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Game of Thrones - Season 8 (spoilers)

Jimmy Higgins

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So, we are well into Season 8 and the only thing that comes mind is "what the hell is with this crap?"

7 years of character development -> thrown away
Situational significances -> irrelevant
Plot development -> fuck it

Let's substitute plot consistency with lazy ass writing that introduces us to ignoring basic common sense and welcoming very ridiculous coincidences, each one right after the other. Throw away notions of explaining a resolution of a known conflict, it'll just be fine.

I feared Season 8 was in for trouble, and in general, it has had little pay off.
 
on the one hand it's tragic but on the other hand it's completely understandable, and in fact pretty much unavoidable unless you had just an astoundingly spectacular creative team, and GoT has never had that.

let me preface this by stating that i read a lot of fantasy, and i have been doing so for 25 years - it's my primary leisure activity, i've read literally hundreds of fantasy novels in my life.
GoT the books has never been spectacularly good in any significant way, but what made it stand out was that it felt like a story which had characters that we followed, but we were following them through the story instead of following them through their own narrative.
this gives the books a sense of realism and of consequence, that actions have meaning and choices matter, that as a general rule characters don't have plot armor and so if shit hits the fan, anything could happen. that makes them refreshing and vibrant in a genre that is normally quite tame and procedural.

the big problem with the show and how it was obvious that where it's come to was inevitable is in the fact that it's never been a particularly good adaptation of the books.
sure it has a big budget and it's well produced and has good actors, but the story being told within the show was never more than the loosest outline version of the books, simply getting from point A to point B within the book's plot in a way that makes coherent sense but loses all the nuance - which in one sense is understandable given production and budgets and network needs and all that, but it really shines a lot on the issue at the core of the show: from the very start, every time it deviated from the source material, it was terrible.
cut out a major scene or subplot? it's a huge chunk of the fiber of the narrative being ripped out.
added something new that isn't in the books? it's a shitshow of bad writing, gratuitous nudity, or both.
recontextualized or changed certain characters, emphasized one, reduced the role of another? it's stupid and makes no sense and is done solely and very obviously for the purposes of fan service and production, or what we'll call "narrative for the purposes of show reasons".

so the writing was on the wall from the very beginning that when they no longer had the plot beats from the books to stick to, shit was gonna go massively off the rails.
this started happening even before the show eclipsed the books, where they so utterly rat-fucked the side plot going on in dorne, wrecked pretty much everything about danaerys, messed up the side plots with brienne and the hound, made arya's journey and induction into the house of white and black utterly ridiculous, fucked up all the stuff with the night's watch and wildlings, etc etc.
the show has been totally fucking everything up since like season 5, it just had enough of the books to still adhere to that it had some semblance of hope.
but pretty much as soon as the show went past the books it's been obvious that the creative team on GoT just isn't very good.
and i don't mean to armchair too much on this, god knows i couldn't make a TV show, but it's clear the team that this crew has just isn't good at writing a story that follows the blueprint set forth by the source material.

once the show surpassed the books, it started becoming "a show" - the narrative doesn't follow logic, main characters have invincible plot armor, fan favorites get shoe-horned into whatever situation they think will excite the fans, and the show is cut back in scale or number of episodes based on scheduling conflicts or budgets or whatever other crap it is that derails TV projects, etc etc.

i don't think GoT was ever an especially great show, it was just an adequate adaptation of some surprisingly decent books, but it never had a writing team that could handle making a show on their own.
it's been coasting off the first 3 seasons for like 4 years now, this crapfest it is now just isn't too surprising.
 
Not a big fan of all the plot armour, but that has been creeping into the show for a while. And I daresay the flaws in season 8 have been in the show for a while (that episode in season 7 where all the bros went on a road trip beyond the wall fanfic style did it for me). With hindsight, what they should have done was kill off a main character in the first episode of the season, bringing back the anyone can die gimmick it was once famous for.

