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If You're Black

RavenSky

The Doctor's Wife
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Oct 19, 2011
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atheist
I wasn't going to start a whole new thread on just this, but didn't see a related thread that has been active recently so...

Interesting study/videographic done by the Tampa Bay Times about police shootings:

http://www.tampabay.com/projects/2017/investigations/florida-police-shootings/if-youre-black/

More about the study: http://www.tampabay.com/projects/2017/investigations/florida-police-shootings/

No one was keeping track of police shootings in the country’s third-largest state. So in 2014, the Tampa Bay Times set out to count every officer-involved shooting in Florida during a six-year period. We learned that at least 827 people were shot by police — one every 2½ days. We learned that blacks are shot at a higher rate than whites.
 
When her baby was born, Natasha Clemons hugged him and kissed him and promised to God she’d protect him from the mean world. She never laid him in a crib because she needed him close. She drove him to school because she didn’t trust bus drivers. She took him to church, taught him to mind his manners, to respect the police and do what they say.

She constantly texted his coaches and teachers when she shipped him off to college in New Mexico on a football scholarship. She wore a T-shirt that said RODNEY’S MOM on senior day and held his hand as they walked across the field. Helicopter parent? She was a backpack.

And with her college graduate back home in Sarasota, tooling around in his mother’s white Jeep Liberty with the five-star safety rating and the gospel music in the CD player, she worried.

She texted him, like she did most nights.

Come home.

Rodney Mitchell, 23, who worked at Kohl’s department store, was on his way around 9:30 p.m. on June 11, 2012, when he saw police lights in the rearview mirror. He pulled off U.S. 301 and came to a stop on Washington Court, just north of Dr. Martin Luther King Way.

The deputy getting out of the Crown Victoria behind Mitchell was the same age and also had gone to college on a football scholarship. Under different circumstances, they would’ve had a lot to talk about.

Adam Shaw had made mistakes in 2½ years with the Sarasota County Sheriff’s Office. He’d been disciplined for stopping minority residents for seatbelt violations then illegally searching their cars. Now he was part of Operation Armistice. Police were saturating north Sarasota to reduce crime. The black community scornfully called it Operation Amistad, after the slave ship.

Mitchell, in the Jeep with Florida tag GODANGL, was the next target.

Shaw would later say he saw Mitchell wasn’t wearing a seatbelt as the two passed on the road going opposite directions, even if it was nighttime and the Jeep had tinted windows. He would say the car didn’t stop soon enough, and that after it stopped, the driver was moving around a lot inside. He would say the driver refused to put the car into park.

What Mitchell’s 16-year-old cousin remembers from the passenger’s seat is a white cop rushing to the driver’s window and shouting: “Boy, why didn’t you stop the car?”

He remembers another officer walking to the front of the Jeep, the spotlight from his vehicle beaming through the windshield. He remembers Rodney Mitchell’s hands on the steering wheel, and Shaw ordering him to put the car into park. He remembers his unarmed cousin moving his right hand from the wheel toward the gearshift, then the flash from a muzzle, then the sound of four shots.

Pop, pop, pop, pop.

From stop to gunfire: 41 seconds.

Natasha Clemons raced to the scene when a friend called. Police would not let her go to Rodney, sprawled in the driver’s seat, wearing his seatbelt. She collapsed right there, bathed in the blue lights of the lawmen who killed her only son.

http://www.tampabay.com/projects/2017/investigations/florida-police-shootings/why-cops-shoot/
 
And You Know It Clap Your Hands!

sorry :blush:
 
Some snippets

Cook believes police violence stems from the militarization of police, and the spread of SWAT teams after the Watts Riots in the mid 1960s. Police agencies use grants to buy military-grade equipment such as Bearcat armored vehicles, M-16 rifles and night-vision goggles. These programs grew at the same time Washington launched the war on drugs and passed laws to let cops take cash and property from suspected criminals without even pressing charges. It’s called “civil asset forfeiture,” and its use has grown leaps. In 2014, for the first time ever, police took more from American citizens than burglars did, according to economist Martin Armstrong, who used statistics from the FBI and Institute for Justice. Police departments use the money, cars and homes seized through civil asset forfeiture to support their budgets.
bolding mine

And blacks make up 57 percent of the shootings that start as traffic stops. That’s in a state where, according to an ACLU analysis of public data, blacks are cited for seatbelt violations nearly twice as often as whites.

The Times’ data shows that blacks were more likely to be shot in the back, shot during the commission of a minor crime, shot while trying to run and shot for resisting arrest.

Combined, whites were more likely to be shot after killing, injuring or threatening the police.
 
And a different way of looking at policing

I would really love to quote this guy's entire story. I strongly encourage everyone to read it:

Daytona Beach Bike Week, 2013. Chief Mike Chitwood, wearing shorts and a three-button polo and a salt-and-pepper mustache, was walking down a packed Main Street in Daytona Beach when a man told Chitwood he was a sovereign citizen and the police had no authority over him.

