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Elite NYC school publishes anti-racism manifesto

People aren't trying to control what you post. They are just confused by the fact that when they made the highly logical and evidence based inference that you object to such policies you engaged in a disingenuous pretense that you don't have any objections, only to voice those exact and accurately inferred objections in the next post."

I didn't claim to be 'concerned'. I said I disagreed with the policies and found them deeply problematic; disagreeing with a policy isn't "concern". I hope that Dalton implements every single policy, and that is not disingenuous. I want them to do it.

Disagreeing with a policy and claiming it is deeply problematic (which you now admit) are the same as being concerned and having an issue with those policies (which you denied). Now you're just playing semantic games to mask your disingenuous denials. You brought attention to something in a negative manner b/c you disagreed with it, that is the epitome of expressing concern about it. You want them to implement the policies b/c you believe it will make the schools failures and you want them to fail b/c you disagree with their politics. That doesn't mean you don't have any issues with their policies, which you denied having.

Metaphor said:
Toni said:
I'm not sure what your issue with Dalton is?
I did not say I had one.
 
Disagreeing with a policy and claiming it is deeply problematic (which you now admit) are the same as being concerned and having an issue with those policies (which you denied). Now you're just playing semantic games to mask your disingenuous denials. You brought attention to something in a negative manner b/c you disagreed with it, that is the epitome of expressing concern about it. You want them to implement the policies b/c you believe it will make the schools failures and you want them to fail b/c you disagree with their politics. That doesn't mean you don't have any issues with their policies, which you denied having.

I said I didn't say I was concerned, because I did not want the thread to devolve into people calling me a snowflake or the thread to be about my psychological state, which apparently it's turned into anyway.

Metaphor said:
Toni said:
I'm not sure what your issue with Dalton is?
I did not say I had one.

I didn't say I had one. But of course, Toni would know what my issue is, as, according to you, my interest in starting the thread was obvious to everyone. It should have been obvious to Toni, so I assume she is being deliberately obtuse.
 
I said I didn't say I was concerned, because I did not want the thread to devolve into people calling me a snowflake or the thread to be about my psychological state, which apparently it's turned into anyway.

Metaphor said:
Toni said:
I'm not sure what your issue with Dalton is?
I did not say I had one.

I didn't say I had one. But of course, Toni would know what my issue is, as, according to you, my interest in starting the thread was obvious to everyone. It should have been obvious to Toni, so I assume she is being deliberately obtuse.

No, I really do not understand why you start the threads that you do.

Some private expensive/exclusive school in a large city half a world away has some policy statements about their version of social justice/treating students and employees better and....??
 
I said I didn't say I was concerned, because I did not want the thread to devolve into people calling me a snowflake or the thread to be about my psychological state, which apparently it's turned into anyway.


I didn't say I had one. But of course, Toni would know what my issue is, as, according to you, my interest in starting the thread was obvious to everyone. It should have been obvious to Toni, so I assume she is being deliberately obtuse.

No, I really do not understand why you start the threads that you do.

Some private expensive/exclusive school in a large city half a world away has some policy statements about their version of social justice/treating students and employees better and....??

And the policies are poison, and the tactics are poison, and I will continue to provide examples of the mania.
 
And the policies are poison, and the tactics are poison, and I will continue to provide examples of the mania.

Here are some of the allegedly poisonous proposed policies from the OP


I
mplement name-, school-, and salary history-blind recruitment and hiring practices for faculty, staff, and administrative roles; require diversity statements as part of every application; publish expected salary range in every job posting; and publish data regarding the racial makeup of every stage of every hire.

Retain all security/maintenance/dining/other contracted staff without reduction in salary or benefits, regardless of whether Dalton is able to physically re-open facilities.

Provide child and elder care support for faculty and staff, and any families who qualify for financial aid, especially if Dalton remains primarily online due to COVID-19. Dalton should also restructure its parental leave policies for employees; rather than 6 weeks of paid leave and 6 weeks of unpaid leave, Dalton should follow the lead of companies like Netflix and offer a full year of paid leave for new parents.