Oh, well. The only show I can think of in recent memory that ended strong was 12 Monkeys. At least GoT is more watchable than the last season of Dexter.
 
Khal Drogo said:
And to my son, The Stallion Who Will Mount the Word, I will also pledge a gift. I will give him the Iron Chair that his mother's father sat upon. I will give him Seven Kingdoms. I, Drogo, will do this. I will take my Khalasar west to where the world ends...
...and ride wooden horses across the black salt water as no Khal has done before! I will kill the men in iron suits and tear down their stone houses! I will rape their women, take their children as slaves, and bring their broken gods back to Vaes Dothrak! This, I vow, I, Drogo, son of Bharbo. I swear before the Mother of Mountains as the stars look down in witness! As the stars look down in witness! As the stars look down in witness!

tumblr_osvpzfZHC21r00543o4_250.gif
 
Not a big fan of all the plot armour, but that has been creeping into the show for a while. And I daresay the flaws in season 8 have been in the show for a while (that episode in season 7 where all the bros went on a road trip beyond the wall fanfic style did it for me). With hindsight, what they should have done was kill off a main character in the first episode of the season, bringing back the anyone can die gimmick it was once famous for.
This is less about dying, but more about how characters are dying. Euron Greyjoy comes out of the blue into the series and then the intersections of the plot with him and Jamie were unthinkably contrived... and entirely without purpose, other than to allow a character to get killed off.

Tyrion talking with his brother about the certainty of loss... and it makes you think there is an ace in the hole... but no ace, just more ignoring the back drop set up.
 
So, we are well into Season 8 and the only thing that comes mind is "what the hell is with this crap?"

7 years of character development -> thrown away
Situational significances -> irrelevant
Plot development -> fuck it

Let's substitute plot consistency with lazy ass writing that introduces us to ignoring basic common sense and welcoming very ridiculous coincidences, each one right after the other. Throw away notions of explaining a resolution of a known conflict, it'll just be fine.

I feared Season 8 was in for trouble, and in general, it has had little pay off.

Why develop the plot? The only function the last season has to do is to make all the forshadowings come true or just kill them just when it's to come true, ie introduce a "twist" to make us go "Huh". Ever seen a Hollywood movie? Ever noticed how you could walk out of the last third of the movie and not miss a thing, because it's painfully predictable? That's the last season of GoT. They're not doing anything wrong. They're doing what it says on the tin. Newsflash... at the end of this season all of the characters will be thrown away.

It's on the rails now. They killed the Night King. The only things left to happen is for Denaerys to conquer Cersie/King's Landing, then turn into a loony and get killed by John Snow who becomes the king of the Iron throne. And tie a neat bow on everybody's personal stories. The survivors will be granted land (unfairly) to create future conflict that can be exploited.
 
So, we are well into Season 8 and the only thing that comes mind is "what the hell is with this crap?"

7 years of character development -> thrown away
Situational significances -> irrelevant
Plot development -> fuck it

Let's substitute plot consistency with lazy ass writing that introduces us to ignoring basic common sense and welcoming very ridiculous coincidences, each one right after the other. Throw away notions of explaining a resolution of a known conflict, it'll just be fine.

I feared Season 8 was in for trouble, and in general, it has had little pay off.

Why develop the plot?
I'm saying adhere to the past. Nothing in Denaerys' plot line indicates she'd do what was done.
 
At first, the whole episode may seem like Opposite Day, but then if you think a bit, it really isn't.
 
So, we are well into Season 8 and the only thing that comes mind is "what the hell is with this crap?"

7 years of character development -> thrown away
Situational significances -> irrelevant
Plot development -> fuck it

Let's substitute plot consistency with lazy ass writing that introduces us to ignoring basic common sense and welcoming very ridiculous coincidences, each one right after the other. Throw away notions of explaining a resolution of a known conflict, it'll just be fine.

