Another Step in Russia's Decent

[barbos]

The United States gave to the Soviet Union from October 1, 1941 to May 31, 1945 the following: 427,284 trucks, 13,303 combat vehicles, 35,170 motorcycles, 2,328 ordnance service vehicles, 2,670,371 tons of petroleum products (gasoline and oil), 4,478,116 tons of foodstuffs (canned meats, sugar, flour, salt, etc.), 1,900 steam locomotives, 66 Diesel locomotives, 9,920 flat cars, 1,000 dump cars, 120 tank cars, and 35 heavy machinery cars. One item typical of many was a tire plant that was lifted bodily from the Ford Company's River Rouge Plant and transferred to the USSR. The 1947 money value of the supplies and services amounted to about eleven billion dollars.[37]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease#US_deliveries_to_the_USSR

And in return the Soviets, including Russia, gave the world victory over Nazi Germany at the cost of 12-20 million lives give or take a few million.
Not a bad bargain for the US and the rest of the world, leaving the US and Britain free to fight the Japs and eventually the Germans in Europe.

wikipedia

Although the majority of German military deaths occurred on the Eastern Front, German losses on the Western Front were almost irreplaceable, because most of Germany's resources were being allocated to the Eastern Front. This meant that, while losses there could be replaced to some extent, very few replacements or reinforcements were being sent to the west to stop the advance of the Western Allies

Too bad that the Soviet system, in some ways worse than the Nazis, lasted another 45 years after WW II.

It lasted another 45 years because US decided to put "sanctions" on USSR the moment WW2 ended.

I can't believe that you believe what you are saying.

Why is it so unbelievable?
It's common knowledge that isolation and sanctions is a sure way to prolong tyrannical regimes. North Korea is a proof to that.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Right, this is all that I've been saying. It's an expression of their lack of self-worth that they go and take out their negative emotions on something that has a marginal association to Obama if you squint and look at it sideways. Their actions are a negative comment about them and not a negative comment about anything that was done to them. They should instead be working to feel good about themselves and not worrying about whether or Obama cares to validate them.

You keep being ridiculous. Nobody in Russia or in Oregon's standout cares about Obama's validation.
All I am saying, russians have more reasons to be pissed off at Obama than these idiots in Oregon which really have nothing, so go and criticize these idiots first and then and only then criticize these russian idiots.

I've been criticizing those idiots constantly. That doesn't stop me from criticizing Russia's idiots as well. One does not need to finish up the criticism of one group before beginning the criticism of another group - we can do both simultaneously.

If they care so little about Obama's opinion, why are they rioting and burning books of someone they think has a mild association with him because Obama said something mean about them?

 

[barbos]

You keep being ridiculous. Nobody in Russia or in Oregon's standout cares about Obama's validation.
All I am saying, russians have more reasons to be pissed off at Obama than these idiots in Oregon which really have nothing, so go and criticize these idiots first and then and only then criticize these russian idiots.

I've been criticizing those idiots constantly. That doesn't stop me from criticizing Russia's idiots as well. One does not need to finish up the criticism of one group before beginning the criticism of another group - we can do both simultaneously.

I think you got my point.

If they care so little about Obama's opinion, why are they rioting and burning books of someone they think has a mild association with him because Obama said something mean about them?

Not said, did. And they are not rioting. Arabs are rioting, ukrainians are rioting. These russian idiots burned 50 books and probably wearing some offensive anti-american t-shirts, that's all.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Not said, did. And they are not rioting. Arabs are rioting, ukrainians are rioting. These russian idiots burned 50 books and probably wearing some offensive anti-american t-shirts, that's all.

The rationale is the same. They need to stop caring so much about what Obama thinks about them and start caring about what they think about themselves.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

His hand in the devaluation of the British pound was unconscionable. Treating a country's currency like it was a plaything.

On September 16, 1992, Black Wednesday, Soros's fund sold short more than $10 billion in pounds,^[36] profiting from the UK government's reluctance to either raise its interest rates to levels comparable to those of other European Exchange Rate Mechanism countries or to float its currency.
Finally, the UK withdrew from the European Exchange Rate Mechanism, devaluing the pound. Soros's profit on the bet was estimated at over $1 billion.^[44] He was dubbed "the man who broke the Bank of England".^[45] The estimated cost of Black Wednesday to the UK Treasury was £3.4 billion.^[46]
On October 26, 1992, The Times quoted Soros as saying: "Our total position by Black Wednesday had to be worth almost $10 billion. We planned to sell more than that. In fact, when Norman Lamont said just before the devaluation that he would borrow nearly $15 billion to defend sterling, we were amused because that was about how much we wanted to sell."



Well, the British government takes a lot of the blame for their reluctance to act when they should probably have done so.
If Soros was smart enough to take advantage of the situation, don't put all the blame on him.