Chitwood knew the man was drunk, so he played it cool. He turned and started to walk away.

Michael Deangelo, 43, spit on the chief’s back. Chitwood tried to arrest him and Deangelo started fighting. They fell and Chitwood smacked his head on a motorcycle hard enough for four stitches. His right index finger wound up in Deangelo’s mouth and the crazed man was trying to bite it off. Chitwood, a lefty, could have gone for the gun holstered on his left hip, but he unleashed blow after blow to the man’s skull, breaking his left hand in four places, until his assailant finally let go. Bystanders helped Chitwood cuff and arrest Deangelo. Chitwood got a cast and stitches and went back to work later that day, finger intact.

He relayed the story a few months ago in his office.

“I’m not going to shoot him,” he said in an accent that betrayed his Philadelphia upbringing. “The key to use of force anywhere is proportionality. Would you use an elephant gun to kill a flea? Would I use deadly force if somebody was biting on my finger?” His answer was no.

Comb through six years of police shooting reports and Chitwood’s response seems shockingly subdued.

“You can get your finger sewed back on,” he said. “It’s not like he had a knife and he was plunging it in my chest. It was my finger ... I think anybody would have a hard time saying, ‘He bit me, so I shot and killed him.’”

In most situations, if the suspect is unarmed, there’s no reason to use lethal force, he said.

That alone could have reduced a fifth of the 827 shootings in the Times’ database in which the person shot had no weapon.

It's on the same page as the other snippets, about halfway down

http://www.tampabay.com/projects/2017/investigations/florida-police-shootings/why-cops-shoot/
 
Sorry we've moved on to being mad about Kendall Jenner now.
- Black lives matter
 

...which is why there's a movement to place the issue at the forefront of public awareness. Because a significant number of people care more about reality TV show celebrities and soft drink ads than they do about citizens needlessly killed by police, and a significant number of people want to keep it that way.
 
Dismal is right, any topic that trends lower than Kendall Jenner doesn't matter.
 
Sorry we've moved on to being mad about Kendall Jenner now.
- Black lives matter

That's a very...ignorant take on what they've been up to...

As to the OP...well, yes, same as it ever was. And given what Jeff Sessions has said recently, compared to Holder and Lynch did, and what Clinton had proposed, well, the activists seem to know where their efforts should be focused on. Things like Ferguson's mayor being reelected are disappointing, even though these random elections rarely turn out well. But since consent decrees themselves are usually overseen by courts rather than the DoJ, that's not too awful.
 
How about someone* actually read the various articles before derailing the thread with your usual fucking bullshit.

Seriously, people, especially read the part about the Sheriff in Daytona. There are some excellent points of discussion in this massive investigative piece by the Tampa reporter without you fucking up yet another thread with your fucking derails and hobby horses.

READ THE FUCKING ARTICLE AND COMMENT ON WHAT IS IN THE ARTICLE. Anything else is going to be reported.




* I know that a few of you have, and this is not directed at you
 
How about someone* actually read the various articles before derailing the thread with your usual fucking bullshit.

Seriously, people, especially read the part about the Sheriff in Daytona. There are some excellent points of discussion in this massive investigative piece by the Tampa reporter without you fucking up yet another thread with your fucking derails and hobby horses.

READ THE FUCKING ARTICLE AND COMMENT ON WHAT IS IN THE ARTICLE. Anything else is going to be reported.

* I know that a few of you have, and this is not directed at you

I've read a couple of articles about these findings.

And, I should probably go find them, but I do have a thing or two to say...

The most obvious one is police reform. This *should* be a priority, to move away from the "warrior" view of policing, and towards "protect and serve". The notion that police should immediately attack any potential threat, rather than deescalate or look out for other citizens (note: *other*) is a major problem. It's what leads us to the nonsense we saw in Ferguson, Baltimore, or Baton Rouge. Other countries manage to do this far better than the US, so we should look to them, I suppose.

Second...yes, obviously, racial prejudice plays a role in all this. Anyone who says otherwise in the US, is only fooling themselves. That has to be addressed.

Here's the thing - I see no short-term solution, as of Toupee Fiasco's election. There can be local discussions, for sure, but any long-term, national matter, will take organizing, voting, and so forth. Sessions has cut off any national movement - as I expected.

But this is about the long haul. These issues have been around for centuries. Celebrate every victory, since we deserve it, and it's nice to do so, rather than just stress out until you drop dead. But keep at it.
 
I've read a couple of articles about these findings.

And, I should probably go find them, but I do have a thing or two to say...