I feared Season 8 was in for trouble, and in general, it has had little pay off.

Why develop the plot?
I'm saying adhere to the past. Nothing in Denaerys' plot line indicates she'd do what was done.

My first thought was that this is going to be a test of Jon's loyalty to Denaerys.
 
I'm saying adhere to the past. Nothing in Denaerys' plot line indicates she'd do what was done.

My first thought was that this is going to be a test of Jon's loyalty to Denaerys.

But they're brother and sister. They can't get married. One of them has to go. It won't be Jon because the rule of story narration is to always do what leads to the most drama. He's a reluctant king. Like Aragorn. Denaery's wants to be the queen. So obviously Jon will be king. Denaery's will fuck it up when victory is within her grasp. She's already foreshadowed going crazy. It would be irresponsible writing to have her not go crazy at this point. Jon will then be forced to take the throne somehow. Perhaps killing Denaery's.

There's also the GoT character writing. I wasn't the first nor only person to figure this out. Every member in each family has the same personality. The Targergyens are all nutcases. Brilliant. But nuts. The Stark's are all down to Earth and loyal. The Greyjoys are all proud and opportunists. Etc. This has been consistent throughout GoT. So Denary's has to go crazy. Or they'll break their own story rules they've set for themselves.
 
I'm saying adhere to the past. Nothing in Denaerys' plot line indicates she'd do what was done.
There is family history. Her father went nuts and was ready to destroy the entire city rather than lose the throne, prompting Jamie to kill him. She even brought up the question with Tyrion if she was going to be like him. After losing two dragons and her best friend, and the realization it is not as easy to become a popular ruler in a land that doesn't know her, she went over the edge.
 
I'm saying adhere to the past. Nothing in Denaerys' plot line indicates she'd do what was done.
There is family history. Her father went nuts and was ready to destroy the entire city rather than lose the throne, prompting Jamie to kill him. She even brought up the question with Tyrion if she was going to be like him. After losing two dragons and her best friend, and the realization it is not as easy to become a popular ruler in a land that doesn't know her, she went over the edge.

I will add:

Daenerys has killed people before, too, which has slowly transformed from justice-like killing to murder. It just has not been quite like this and in these numbers. She killed the woman priestess using a somewhat warped sense of justice. Likewise, she killed the Khals. She kidnapped Jon Snow and Ser Davos but what would happen if he had not bent the knee? She murdered the Tarley lords. They were unarmed.

And she's had instincts to do this very thing, bringing fire to King's Landing, even talked about it. But she was talked down with a great support team. For example, at Dragonstone in her war room...

Most recently, one member of her team was murdered, one of a handful of diplomatic ones. And her last word was "Dracarys." Meanwhile, the rest of the support team keeping her from actualizing her worst instincts cannot be trusted, suspected of treason against her. It's betrayer Tyrion's advice against words that echo from Lady Tyrell: "don't listen to clever men [or whatever she said]" and "Be a Dragon." Why would she still listen to Tyrion?
 
She wanted fear. The city people were calling for the ringing of the bells not out of hope, but in fear.

And then she decided to lay waste to everything.
 
on the one hand it's tragic but on the other hand it's completely understandable, and in fact pretty much unavoidable unless you had just an astoundingly spectacular creative team, and GoT has never had that.

let me preface this by stating that i read a lot of fantasy, and i have been doing so for 25 years - it's my primary leisure activity, i've read literally hundreds of fantasy novels in my life.
GoT the books has never been spectacularly good in any significant way, but what made it stand out was that it felt like a story which had characters that we followed, but we were following them through the story instead of following them through their own narrative.
this gives the books a sense of realism and of consequence, that actions have meaning and choices matter, that as a general rule characters don't have plot armor and so if shit hits the fan, anything could happen. that makes them refreshing and vibrant in a genre that is normally quite tame and procedural.