Commit to paying all Dalton employees—especially staff and independent contractors—at minimum a living wage for New York, as calculated by MIT’s Living Wage Calculator. Ensure racial equity in the proportion of full- and part-time workers; independent contractors; faculty, staff, administration, and associate teachers; and publish information regarding the racial makeup of each of these categories every year.

Double individual faculty and staff professional development (PD) allotment if it is used to service student debt.

While I can understand why some people might get upset about "ensuring racial equity" in the proportion of staff and independent contractors, the rest of those selected policies seem pretty humane and innocuous. Hard to imagine why helping staff with their student debt, paying people living wages or basing hiring on the actual credentials.paying staff during school closure, or helping pay for elder/child care would be thought "poisonous".
 
No, I really do not understand why you start the threads that you do.

Some private expensive/exclusive school in a large city half a world away has some policy statements about their version of social justice/treating students and employees better and....??

And the policies are poison, and the tactics are poison, and I will continue to provide examples of the mania.

You do indeed provide examples of mania.
 
And the policies are poison, and the tactics are poison, and I will continue to provide examples of the mania.

Here are some of the allegedly poisonous proposed policies from the OP


I
mplement name-, school-, and salary history-blind recruitment and hiring practices for faculty, staff, and administrative roles; require diversity statements as part of every application; publish expected salary range in every job posting; and publish data regarding the racial makeup of every stage of every hire.

Retain all security/maintenance/dining/other contracted staff without reduction in salary or benefits, regardless of whether Dalton is able to physically re-open facilities.

Provide child and elder care support for faculty and staff, and any families who qualify for financial aid, especially if Dalton remains primarily online due to COVID-19. Dalton should also restructure its parental leave policies for employees; rather than 6 weeks of paid leave and 6 weeks of unpaid leave, Dalton should follow the lead of companies like Netflix and offer a full year of paid leave for new parents.

Commit to paying all Dalton employees—especially staff and independent contractors—at minimum a living wage for New York, as calculated by MIT’s Living Wage Calculator. Ensure racial equity in the proportion of full- and part-time workers; independent contractors; faculty, staff, administration, and associate teachers; and publish information regarding the racial makeup of each of these categories every year.

Double individual faculty and staff professional development (PD) allotment if it is used to service student debt.

While I can understand why some people might get upset about "ensuring racial equity" in the proportion of staff and independent contractors, the rest of those selected policies seem pretty humane and innocuous. Hard to imagine why helping staff with their student debt, paying people living wages or basing hiring on the actual credentials.paying staff during school closure, or helping pay for elder/child care would be thought "poisonous".

So, let me get this straight. The very first demand I quoted:

Commit to racial equity in leveled courses by 2023; at that time, if membership and performance of Black students are not at parity with non-Black students, leveled courses should be abolished.

You find "innocuous"?

Aren't you an academic, laughing dog? Do you think it would be reasonable for your course to be shut down if the grades between black and non-black students differed?
 
Here are some of the allegedly poisonous proposed policies from the OP


I

While I can understand why some people might get upset about "ensuring racial equity" in the proportion of staff and independent contractors, the rest of those selected policies seem pretty humane and innocuous. Hard to imagine why helping staff with their student debt, paying people living wages or basing hiring on the actual credentials.paying staff during school closure, or helping pay for elder/child care would be thought "poisonous".

So, let me get this straight. The very first demand I quoted:

Commit to racial equity in leveled courses by 2023; at that time, if membership and performance of Black students are not at parity with non-Black students, leveled courses should be abolished.

You find "innocuous"?

Aren't you an academic, laughing dog? Do you think it would be reasonable for your course to be shut down if the grades between black and non-black students differed?

Viva la revolución!

EqW-xRHXMAAvdTj
 
Here are some of the allegedly poisonous proposed policies from the OP


I

While I can understand why some people might get upset about "ensuring racial equity" in the proportion of staff and independent contractors, the rest of those selected policies seem pretty humane and innocuous. Hard to imagine why helping staff with their student debt, paying people living wages or basing hiring on the actual credentials.paying staff during school closure, or helping pay for elder/child care would be thought "poisonous".

So, let me get this straight. The very first demand I quoted:

Commit to racial equity in leveled courses by 2023; at that time, if membership and performance of Black students are not at parity with non-Black students, leveled courses should be abolished.