The most obvious one is police reform. This *should* be a priority, to move away from the "warrior" view of policing, and towards "protect and serve". The notion that police should immediately attack any potential threat, rather than deescalate or look out for other citizens (note: *other*) is a major problem. It's what leads us to the nonsense we saw in Ferguson, Baltimore, or Baton Rouge. Other countries manage to do this far better than the US, so we should look to them, I suppose...

This was why I found the bit about Chief Mike Chitwood in Daytona (He has now been elected Sheriff of Volusia County) to be very interesting. Prior to him, Daytona did not have a good reputation for their policing. Perhaps not as bad as - for example - Sanford or Ferguson, but not good either.

It appears that Chitwood has done a decent job of turning that around. Not perfect. There was a report of Chitwood using a racial slur that cause quite a controversy; and he has publically called gun-right's advocates "knuckle-heads" and a political opponent a moron

On the flip side:

Caught speeding, Volusia Sheriff Mike Chitwood insists on ticket

[Chitwood] took the job [as Daytona Beach Police chief in 2006] because he saw it as a challenge.

“Crime was out of control, the Police Department was out of control,” he said. “There was a lack of confidence in the police, and it seemed that every day there were bad stories about something that the Police Department was doing in the paper.”

Chitwood started to train officers in de-escalation and began equipping officers with body cameras in 2012, before that technology was widely adopted. He recorded everything that happened inside the police station, including line-ups and interviews, so “there’s no shenanigans,” he said.

He began recruiting new officers from Bethune-Cookman University in 2007 and later instituted mandatory race and policing training with the historically black college’s help.

He encouraged officers to be effective communicators. He said most officers never fire their guns, yet they spend hundreds of hours at the gun range. They spend far less time training in active listening and communication.

“We’re proficient in (shooting), but we’re not proficient in the No. 1 thing: dealing with people,” he said. “I think the No. 1 complaint in America against police officers is rudeness.”

He also began to try to keep crooked cops out of his department by hiring people with solid, deep background investigations. He established an alert system to try to identify rogue cops. He started randomly drug testing officers...

What’s particularly interesting about Chitwood is the stricture of his policies, especially when it comes to police chases and use of force. He’s blunt. Don’t shoot into a vehicle. If you do shoot, he said, you’d better have tire tracks on your chest.

“I think most shootings that we see are because we the police put ourselves in a position that we don’t need to be in,” he said. “Today, for some reason, we’ve switched out of the guardian mentality and we’ve become warriors. And that’s not what American policing was founded on.”

He’s been involved for many years with Wexler’s group, the Police Executive Research Forum...

Wexler’s group organized a 2015 trip to Scotland for about 25 American police executives, including Chitwood, to learn how unarmed Scottish officers used de-escalation techniques to capture offenders armed with knives and bats...

“What I’m asking you to do is, in certain situations, slow down,” he said. “That first bit of information, that 911 call you get, it's not sometimes right. It's not most of the time right. It's always wrong. And if you're operating on that first piece of information and you're flying in at a hundred miles an hour with wrong information, you're going to make a wrong decision.”

Have his stricter policies worked?...

But the city had just four police shooting incidents between 2009 and 2014. Three of the Daytona shootings involved an armed suspect who was endangering lives; the other person shot had crashed into a car, led police on a chase and drove at an officer.

Armed assailants are also apprehended safely...

http://www.tampabay.com/projects/2017/investigations/florida-police-shootings/why-cops-shoot/
 
This was why I found the bit about Chief Mike Chitwood in Daytona (He has now been elected Sheriff of Volusia County) to be very interesting. Prior to him, Daytona did not have a good reputation for their policing. Perhaps not as bad as - for example - Sanford or Ferguson, but not good either.

It appears that Chitwood has done a decent job of turning that around. Not perfect. There was a report of Chitwood using a racial slur that cause quite a controversy; and he has publically called gun-right's advocates "knuckle-heads" and a political opponent a moron

On the flip side:

Caught speeding, Volusia Sheriff Mike Chitwood insists on ticket

Sounds like a good chief, overall. The truth is, it has to be local reforms that lead the way, although the federal government could (but again, won't under Toupee Fiasco) help immensely.
 

Scary stuff in there!

BLM activists and affiliated organizations published “The Movement for Black Lives,” a detailed and ambitious agenda. Divided into six parts, it includes a host of interconnected demands: a shift of public resources away from policing and prisons and into jobs and health care, a progressive overhaul of the tax code to “ensure a radical and sustainable redistribution of wealth,” expanded rights to clean air and fair housing and union organizing, and greater community control over police and schools. More detailed than the ten-point program issued by the Black Panthers, the BLM policy agenda offers a remarkably pragmatic yet potentially revolutionary blueprint—one that it aims to implement through the concerted use of both protest and politics.
 
Terrifying, right?

The idea of giving up...no. Not happening. it's just changing gears.
 
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