the big problem with the show and how it was obvious that where it's come to was inevitable is in the fact that it's never been a particularly good adaptation of the books.
sure it has a big budget and it's well produced and has good actors, but the story being told within the show was never more than the loosest outline version of the books, simply getting from point A to point B within the book's plot in a way that makes coherent sense but loses all the nuance - which in one sense is understandable given production and budgets and network needs and all that, but it really shines a lot on the issue at the core of the show: from the very start, every time it deviated from the source material, it was terrible.
cut out a major scene or subplot? it's a huge chunk of the fiber of the narrative being ripped out.
added something new that isn't in the books? it's a shitshow of bad writing, gratuitous nudity, or both.
recontextualized or changed certain characters, emphasized one, reduced the role of another? it's stupid and makes no sense and is done solely and very obviously for the purposes of fan service and production, or what we'll call "narrative for the purposes of show reasons".

so the writing was on the wall from the very beginning that when they no longer had the plot beats from the books to stick to, shit was gonna go massively off the rails.
this started happening even before the show eclipsed the books, where they so utterly rat-fucked the side plot going on in dorne, wrecked pretty much everything about danaerys, messed up the side plots with brienne and the hound, made arya's journey and induction into the house of white and black utterly ridiculous, fucked up all the stuff with the night's watch and wildlings, etc etc.
the show has been totally fucking everything up since like season 5, it just had enough of the books to still adhere to that it had some semblance of hope.
but pretty much as soon as the show went past the books it's been obvious that the creative team on GoT just isn't very good.
and i don't mean to armchair too much on this, god knows i couldn't make a TV show, but it's clear the team that this crew has just isn't good at writing a story that follows the blueprint set forth by the source material.

once the show surpassed the books, it started becoming "a show" - the narrative doesn't follow logic, main characters have invincible plot armor, fan favorites get shoe-horned into whatever situation they think will excite the fans, and the show is cut back in scale or number of episodes based on scheduling conflicts or budgets or whatever other crap it is that derails TV projects, etc etc.

i don't think GoT was ever an especially great show, it was just an adequate adaptation of some surprisingly decent books, but it never had a writing team that could handle making a show on their own.
it's been coasting off the first 3 seasons for like 4 years now, this crapfest it is now just isn't too surprising.

I completely agree. GRRM made something compelling, by having the story drive the characters - it feels somehow 'realistic' in that this is how reality actually operates. In reality, everyone dies, and often critically important and/or hugely influential people die stupid and meaningless deaths.

Which makes for a very refreshing tale. But it's also a tale that cannot have a conclusion. New plot lines spin off constantly, and their arcs return to influence old plot lines, and there's never a conclusion, just more stuff happening. One character's life has a beginning, a middle, and an end; But the wider story is endless.

It was never possible to bring the series to a conclusion. And I am certain that this fact took GRRM himself by surprise. There can be no satisfactory end - but TV demands that all the loose ends be tied up in the last episode - or cauterised by weak plot devices before we get there.

The whole of season 8 is an attempt to finish the unfinishable. And to do it in a rush. Given those two constraints, I think they're doing as good a job as can be expected; But anyone with the expectation that this rushed and forced ending will generate the same sense of realism and the same ambitious scope as the first few series is going to be sadly disappointed.
 
Arya is going to assassinate (or attempt to assassinate) Dany. Leaving Jon as king.

There's no other reason for Arya to implausibly survive King's Landing other than so she can do this. The setup of her character is so badass that it will be incredibly clunky if she fails. But on the other hand, Jon is a bit too accidental as king in that scenario, so perhaps she gets caught in the attempt, and her killing is the final thing that drives Jon to seek the throne in his own right.

The number of story options is rapidly collapsing (which is why this series feels so much less entertaining than the previous ones), and the number of possible twists that can be played out without feeling like the writers are 'cheating' is diminishing even faster.

Anything is possible; But very few possibilities are left that don't require a painfully obvious break with the established canon.
 
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