New low for academia

[Derec]

Clemson U.’s Diversity Training Says Being Late Is Okay Because Some Cultures Believe Time Is Relative

US academia is getting for crazy by the minute.

 

[laughing dog]

Clemson U.’s Diversity Training Says Being Late Is Okay Because Some Cultures Believe Time Is Relative

US academia is getting for crazy by the minute.

Of course, one could get that impression from reading that type of propaganda without using any reason. The "training" in question is voluntary and no one is required to adhere to its "teachings". Moreover, if someone is late once to a class, that is not really a big issue in most cases. Professors do not routinely wait to start class and they are not typically expected to postpone starting a class until everyone is seated.

This is just another example of a alt-snowflake over-reaction.

 

[Derec]

Of course, one could get that impression from reading that type of propaganda without using any reason.

It is Clemson that is not showing any reason.
And the worst thing is their suggestion that academic freedom and freedom of speech should be limited to politically correct speech.

Moreover, if someone is late once to a class, that is not really a big issue in most cases.

It was not so much about lectures, but meetings, appointments etc. And rules should apply to everybody equally, no matter what "culture" they come from.
And how will this nonsense serve Clemson graduates in their working life? Will they expect their employers to be tolerant of their tardiness because of "culture"?

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Clemson U.’s Diversity Training Says Being Late Is Okay Because Some Cultures Believe Time Is Relative

US academia is getting for crazy by the minute.

I don't understand the issue. Could you tell us what is exactly wrong with understanding that different cultures have different expectations of punctuality and being chill about it? Or are you German?

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Will they expect their employers to be tolerant of their tardiness because of "culture"?

Most professionals don't have set hours and a supervisor greeting them at the door.

 

[laughing dog]

It is Clemson that is not showing any reason.
And the worst thing is their suggestion that academic freedom and freedom of speech should be limited to politically correct speech.

You are babbling nonsense.

It was not so much about lectures, but meetings, appointments etc. And rules should apply to everybody equally, no matter what "culture" they come from.

Again, these are suggestions. There is nothing stopping anyone from starting a meeting on time. The over-the-top reaction in the article and your responses is truly disturbing. At best, this is a non-issue.

And how will this nonsense serve Clemson graduates in their working life? Will they expect their employers to be tolerant of their tardiness because of "culture"?

Wow. One would think Clemson was instituting Sharia law instead of basically suggesting to staff to sometimes chill out.

 

[Elixir]

Will they expect their employers to be tolerant of their tardiness because of "culture"?

Most professionals don't have set hours and a supervisor greeting them at the door.

If Derec has the kind of job where punctuality is paramount, I can understand his resentment. I try really hard to be early to the office, if for no other reason than to set an example. But nobody gets confronted at the door at 8:15 and asked "why are you late"?

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Most professionals don't have set hours and a supervisor greeting them at the door.

If Derec has the kind of job where punctuality is paramount, I can understand his resentment. I try really hard to be early to the office, if for no other reason than to set an example. But nobody gets confronted at the door at 8:15 and asked "why are you late"?

We do here, and my boss is a hated micromanager. She can come in whenever, but We get a talking to if we are a minute late.

 

[TSwizzle]

Clemson University's $25,000 diversity initiative asks professors to endorse a novel opinion about punctuality: it's wrong, and probably colonialist, to expect people to show up to a meeting on time.

Clemson Chief Diversity Officer Lee Gill—who was paid $185,000 last year, according to The Tiger Town Observer—did not respond to a request for comment.

Bonkers. If Gill is the "chief", I wonder how much the others are on. What a waste of money.

 

[Elixir]

If Derec has the kind of job where punctuality is paramount, I can understand his resentment. I try really hard to be early to the office, if for no other reason than to set an example. But nobody gets confronted at the door at 8:15 and asked "why are you late"?

We do here, and my boss is a hated micromanager. She can come in whenever, but We get a talking to if we are a minute late.

That is a detriment to team-building IMO. We went to a time-clock for non-salaried employees, and nobody ever gets reamed for being late unless there is an "all hands" project on the boards and they fail to give notice that they're going to be late arriving/ early departing. Other than that, the emphasis is on getting the job done, just like for salaried employees. People take charge of their duties when they're empowered to do it their way. Micromanaged employees tend to do the bare minimum, or less if they think they can get away with it.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

We do here, and my boss is a hated micromanager. She can come in whenever, but We get a talking to if we are a minute late.