You find "innocuous"?

Aren't you an academic, laughing dog? Do you think it would be reasonable for your course to be shut down if the grades between black and non-black students differed?
That is non-responsive. You claimed the policies were poisonous. In standard English that suggests all of the policies. I presented some of them as innocuous. In standard English means those and only those proposals. Your response ignores all of them.

Your response suggests
1)a lack of reading comprehension, or
2)a tacit recognization that some of the proposals are not poisonous, or
3) a lack of humanity.

To address your non-responsive question, my answer would depend on the source(s) of that difference. If it was due to my racial bias, I’d expect me to be shutdown. If not, then no I wouldn’t.
 
That is non-responsive. You claimed the policies were poisonous. In standard English that suggests all of the policies.

No, it doesn't, any more than saying a bill before parliament is poisonous. You don't have to mean every sentence in the bill.

I presented some of them as innocuous. In standard English means those and only those proposals. Your response ignores all of them.

Even the ones you presented are not necessarily 'innocuous'. It calls for no reduction to any existing staff benefits despite all the additional financial demands the policies will make on Dalton, and despite the future state of classes at Dalton. The policies would prefer Dalton bankrupt itself to making any other kind of cut.

Your response suggests
1)a lack of reading comprehension, or
2)a tacit recognization that some of the proposals are not poisonous, or
3) a lack of humanity.

To address your non-responsive question, my answer would depend on the source(s) of that difference. If it was due to my racial bias, I’d expect me to be shutdown. If not, then no I wouldn’t.

Well, the proposed policy does not propose that either the course content or you be examined for racial bias. It will condemn a course that shows an unequal outcome, no matter what.
 
No, it doesn't, any more than saying a bill before parliament is poisonous. You don't have to mean every sentence in the bill.
Which is nothing at all equivalent to saying "the policies are poisonous". That is incredibly pathetic reasoning. When one says the bill is poisonous, it is about its intent, application and outcomes, not every sentence. When one says"the policies are poisonous" without any more information, standard reading comprehension is that it means all the policies.

So, is your pathetic analogy an acknowledge that only some of the policies are "poisonous". If so, which ones in particular are "poisonous"?

BTW, if policies are poisonous, then clearly any decent human being should be concerned about the deadly effects on the students, staff and parents of Dalton. However, you have repeatedly claimed you are not concerned at all. Hmmm.


Even the ones you presented are not necessarily 'innocuous'. It calls for no reduction to any existing staff benefits despite all the additional financial demands the policies will make on Dalton, and despite the future state of classes at Dalton. The policies would prefer Dalton bankrupt itself to making any other kind of cut.
You have no idea whether that policy would bankrupt Dalton. Certainly the Dalton administration is in a better position to make such a judgment that you.
Well, the proposed policy does not propose that either the course content or you be examined for racial bias.
You did not put those unnecessary conditions on your question.
It will condemn a course that shows an unequal outcome, no matter what.
No, it does not. "Should" is not "Shall". The use of the term "should" suggests that the presumption is the course will be cancelled unless there are mitigating factors. Of course, that interpretation could be incorrect but it is consistent with the usage.
 
Which is nothing at all equivalent to saying "the policies are poisonous". That is incredibly pathetic reasoning. When one says the bill is poisonous, it is about its intent, application and outcomes, not every sentence. When one says"the policies are poisonous" without any more information, standard reading comprehension is that it means all the policies.

So, is your pathetic analogy an acknowledge that only some of the policies are "poisonous". If so, which ones in particular are "poisonous"?

Some of the policies are outright poison. Some are virtue-signalling fluff. Some appear innocuous but could have unintended consequences. Some discriminate by race.

BTW, if policies are poisonous, then clearly any decent human being should be concerned about the deadly effects on the students, staff and parents of Dalton.

"Deadly". You lecture me a lot on language, laughing dog, and yet you appear entirely incapable of grasping elementary elements like a word having more than one definition or figurative use of language.

