocratic authoritarians did it because the U.S. government supported the Shah in the 1970s.

Only 8% of Gaza voted for Hamas in the last election. Blaming all Palestinians is collective punishment at its finest.

Okay. But then all of war is collective punishment.

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

And yet if Israel reponds to terrorism in any way they are accused of disappropriate response or war crimes etc.
Pray tell what should Israel do?
(We could be like Penny Wong, the Aust. Foreign Minister who basically told Israel to lie back and think of England after 7th Oct.)

 

[Arctish]

Palestinians attacked, raped, and mutilated Israeli civilians without provocation. It was the single deadliest day in Israel's history. But hey, cutting off women's breasts, putting nails in their vaginas, raping them, and taking hundreds of hostages is a-okay as long as theocratic authoritarians did it because the U.S. government supported the Shah in the 1970s.

Only 8% of Gaza voted for Hamas in the last election. Blaming all Palestinians is collective punishment at its finest.

Okay. But then all of war is collective punishment.

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

And yet if Israel reponds to terrorism in any way they are accused of disappropriate response or war crimes etc.

This is bullshit.

Israel has responded to terrorism in the past under many different Prime Ministers and Administrations. It wasn't accused of committing acts of genocide when it didn't kill tens of thousands of civilians sheltering in places where Israel told them to go. It wasn't accused of committing war crimes when IDF soldiers weren't killing unarmed people trying to surrender, or tying civilians to the front of their trucks and driving around Mad Max style, or murdering paramedics and ambulance drivers traveling in a convoy to rescue wounded civilians with permission from Israeli authorities, or shooting people waiting in line for food, or targeting journalists, or other actual, genuine war crimes.

Israel is currently being governed by the most racist pro-ethnic cleansing war crime endorsing Administration since the Founding. That's why its current policies are drawing criticism.

Pray tell what should Israel do?

Get serious about peace with its neighbors. Get over that whole Eretz Israel thing. Live inside its agreed upon borders (per the Oslo Accords) and stop planting illegal settlements outside them. Reward the Palestinian factions that have renounced terrorism and embraced the diplomatic approach at the UN by allowing Palestinians to manage their own affairs, accept aid, and to prosper right there in Palestine.

Israel can also stop fucking with the water supply and electricity in Gaza, stop interfering with Palestinians fishing in Palestinian waters, stop stealing Palestinian resources, etc.

Israel can also stop putting racist asshats into high office. That would be good even without a conflict with the neighbors.

(We could be like Penny Wong, the Aust. Foreign Minister who basically told Israel to lie back and think of England after 7th Oct.)

Citation please.

 

[Tigers!]

Palestinians attacked, raped, and mutilated Israeli civilians without provocation. It was the single deadliest day in Israel's history. But hey, cutting off women's breasts, putting nails in their vaginas, raping them, and taking hundreds of hostages is a-okay as long as theocratic authoritarians did it because the U.S. government supported the Shah in the 1970s.

Only 8% of Gaza voted for Hamas in the last election. Blaming all Palestinians is collective punishment at its finest.

Okay. But then all of war is collective punishment.

Israel is the only country I'm aware of in modern history that responds to acts of terrorism by committing acts of genocide themselves.

And yet if Israel reponds to terrorism in any way they are accused of disappropriate response or war crimes etc.

This is bullshit.

Israel has responded to terrorism in the past under many different Prime Ministers and Administrations. It wasn't accused of committing acts of genocide when it didn't kill tens of thousands of civilians sheltering in places where Israel told them to go. It wasn't accused of committing war crimes when IDF soldiers weren't killing unarmed people trying to surrender, or tying civilians to the front of their trucks and driving around Mad Max style, or murdering paramedics and ambulance drivers traveling in a convoy to rescue wounded civilians with permission from Israeli authorities, or shooting people waiting in line for food, or targeting journalists, or other actual, genuine war crimes.

Israel is currently being governed by the most racist pro-ethnic cleansing war crime endorsing Administration since the Founding. That's why its current policies are drawing criticism.

Pray tell what should Israel do?

Get serious about peace with its neighbors. Get over that whole Eretz Israel thing. Live inside its agreed upon borders (per the Oslo Accords) and stop planting illegal settlements outside them. Reward the Palestinian factions that have renounced terrorism and embraced the diplomatic approach at the UN by allowing Palestinians to manage their own affairs, accept aid, and to prosper right there in Palestine.

I agree about stopping those settlements now.