What an idiot, part two!

[Trausti]

Hang on. Who’s shoplifting spinach?

Hang on. How is that relevant?
Tom

Good point. If there is genuine concern that some people do not have close access to fresh produce, then there needs to be enforcement against shoplifters (who are not stealing fresh produce). Shoplifters can cause great harm to a community. Recently a drug store in downtown Seattle closed due to shoplifters. (The city attorney rarely prosecutes so offenders quickly released to offend again.) The drug store closed even though its lease was not up - it was cheaper to pay a lease on empty space than incur the monthly store theft. Now people in this community have lost their drug store and there’s a large vacant storefront in downtown.

 

[TSwizzle]

Hang on. Who’s shoplifting spinach?

Wait, is the spinach locked up ? If it's locked up then that's not fair.

 

[TomC]

If there is genuine concern that some people do not have close access to fresh produce, then there needs to be enforcement against shoplifters (who are not stealing fresh produce).

Hang on. How is that relevant?
Tom

 

[Trausti]

If there is genuine concern that some people do not have close access to fresh produce, then there needs to be enforcement against shoplifters (who are not stealing fresh produce).

Hang on. How is that relevant?
Tom

Ah, this is a thread about shoplifting. Look at the OP.

 

[TomC]

Hang on. Who’s shoplifting spinach?

Wait, is the spinach locked up ? If it's locked up then that's not fair.

It kinda is.

It's in stores out on the edge of town. There are 20 places to get Doritos within a few minutes walk.
Tom

 

[TomC]

If there is genuine concern that some people do not have close access to fresh produce, then there needs to be enforcement against shoplifters (who are not stealing fresh produce).

Hang on. How is that relevant?
Tom

Ah, this is a thread about shoplifting. Look at the OP.

Poor dodge. I was responding specifically to your post.
Tom

 

[Trausti]

Ah, this is a thread about shoplifting. Look at the OP.

Poor dodge. I was responding specifically to your post.
Tom

That there are community consequences when shoplifting is not punished. Hello?

 

[TomC]

Ah, this is a thread about shoplifting. Look at the OP.

Poor dodge. I was responding specifically to your post.
Tom

That there are community consequences when shoplifting is not punished. Hello?

That there's a bigger picture to consider. Hello?
Tom

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I'm surprised--highest unemployment rate??

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Hang on. Who’s shoplifting spinach?

The claim was fresh produce was cheap but took work to prepare. He was pointing out the high price of spinach. (And this year produce has been substantially more expensive than normal, anyway.)

If you actually want cheap food, look more towards the grains.

 

[TomC]

If you actually want cheap food, look more towards the grains.

True.
But it mostly comes already processed until what little nutritional value it ever had is gone. Doritos, white bread, soy based stuff. Cheap and available, but calling it food is stretching a point.
Tom

 

[ZiprHead]

I took a girl out.

Even I think that's a bit harsh punishment for shoplifting.

Your jealously is showing.

 

[Elixir]

It is a myth that criminals are all desperate people struggling to survive or that today's US is like revolutionary France.

Correct. Like for example, Donald Trump. Up until now, he hasn't even struggled to stay out of jail, despite law enforcement being fully aware of his criminal activities.

 

[bilby]

I'm surprised--highest unemployment rate??

The reason Wilson was talking about this was that it was surprising.

His experience as a political scientist led him to expect that crime rates would be high, and to seek other factors that might explain this anomaly.

This quote doesn't support Trausti's position at all - it undermines it. But he's either ignorant of its context, or is hoping that his audience is.

 

[Trausti]

I'm surprised--highest unemployment rate??

The reason Wilson was talking about this was that it was surprising.

His experience as a political scientist led him to expect that crime rates would be high, and to seek other factors that might explain this anomaly.

This quote doesn't support Trausti's position at all - it undermines it. But he's either ignorant of its context, or is hoping that his audience is.

My position would be that poverty does not cause crime. You’ve not refuted that.

 

[bilby]

The reason Wilson was talking about this was that it was surprising.

His experience as a political scientist led him to expect that crime rates would be high, and to seek other factors that might explain this anomaly.

This quote doesn't support Trausti's position at all - it undermines it. But he's either ignorant of its context, or is hoping that his audience is.

My position would be that poverty does not cause crime. You’ve not refuted that.

You've not demonstrated it.

But you have tried to support it by quoting an expert who found an instance of poverty which apparently hadn't caused crime, and who found that sufficiently surprising as to warrant further investigation into why such a strange result might occur.

 

[untermensche]

My position would be that poverty does not cause crime. You’ve not refuted that.

Poverty within segregation and widespread racism with a near history of slavery is something different from the poverty of immigrants without that history.

 

[thebeave]

Cynthia Nixon ran for NY governor in 2018 and was endorsed by AOC among others. She received 35% of the primary vote, so not exactly fringe among NY Democrats.

Cynthia Nixon slammed on Twitter after claiming shoplifters shouldn’t be arrested

“The CVS on my corner has started locking up basic items like clothing detergent,” the one-time wannabe New York governor tweeted Saturday.
“As so many families can’t make ends meet right now, I can’t imagine thinking that the way to solve the problem of people stealing basic necessities out of desperation is to prosecute them,” she wrote.
A handful of followers applauded Nixon’s support for the needy — while the vast majority erupted in outrage and baffled amazement.
“Why don’t you leave the doors to your posh co-op unlocked, and the closets and freezer stocked. Those in need can come help themselves?” replied former prosecutor Thomas Kenniff, who is running for Manhattan DA.

Good point, Thomas! Those "limousine liberals" always want to be generous with other people's money.

Gee, I wonder why they might need to lock up the detergent, Cynthia? Maybe its not a sudden epidemic of poor people needing to wash their clothes after wallowing in the dirt all day:

https://www.businessinsider.com/the-tide-black-market-2013-1

Thieves are stealing big red bottles of Tide laundry detergent from bodegas, grocery stores, and big-box retailers across the country. The bizarre thefts initially baffled police officers.
It turns out criminals exchange the detergent for drugs, with a 150-ounce bottle going for either $5 in cash or $10 worth of weed or crack cocaine, Ben Paynter writes for New York Magazine.

Doesn't sound like giving people a free pass to steal laundry detergent is a good thing for the local community.

Gives new meaning to the term "money laundering", though.

 

[laughing dog]

My position would be that poverty does not cause crime.

Is this like "Guns don't kill people, people kill people" in that "Poverty does not cause crime, people cause crime"?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I'm surprised--highest unemployment rate??

The reason Wilson was talking about this was that it was surprising.

His experience as a political scientist led him to expect that crime rates would be high, and to seek other factors that might explain this anomaly.

This quote doesn't support Trausti's position at all - it undermines it. But he's either ignorant of its context, or is hoping that his audience is.

You misunderstand--I wasn't being surprised at the low crime rate. Crime is a social issue far, far more than it is a poverty issue. I was being surprised at the high unemployment--in my experience the Chinese are very resourceful at finding jobs.