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Crowd forced to stone 15-year-old boy to death for being gay

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Potoooooooo

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GRAPHIC IMAGES: http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2016/05/crowd-forced-stone-15-year-old-boy-death-gay/
Jamal Nassir al-Oujan, 15, was arrested on May 22 by the Islamic police. Following an extremely short trial, he was found guilty of sodomy and sentenced to death by stoning.

According to an eyewitness, who spoke anonymously to ARA news, “Al-Oujan was brutally stoned to death by ISIS militants in Jaradiq square in the Mayadin city on Monday afternoon.”

“Also, some civilians were forced to participate in stoning the victim. The brutal scene has shocked all residents of Mayadin.”
 
So before opening the thread how many of you correctly guessed "Islam" and how many still have their heads in the sand?
 
Derec said:
So before opening the thread how many of you correctly guessed "Islam" and how many still have their heads in the sand?
Click to expand...


I guessed a society ruled by any Abrahamic religion without secular constraints. Unlike your assumption, mine allowed me to accurately predict this incident without having to know when it occurred.
 
I hope the experience has sparked some additional resistance to (and hatred for) ISIS.
 
Derec said:
So before opening the thread how many of you correctly guessed "Islam" and how many still have their heads in the sand?
Click to expand...

I think everyone here knows what kind of person you are, Derec. Only one head in the sand that I know about and the solution is entirely in your control.
 
Pretty disgusting. I wonder how many people forced to stone this child missed on purpose.

I think the fact that ISIS is a morally reprehensible bunch with no socially redeeming values was well-established before this incident.
 
ronburgundy said:
Derec said:
So before opening the thread how many of you correctly guessed "Islam" and how many still have their heads in the sand?
Click to expand...


I guessed a society ruled by any Abrahamic religion without secular constraints. Unlike your assumption, mine allowed me to accurately predict this incident without having to know when it occurred.
Click to expand...

Since it's news it pretty much has to be something recent and that says it must be Islam. Christianity and Judaism aren't that hardline these days.
 
Derec said:
So before opening the thread how many of you correctly guessed "Islam" and how many still have their heads in the sand?
Click to expand...

Darn it, I got it wrong. I guessed Christianity because it is just as bad as teh islam. I'm zero for ten in this game.
 
Loren Pechtel said:
ronburgundy said:
I guessed a society ruled by any Abrahamic religion without secular constraints. Unlike your assumption, mine allowed me to accurately predict this incident without having to know when it occurred.
Click to expand...

Since it's news it pretty much has to be something recent and that says it must be Islam. Christianity and Judaism aren't that hardline these days.
Click to expand...

I realize that. The point is that Derec's assumption cannot account for for such events in the past nor in the future, because he is assuming there is something unique about Islam, when there is not. The nature of these religions are the same. The difference lies in whether they are allowed to be the near sole determinant of ethics or are largely restrained by prevailing secular values. Taking this true contextual rather than inherent difference into account allows to better prediction of such events regardless of era.
 
To be honest, I am not certain how extremist Islam differs in punishment of 'offenders' very much from how 'offenders' in say, China or North Korea are punished. I mean, sure, it's not public stoning, with the public coerced into participating but it's still extremely harsh and just as deadly. And it's state sponsored, meaning that the people may not be throwing the stones themselves, but they are allowing horrific punishments by their proxy: the government they choose to accept. Throw in forced late term abortions in China and you get the innocence factor thrown in.

My point is that we can no more blame Islam for such atrocities than Islamic extremists can claim justification by Islam for such atrocities. The source of such barbarity is not religion.
 
Toni said:
To be honest, I am not certain how extremist Islam differs in punishment of 'offenders' very much from how 'offenders' in say, China or North Korea are punished. I mean, sure, it's not public stoning, with the public coerced into participating but it's still extremely harsh and just as deadly. And it's state sponsored, meaning that the people may not be throwing the stones themselves, but they are allowing horrific punishments by their proxy: the government they choose to accept. Throw in forced late term abortions in China and you get the innocence factor thrown in.