  • poisonous
    /ˈpɔɪzənəs/
    Learn to pronounce
    adjective

    (of a substance or plant) causing or capable of causing death or illness if taken into the body.
    "poisonous chemicals"
    (of an animal) producing poison as a means of attacking enemies or prey; venomous.
    adjective: poisonous
    "a poisonous snake"

    extremely unpleasant or malicious.
    "there was a poisonous atmosphere at the office"

However, you have repeatedly claimed you are not concerned at all. Hmmm.

Well, as you know, I am unhuman and inhumane.

You have no idea whether that policy would bankrupt Dalton. Certainly the Dalton administration is in a better position to make such a judgment that you.

I didn't say it would bankrupt anyone. I said the policy implies that Dalton should bankrupt itself before it makes any cuts.

You did not put those unnecessary conditions on your question.

It is quoting the Dalton signatory policy. The Dalton policy does not allow room for actual inspection of racial bias.

No, it does not. "Should" is not "Shall". The use of the term "should" suggests that the presumption is the course will be cancelled unless there are mitigating factors. Of course, that interpretation could be incorrect but it is consistent with the usage.

I guess the Dalton signatories should have clarified.
 
"Deadly". You lecture me a lot on language, laughing dog, and yet you appear entirely incapable of grasping elementary elements like a word having more than one definition or figurative use of language.
You are the one who hoped the adoption of these policies would put Dalton out of business (i.e. dead), Metaphor, not me. Soyour expected pedantry is as boring as it is fucking stupid.

I noticed you still have not identified the poisonous policies. It is almost as if you are making this up as you go along, Metaphor.

It is quoting the Dalton signatory policy. The Dalton policy does not allow room for actual inspection of racial bias.
No,it does not. That is your assumption.
 
You are the one who hoped the adoption of these policies would put Dalton out of business (i.e. dead). So pedantry is as boring as it is fucking stupid.

I noticed you still have not identified the poisonous policies. It is almost as if you are making this up as you go along.

For fuck's sake, I did it when I re-posted the very first demand--getting rid of courses with unequal outcomes.

That policy is poison.

No,it does not. That is your assumption.

The Dalton signatories are asking the school to agree to an inchoate policy. Perhaps you would be happy to assent to such a policy, but I wouldn't.
 
You are the one who hoped the adoption of these policies would put Dalton out of business (i.e. dead). So pedantry is as boring as it is fucking stupid.

I noticed you still have not identified the poisonous policies. It is almost as if you are making this up as you go along.

For fuck's sake, I did it when I re-posted the very first demand--getting rid of courses with unequal outcomes.

That policy is poison.
For Fuck's Sake yourself - there are multiple policies, and you specified "policies" not "a policy" as poisonous.

Are readers to assume your OP was driven by one and only one "poisonous" policy?
The Dalton signatories are asking the school to agree to an inchoate policy.
Why would you assume that no one can ask questions about interpretations?
Perhaps you would be happy to assent to such a policy, but I wouldn't.
I'm not the one making unsubstantiated assertions of fact - you are. I don't see why "inchoate" would inconvenience such a master of the inchoate OP.
 
For Fuck's Sake yourself - there are multiple policies, and you specified "policies" not "a policy" as poisonous.

Are readers to assume your OP was driven by one and only one "poisonous" policy?

No. I quoted multiple poison policies in the OP.

Why would you assume that no one can ask questions about interpretations?

Oh, I'm sure questions can be asked. But do you imagine from the way this policy is worded, that elements that may make it more reasonable are part of the intention? That, for example, what they really mean is "courses with unequal outcomes should be investigated for bias in course content, and for bias in teachers delivering the course, though the default assumption shall be 'no bias'."

It doesn't say anything like that. It simply calls for parity.

  1. Commit to racial equity in leveled courses by 2023; at that time, if membership and performance of Black students are not at parity with non-Black students, leveled courses should be abolished.



  • Research suggests that Black students, students of color, and low-income students are more likely to be tracked into lower-level courses, creating segregated learning environments that affect students’ educational trajectories. In the High School, there have been persistent complaints of de facto racial segregation in some “Advanced” courses. Dalton should ensure that there is no correlation between race and placement or grades in all tracked courses.

I'm not the one making unsubstantiated assertions of fact - you are. I don't see why "inchoate" would inconvenience such a master of the inchoate OP.