That is a detriment to team-building IMO. We went to a time-clock for non-salaried employees, and nobody ever gets reamed for being late unless there is an "all hands" project on the boards and they fail to give notice that they're going to be late arriving/ early departing. Other than that, the emphasis is on getting the job done, just like for salaried employees. People take charge of their duties when they're empowered to do it their way. Micromanaged employees tend to do the bare minimum, or less if they think they can get away with it.

We also get bonkers projects like counting and categorizing the street signs on campus. (Our office has nothing to do with facilities or traffic.)

 

[Keith&Co.]

Most professionals don't have set hours and a supervisor greeting them at the door.

When I was in the military, being ten minutes early was considered about five minutes late.

Now, I work for a military contractor, with a HUGE percentage of former military personnel, and while there are core hours which provide a bandwidth for meetings, individuals set their own hours. Big culture shift. And yet, to a large degree, it's the same culture. I mean, it's the same people.

EVERY training session I've ever given at this company, someone has arrived late, or someone has left early. Or walked out in the middle to handle a phone call and come back.
None of this has changed the way I've given the course or the time I started/stopped.

And amazingly, they do not demand that I cover what they missed until everyone else has gone, and then ask if I have time to cover it. Like, I dunno, grown ups or professionals.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

I'd also like to point out this nugget:

Another portion of the training explains that freedom of speech and academic freedom have limits—and those limits involve language that hurts other people, particularly members of protected groups.

His beef is with the Supreme Court and other courts which have made rulings on the limits of speech not Clemson University.

 

[TV and credit cards]

When you start the meeting is not nearly as important as what you accomplish during the meeting. This is a cultural difference. That you not conclude the meeting until both parties are to some degree satisfied. This too is a cultural difference.
When you consider all that can be important about a meeting, when you actually start it is small beer.
http://www.businessinsider.com/how-different-cultures-understand-time-2014-5

 

[dismal]

Clemson U.’s Diversity Training Says Being Late Is Okay Because Some Cultures Believe Time Is Relative

US academia is getting for crazy by the minute.

I don't understand the issue. Could you tell us what is exactly wrong with understanding that different cultures have different expectations of punctuality and being chill about it? Or are you German?

What are these cultures that are habitually late?

 

[Nice Squirrel]

I don't understand the issue. Could you tell us what is exactly wrong with understanding that different cultures have different expectations of punctuality and being chill about it? Or are you German?

What are these cultures that are habitually late?

From what I understand, Brasil and Argentina, parts of the Midwest, Native Americans, Nepalese to name a few

 

[Elixir]

I don't understand the issue. Could you tell us what is exactly wrong with understanding that different cultures have different expectations of punctuality and being chill about it? Or are you German?

What are these cultures that are habitually late?

I never have had a job or employed anyone in Europe of Japan, so I don't really know. Found this though:

"In countries like Britain, it is perfectly acceptable for employees to leave at the end of their working day, be it five or seven pm.
In other European countries like Italy or Greece, they might leave earlier.
Staff are required to work for a fixed number of hours after which their thoughts might turn to family or dinner.
The value they put on their private lives are as important as work. So leaving early, although their colleagues may not have finished for the day, is not considered unprofessional.
In contrast, the Japanese employees feel duty-bound to stay until their superior does, even if that means staying on till after 10pm."

 

[Sarpedon]

In Japanese there's a word for working oneself to death, and it commonly appears on death certificates.

 

[dismal]

What are these cultures that are habitually late?

From what I understand, Brasil and Argentina, parts of the Midwest, Native Americans, Nepalese to name a few

I googled "Nepalese habitually late" and didn't find anything suggesting this has been proven.

Do you have something to document this?

 

[Jayjay]

What are these cultures that are habitually late?

I never have had a job or employed anyone in Europe of Japan, so I don't really know. Found this though:

"In countries like Britain, it is perfectly acceptable for employees to leave at the end of their working day, be it five or seven pm.
In other European countries like Italy or Greece, they might leave earlier.
Staff are required to work for a fixed number of hours after which their thoughts might turn to family or dinner.
The value they put on their private lives are as important as work. So leaving early, although their colleagues may not have finished for the day, is not considered unprofessional.
In contrast, the Japanese employees feel duty-bound to stay until their superior does, even if that means staying on till after 10pm."

That's true. I never worked in Japan, but have worked for a company that had branches in there. Rumour has it, that one European workaholic boss who usually stayed at the office very late, inadvertently made his subordinates suffer the same hours. That lasted until one person politely suggested that the boss take a walk around the block at 6pm so that his team can sneak home.