My point is that we can no more blame Islam for such atrocities than Islamic extremists can claim justification by Islam for such atrocities. The source of such barbarity is not religion.
Click to expand...

The fact that a person can get lung cancer via means other than smoking tobacco, doesn't mean that smoking tobacco is not the primary cause of many if not most of the instances of lung cancer.

Faith is the world's most effective enabler of authoritarianism. Combine that with the most authoritarian concept ever imagined (the God of Abraham) and you have a recipe for guaranteeing authoritarian atrocities where people are treated inhumanely and without conscience for actions that cause no harm to anyone. The Abrahamic religions are a major cause of countless acts of authoritarian atrocity.

Authorities with concentrated power and a will to openly attack the majority of its citizens can of course commit such atrocities. But religion promotes authoritarianism in the populace and is what gets them to accept it or willingly participate in it without need for sustained violent control over the general population.
Religion makes it more likely that being gay would be viewed as worthy of inhumane treatment. But in some sense, I guess you're right that because these people were "forced" to participate, the method is actually less indicative of religion per se, than of authoritarian control in general. Had the stone throwers done so willingly, that would be more indicative and characteristic of the effects of religion itself as a particular tool of authoritarian control.
 
ronburgundy said:
I realize that. The point is that Derec's assumption cannot account for for such events in the past nor in the future, because he is assuming there is something unique about Islam, when there is not. [
Click to expand...
Nonsense. I am assuming no such thing. But given present-day Islam my assumption was perfectly valid given that this thread was posted in "Political Discussions" and not in "World History".

I am well aware that Abrahamic religions share common roots and that the other two were more barbaric in centuries past. But that hasn't been the case for several centuries. And what will happen in the future? Nobody knows, although the chances that Islam will reform itself in any meaningful sense within our lifetimes are infinitesimal.

The nature of these religions are the same.
Click to expand...
The origin may be the same, but the present-day nature is not.

The difference lies in whether they are allowed to be the near sole determinant of ethics or are largely restrained by prevailing secular values. Taking this true contextual rather than inherent difference into account allows to better prediction of such events regardless of era.
Click to expand...
It may not be "inherent" (I do not believe it is) but it is also more than merely contextual.
 
ronburgundy said:
Toni said:
To be honest, I am not certain how extremist Islam differs in punishment of 'offenders' very much from how 'offenders' in say, China or North Korea are punished. I mean, sure, it's not public stoning, with the public coerced into participating but it's still extremely harsh and just as deadly. And it's state sponsored, meaning that the people may not be throwing the stones themselves, but they are allowing horrific punishments by their proxy: the government they choose to accept. Throw in forced late term abortions in China and you get the innocence factor thrown in.

My point is that we can no more blame Islam for such atrocities than Islamic extremists can claim justification by Islam for such atrocities. The source of such barbarity is not religion.
Click to expand...

The fact that a person can get lung cancer via means other than smoking tobacco, doesn't mean that smoking tobacco is not the primary cause of many if not most of the instances of lung cancer.

Faith is the world's most effective enabler of authoritarianism. Combine that with the most authoritarian concept ever imagined (the God of Abraham) and you have a recipe for guaranteeing authoritarian atrocities where people are treated inhumanely and without conscience for actions that cause no harm to anyone. The Abrahamic religions are a major cause of countless acts of authoritarian atrocity.

Authorities with concentrated power and a will to openly attack the majority of its citizens can of course commit such atrocities. But religion promotes authoritarianism in the populace and is what gets them to accept it or willingly participate in it without need for sustained violent control over the general population.
Religion makes it more likely that being gay would be viewed as worthy of inhumane treatment. But in some sense, I guess you're right that because these people were "forced" to participate, the method is actually less indicative of religion per se, than of authoritarian control in general. Had the stone throwers done so willingly, that would be more indicative and characteristic of the effects of religion itself as a particular tool of authoritarian control.
Click to expand...

Sorry but a better reading and understanding of history, not to mention, current events, will demonstrate that religion is merely a tool used by authoritarians--and only one!, not the source of authoritarians. Only one tool. Plenty make do with other tools quite nicely. Note China, Korea, any of the communist countries, past or present, as well as others.
 
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