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A threat to gay rights
- Thread starter Ahab
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laughing dog
Contributor
What gay right is being imperiled?
Ahab
Member
To pretend that a trans woman is a lesbian undermines lesbianism. The right to associate with those who share your sexual attraction without legal censure.
Just did a couple of searches trying to decide what’s at stake.
I was surprised by how many trans women identify as lesbian, for one thing. (15%-23%)
I also pondered the event-level difference (i.e. this is not in bed, it’s at a social event where presumably most are clothed) between a trans woman with male body parts, a fully transitioned trans woman, and a butch female lesbian.
It’s not the same as the arguments Emily Lake made about trans women with male appearances or body parts in a shelter for abused women, for example.
And I pondered the idea of being able to exclude men (a gender) but not trans women (also a gender) from your party.
So half of me says, “why exclude them” and part of me says “why not exclude them.”
I’ll be reading along to hear other arguments - noting that I don’t have a dog in this race, and it may be unearned privilege to even ponder it, since I would be at neitherr the party, nor the bed.
I was surprised by how many trans women identify as lesbian, for one thing. (15%-23%)
I also pondered the event-level difference (i.e. this is not in bed, it’s at a social event where presumably most are clothed) between a trans woman with male body parts, a fully transitioned trans woman, and a butch female lesbian.
It’s not the same as the arguments Emily Lake made about trans women with male appearances or body parts in a shelter for abused women, for example.
And I pondered the idea of being able to exclude men (a gender) but not trans women (also a gender) from your party.
So half of me says, “why exclude them” and part of me says “why not exclude them.”
I’ll be reading along to hear other arguments - noting that I don’t have a dog in this race, and it may be unearned privilege to even ponder it, since I would be at neitherr the party, nor the bed.
TSwizzle
Let's Go Brandon!
Government should keep out of these petty squabbles and do something constructive like fix the roads or something.
Keith&Co.
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How? How do you undermine a sexual preference?
I like women.
There are people who like men, women, animals, cars, smokers, stockings, nurses, stewardesses, pilots, former women, transitioning men, foreign partners, specific positions.
And i remain here, liking women. Nothing has undermined my liking women.
Is that an actual gay right? Really?
Do straights enjoy a similar right?
And if they are 'women-who-like-women,' associating with 'transgenders-who-like-women' does not violate this right as you expressed it. They share the same sexual attraction.
Politesse
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And of course, I'm sure you're equally concerned about all the actual threats to lesbian people around the world right now. 
Spare me the clutched pearls.
Why is it the only "rights" social conservatives ever seem to care about are those that constitute allowing them discriminate against some other group?
Spare me the clutched pearls.
Why is it the only "rights" social conservatives ever seem to care about are those that constitute allowing them discriminate against some other group?
Keith&Co.
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And of course, I'm sure you're equally concerned about all the actual threats to lesbian people around the world right now.
Spare me the clutched pearls.
Why is it the only "rights" social conservatives ever seem to care about are those that constitute allowing them discriminate against some other group?
Or allow other groups to discriminate against groups the conservatives want discriminated.
laughing dog
Contributor
That is nonsensical.
That right is not under threat in this instance, since it is not baring such associations.
From what I can tell, there are clashing preferences here - the preference for transwomen to be treated as women, and the preference for lesbians to include only "true" lesbians in these events.