Yeah. Currency traders don't have the power to actually break a currency like this. All they can do is recognize that a change must happen and put themselves in a position to exploit it when it does. They may be the straw that breaks the camel's back but it would have broken anyway. Somebody (or a combination of somebodies) would have made that $1 billion anyway, all Soros did is position himself to be the one that made it.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

The United States gave to the Soviet Union from October 1, 1941 to May 31, 1945 the following: 427,284 trucks, 13,303 combat vehicles, 35,170 motorcycles, 2,328 ordnance service vehicles, 2,670,371 tons of petroleum products (gasoline and oil), 4,478,116 tons of foodstuffs (canned meats, sugar, flour, salt, etc.), 1,900 steam locomotives, 66 Diesel locomotives, 9,920 flat cars, 1,000 dump cars, 120 tank cars, and 35 heavy machinery cars. One item typical of many was a tire plant that was lifted bodily from the Ford Company's River Rouge Plant and transferred to the USSR. The 1947 money value of the supplies and services amounted to about eleven billion dollars.[37]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lend-Lease#US_deliveries_to_the_USSR

And in return the Soviets, including Russia, gave the world victory over Nazi Germany at the cost of 12-20 million lives give or take a few million.
Not a bad bargain for the US and the rest of the world, leaving the US and Britain free to fight the Japs and eventually the Germans in Europe.

wikipedia

Although the majority of German military deaths occurred on the Eastern Front, German losses on the Western Front were almost irreplaceable, because most of Germany's resources were being allocated to the Eastern Front. This meant that, while losses there could be replaced to some extent, very few replacements or reinforcements were being sent to the west to stop the advance of the Western Allies

Too bad that the Soviet system, in some ways worse than the Nazis, lasted another 45 years after WW II.

It lasted another 45 years because US decided to put "sanctions" on USSR the moment WW2 ended.

I can't believe that you believe what you are saying.

Why is it so unbelievable?
It's common knowledge that isolation and sanctions is a sure way to prolong tyrannical regimes. North Korea is a proof to that.

True. "Siege mentality" sets in. It becomes relatively easy for the regime to blame all of its problems on foreign powers and thus direct criticism away from the state.

We have this fantasy in the West that bullying other countries with sanctions and threats will somehow inspire huge numbers of its top-level military commanders to commit treason and/or defect to our side. I don't think it's ever worked.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

True. "Siege mentality" sets in. It becomes relatively easy for the regime to blame all of its problems on foreign powers and thus direct criticism away from the state.

We have this fantasy in the West that bullying other countries with sanctions and threats will somehow inspire huge numbers of its top-level military commanders to commit treason and/or defect to our side. I don't think it's ever worked.

Does engaging with them work better? The US has been sucking the Saudi Royal family's cock for decades and that's still an oppressive hellhole which is worse off for its people than the sanctioned country of Iran. Being all buddy-buddy with Saddam Hussein just led to a situation where they felt they needed to impose sanctions on Saddam Hussein. The Sultan of Brunei is treated by Western leaders like he walks on water and he just imposed Sharia law on his country. I really don't see how Obama scheduling a weekly makeout session with Putin would be more productive than trying to isolate him with sanctions.

There's some value to the notion of telling the leadership of a country that you don't like what they're doing and you're not going to let them profit from their misdeeds.

 

[4321lynx]

True. "Siege mentality" sets in. It becomes relatively easy for the regime to blame all of its problems on foreign powers and thus direct criticism away from the state.

We have this fantasy in the West that bullying other countries with sanctions and threats will somehow inspire huge numbers of its top-level military commanders to commit treason and/or defect to our side. I don't think it's ever worked.

Does engaging with them work better? The US has been sucking the Saudi Royal family's cock for decades and that's still an oppressive hellhole which is worse off for its people than the sanctioned country of Iran. Being all buddy-buddy with Saddam Hussein just led to a situation where they felt they needed to impose sanctions on Saddam Hussein. The Sultan of Brunei is treated by Western leaders like he walks on water and he just imposed Sharia law on his country. I really don't see how Obama scheduling a weekly makeout session with Putin would be more productive than trying to isolate him with sanctions.

There's some value to the notion of telling the leadership of a country that you don't like what they're doing and you're not going to let them profit from their misdeeds.

It didn't work in Cuba. Sure, the population suffered, but the sabctions did not touch, never mind destroy. Castro & Co.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

It didn't work in Cuba. Sure, the population suffered, but the sabctions did not touch, never mind destroy. Castro & Co.

Right, but did the policy of the rest of the planet to engage with Cuba and give them money ever touch, never mind destroy, Castro & Co? Or any other dictator people have engaged and traded with?