I'm posting stuff on a small message board to an audience mostly hostile to my ideas. But I'm flattered that you think my inchoate OPs have the same power for good or ill as a united front coterie of staff at an elite school using a particularly racially-charged time to enumerate two dozen policies.
 
No. I quoted multiple poison policies in the OP.
Without identifying which ones were poisonous and which ones were not. Or are we back to all of them poisonous? For someone who demands such percision from others, your responses are, at best, imprecise.
Oh, I'm sure questions can be asked. But do you imagine from the way this policy is worded, that elements that may make it more reasonable are part of the intention? That, for example, what they really mean is "courses with unequal outcomes should be investigated for bias in course content, and for bias in teachers delivering the course, though the default assumption shall be 'no bias'."

It doesn't say anything like that. It simply calls for parity.
The Dalton statement is imprecise. I would expect concerned parents or guardians to ask questions instead of kneejerk reactionary "OH NOES, IT IS THE AWFUL WOKE".
I'm posting stuff on a small message board to an audience mostly hostile to my ideas. But I'm flattered that you think my inchoate OPs have the same power for good or ill as a united front coterie of staff at an elite school using a particularly racially-charged time to enumerate two dozen policies.
I hope you did not break your arm patting yourself on your back with that straw man moronic praise.
 
Without identifying which ones were poisonous and which ones were not. Or are we back to all of them poisonous? For someone who demands such percision from others, your responses are, at best, imprecise.

Since you are now expressing particular interest in my opinions, I'll run through some of the policies and I will provide my reaction to them.

Proposals

Equitable Outcomes and Self-Evaluation


Commit to racial equity in leveled courses by 2023; at that time, if membership and performance of Black students are not at parity with non-Black students, leveled courses should be abolished.

Poison. Mentions nothing about examining the course content for bias. Mentions nothing about examining the teacher for bias. Not suprising, as this is in line with boilerplate CRT reasoning about inequitable outcomes meaning racism.

Dalton’s student body, faculty, staff, administration, and trustees should be representative of New York City in terms of gender, race, socioeconomic background, and immigration status by 2025. Dalton should publish yearly updates regarding the demographics of each of these groups.

Either meaningless, virtue-signalling fluff (since they propose no enforcement and they use that word you so delightfully drew my attention to - "should" and not shall), or, actual, idiotic, poisonous policy that assumes that there is some reason that Dalton should reflect NYC in this way, and that Dalton is doing something wrong if it does not.

As “an intentionally diverse community,” “an inclusive, democratic community,” and to ensure access and equity in the institution, Dalton should reflect the city in which it is located.

Idiotic. Is it going to reflect the number of people in NYC with criminal convictions? The age profile of NYC?

Anti-Racist Pedagogy

Adopt a two-pronged approach to course-related content changes: 1) Institute a divisional requirement for courses that explicitly center Black liberation and challenges to white supremacy.
The requirement should be equivalent to or greater than the smallest requirement for any other department.

Idiotic.


2) All other existing course content and departmental work via Dalton by Design should undergo an audit to ensure that content is guided by Dalton’s commitment to anti-racist education and diversity, equity, and inclusion.

Could be innocuous if you trust 'Dalton by Design'.

In the same way that subjects such as English, art, physical education, and mathematics have been embedded within the Dalton experience, so too should coursework that is explicitly anti-racist. No Dalton student should graduate without taking classes that center race, identity, difference, and social justice.

Why? Has the Dalton staff heard overwhelming demand from parents to institute this and make it compulsory? To turn Dalton from an ostensibly secular school into a religious one?

All faculty, staff, administration, Parent Association volunteers, and trustees should undergo yearly anti-racist training.

No requirement to measure the effect of the anti-racist training, if any. Just a compulsory requirement foisted on everyone including volunteers.


Administrators, faculty, and staff should produce individual public anti-racism statements.

Fucking deeply poisonous. It is not enough to be silent. You will publically confess your sins and your heartfelt desire not to sin again.

Expand the Office of Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion to include at least 12 full-time positions: one Director, one Office Assistant, three full-time staff members per division, and one full-time staff member for PE/Athletics.