 

[Will Wiley]

What you said in your second sentence contradicts your first sentence. They are blaming the US for everything that's wrong with them instead of looking to themselves and they are acting out in the hopes that Papa Obama will notice them and give them a hug and let them know that he thinks they're all special snowflakes.

What I'm saying is that they don't need Obama's approval in order to feel special. The only person who's approval they need is the person they see when they look in the mirror.

Edit - By that second paragraph, I meant that they need their own approval. I wasn't talking about getting the approval of the FSB agent who's monitoring them from the secret room behind their mirror. I apologize if that was unclear.

I have no idea what are you trying to say here.

He is not trying to say anything. He is bored with nothing to do so he is trying to get a reaction from you

 

[4321lynx]

It didn't work in Cuba. Sure, the population suffered, but the sabctions did not touch, never mind destroy. Castro & Co.

Right, but did the policy of the rest of the planet to engage with Cuba and give them money ever touch, never mind destroy, Castro & Co? Or any other dictator people have engaged and traded with?

You mean like trading with China now?

And what was the point of making two generations of Cubans suffer? Just because they stole from the Mafia what the Mafia sole from them? Are they going to hand the casinos and hotels back to the Mafia?
They're still the best at baseball, in spite of it all. Hope the BLUE jAYS SCOUTS ARE OFFERING PAY IN US DOLLARS THERE.

 

[J842P]

Well maybe the Russians should lay off the vodka, get their heads out of their asses, and realize that most of their troubles have to do with the neo-czarist, former KGB-agent dictator they have.

You must understand, Putin is Russia's Trump and many Russians are the equivalent of Trump voters.

Putin and Trump are no where near equivalent. Yes, they play to a tough-man image, but Trump is no Putin, for fuck's sake. That's giving Trump way to much credit. Trump is a blowhard. Putin is a cunning guy.

- - - Updated - - -

Right, this is all that I've been saying. It's an expression of their lack of self-worth that they go and take out their negative emotions on something that has a marginal association to Obama if you squint and look at it sideways. Their actions are a negative comment about them and not a negative comment about anything that was done to them. They should instead be working to feel good about themselves and not worrying about whether or Obama cares to validate them.

You keep being ridiculous. Nobody in Russia or in Oregon's standout cares about Obama's validation.
All I am saying, russians have more reasons to be pissed off at Obama than these idiots in Oregon which really have nothing, so go and criticize these idiots first and then and only then criticize these russian idiots.

I'm pretty sure Tom Sawyer has made plenty of criticism of the Oregon idiots.

 

[J842P]

True. "Siege mentality" sets in. It becomes relatively easy for the regime to blame all of its problems on foreign powers and thus direct criticism away from the state.

We have this fantasy in the West that bullying other countries with sanctions and threats will somehow inspire huge numbers of its top-level military commanders to commit treason and/or defect to our side. I don't think it's ever worked.

Does engaging with them work better? The US has been sucking the Saudi Royal family's cock for decades and that's still an oppressive hellhole which is worse off for its people than the sanctioned country of Iran. Being all buddy-buddy with Saddam Hussein just led to a situation where they felt they needed to impose sanctions on Saddam Hussein. The Sultan of Brunei is treated by Western leaders like he walks on water and he just imposed Sharia law on his country. I really don't see how Obama scheduling a weekly makeout session with Putin would be more productive than trying to isolate him with sanctions.

There's some value to the notion of telling the leadership of a country that you don't like what they're doing and you're not going to let them profit from their misdeeds.

The US doesn't want Saudi regime change.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

True. "Siege mentality" sets in. It becomes relatively easy for the regime to blame all of its problems on foreign powers and thus direct criticism away from the state.

We have this fantasy in the West that bullying other countries with sanctions and threats will somehow inspire huge numbers of its top-level military commanders to commit treason and/or defect to our side. I don't think it's ever worked.

Sanctions as such rarely accomplish much but the threat of them does--we just don't see it because the low-grade bad guys are dissuaded from incurring our wrath in the first place.

It also helps with NK--sanctions mean they have fewer guns, fewer $ to pour into weapons. This it lowers the threat they pose.

- - - Updated - - -

It didn't work in Cuba. Sure, the population suffered, but the sabctions did not touch, never mind destroy. Castro & Co.

Since the rest of the world didn't go along with our sanctions the effect was small. The Cuban people suffered because of Castro & communism, not because of our sanctions.

 

[barbos]

Latest news. These idiots apparently realized that they made a big mistake and now say they did not burn anything, just put them in the boxes.
Also letter discussing removal of these books was called fake.

 

[barbos]

Since the rest of the world didn't go along with our sanctions the effect was small. The Cuban people suffered because of Castro & communism, not because of our sanctions.

They suffered because US made Castro regime more stable through the use of the sanctions.
But I understand americans suffered too, they were forced to consume corn syrup instead of regular sugar.