No idea how big this Office is right now, but how can a school take on so many staff not dedicated to teaching any course content without fees going up significantly?
Implement name-, school-, and salary history-blind recruitment and hiring practices for faculty, staff, and administrative roles;

Really good idea.

require diversity statements as part of every application;

Poison.

Implementing explicitly anti-racist safeguards for recruitment, hiring, and promotion can be effective ways to reduce bias in recruitment and hiring. Research suggests the use of diversity statements early in a hiring process can be an effective strategy to improve equity in faculty hiring.

I'm certain research suggests it because despite the 'blind' recruiting suggested above, diversity statements allow for applicants to divulge their race and other details and for recruiters to pick favoured categories (women, people of colour).

Dalton should commit to publicly explaining the mechanisms that it employs to prevent discrimination in recruitment, hiring, and promotion.

Sounds okay.

Review and audit all vendor and third-party contracts to ensure that Dalton is partnering with Black-owned businesses wherever possible. Publish yearly reports detailing Dalton’s vendors and third-party contracts.

Discriminate against businesses by race of the owners. Poison.

Retain all security/maintenance/dining/other contracted staff without reduction in salary or benefits, regardless of whether Dalton is able to physically re-open facilities.

"We are going to wish away the financial repercussions of our hiring frenzy".

Delusional.


Black workers have suffered record job losses since the beginning of the COVID-19 pandemic, and they are disproportionately represented among essential workers who must risk their health in order to continue working. Dalton must prioritize the health and security of its staff—no one is disposable. Our staff are beloved members of the Dalton community, and they should be supported in the same way that we are supporting administration and faculty.

Not really a policy, just virtue-signalling fluff.




Provide child and elder care support for faculty and staff, and any families who qualify for financial aid, especially if Dalton remains primarily online due to COVID-19. Dalton should also restructure its parental leave policies for employees; rather than 6 weeks of paid leave and 6 weeks of unpaid leave, Dalton should follow the lead of companies like Netflix and offer a full year of paid leave for new parents.

Favours reproducers over the childless, younger staff over older staff, and introduces financial pressure (and work pressure) that will be paid by either staff members or parents or both.

Commit to paying all Dalton employees—especially staff and independent contractors—at minimum a living wage for New York, as calculated by MIT’s Living Wage Calculator. Ensure racial equity in the proportion of full- and part-time workers; independent contractors; faculty, staff, administration, and associate teachers; and publish information regarding the racial makeup of each of these categories every year.

Deeply delusional.

First, the MIT tool calculate living wages according to household composition, so is Dalton going to pay a single teacher differently to a married one with two household earners? Is it going to pay more to people with children?

Second, the living wage of a single earner is US$34,195 in NY. Have the signatories examined what this would mean for the ongoing Dalton budget? Is everyone already getting more than this, in which case, what's the point?

Double individual faculty and staff professional development (PD) allotment if it is used to service student debt.

Seems stupid but not necessarily poison.

Publish the endowment investment portfolio and immediately divest from private prisons and detention centers; companies that manufacture technology, equipment or weapons for police;

Idiotic and childish, 'all cops are bastards' mentality.


Going forward, any Black student or student of color who appears in Dalton’s promotional materials should receive reduced tuition, or be retroactively compensated the equivalent amount if they graduate before their likeness is used.

Discrimination by race. Poison.
 
So, let me get this straight. The very first demand I quoted:



You find "innocuous"?

Aren't you an academic, laughing dog? Do you think it would be reasonable for your course to be shut down if the grades between black and non-black students differed?
That is non-responsive. You claimed the policies were poisonous. In standard English that suggests all of the policies. I presented some of them as innocuous. In standard English means those and only those proposals. Your response ignores all of them.

Your response suggests
1)a lack of reading comprehension, or
2)a tacit recognization that some of the proposals are not poisonous, or
3) a lack of humanity.

To address your non-responsive question, my answer would depend on the source(s) of that difference. If it was due to my racial bias, I’d expect me to be shutdown. If not, then no I wouldn’t.

How about addressing his point rather than evading?

He asked a simple question: Is point #1 reasonable or not? Even if some of the proposals are reasonable it doesn't matter--one bad one spoils the whole thing.
 
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