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Biden Should Call on Trump

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ideologyhunter

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Joe Biden should ask Trump to address his followers clearly and emphatically on camera to give up their plans to return to Washington in a week. Some of those followers are so wild and crazy that they won't listen. They may still show up. From some of the postings you can read on google, they are in full nostril-flared revolutionary mode. Some of them may show up to commit suicide-by-cop.
But some of the people who mobbed on Wednesday love Trump beyond all measure. At best -- my guess -- a Trump message could peel away some of the numbers and make the demonstrations containable. At worst -- if, say, Trump won't even do this much for the country -- it will make the destruction of Trumpism through impeachment or indictment all that more securable.
Am I in Lala Land? I don't see many voices that these folks listen to, and trust.
 
Do you think Mr. Trump would either pay attention or actually agree to do it? I don't.
 
It would definitely reduce Cheato’s legal exposure...
 
Elixir said:
It would definitely reduce Cheato’s legal exposure...
Click to expand...

I'm not sure it would.

One of the unfortunate aspects of the US legal system is that taking responsibility for any part you play in a bad situation makes you a bigger target than if you just flat out lied.

Similarly, I'm a small town business owner. If I scrape and salt the sidewalk in front of my store, I'm liable if someone slips and falls. Because I contributed to the dangerous conditions. If I ignore the snow and ice, it's an act of God.

Unfortunately, I'm pretty sure that Trump's continued lying is the correct thing to do, from the standpoint of legal liability. Lie from the start, and hire excellent lawyers like Guliani to keep lying for you in court. Trump didn't get rich by being honest.

Tom
 
ideologyhunter said:
Am I in Lala Land? I don't see many voices that these folks listen to, and trust.
Click to expand...
Trump's whole campaign success comes from telling them what they want to hear.
When he made his speech the day after, they decided it was a deep-state fake. At best he was forced to say 'prosecution' and 'crimes.'
If he tells them to stand down no one will believe he was serious. "The (fill in the blank from your conspiracy bingo card)s 'got' to him, probably threatened his kids, gonna lock him up in GITMO if he doesn't denounce the True Patriots."
 
TomC said:
Similarly, I'm a small town business owner. If I scrape and salt the sidewalk in front of my store, I'm liable if someone slips and falls. Because I contributed to the dangerous conditions. If I ignore the snow and ice, it's an act of God.
Click to expand...

I was a small town business owner in the Rocky Mountains where acts of God involving snow and ice are common, for almost two decades. I don't know what town or State or city you live in, but in this town you have a time limit after snowfall stops for claiming acts of god as an excuse. There are local "enforcement officers" (same rank as dog catchers afaik) whose whose job it is to patrol and cite (VERY expensive tickets, iirc starting at $500) businesses that are lax in shoveling sidewalks, and compliance with the city's requirements indemnifies the business and makes the city (the city's insurance) the liable party if anyone gets hurt. It happens.
 
I think you are beyond la la land. Your suggestion is a good example of what got us here, expecting a sociopath to act reasonably of his own volition.
 
Okay, okay!!! Let me do the un-Donald thing and concede.

1. Unless he told the crazies that he actually lost the election, it wouldn't work the way I imagined. (Even then, they'd see him as a hostage.)
2. He really is too deranged to take a sensible, selfless action. I get it.
3. Everyone forget this OP and pretend that the title was 'Biden Should Call Trump a Loser and an Absolute Anus in His Inaugural Address'
 
Back in emperor training classes at the College of Empire and Conquest)(Go Imperialists!), we were taught to never give an order one does not expect to be followed.

If Trump were to ask his followers to accept the election results would violate this principle as much as asking him to do it.
 
Look away, for I am hideous. I am in sackcloth and ashes, and I am huddling with the Ben-Hur lepers. (Shit, post #7 makes me complicit in the rise of Trump!) I am a sin eater! Absolve me! Penance!! Penance!!!
 
You're right. My daydream -- and that's all it was -- was that T could be sold on speaking truth to the maniacs as a show of good faith to the investigators that will be on his trail. (Isn't it amazing that we have to talk about this, at all? If a normal human being knew that his words were stirring up a violent movement, he would do everything in his power to put the insanity back in the bottle.)
 
ideologyhunter said:
You're right. My daydream -- and that's all it was -- was that T could be sold on speaking truth to the maniacs as a show of good faith to the investigators that will be on his trail. (Isn't it amazing that we have to talk about this, at all? If a normal human being knew that his words were stirring up a violent movement, he would do everything in his power to put the insanity back in the bottle.)
Click to expand...

It never hurts to have a positive outlook on life. Only when that positive outlook wanes into polyannaish sentiment and behavior is there a danger.

Can I talk about my one sibling for a moment? She is devoutly religious. Don't misunderstand, she is a good person in that she doesn't go around robbing banks or cheating on her taxes or her husband. She worked all her life and paid taxes. She is devoted to her one child and all things considered she makes the world a better place and I love her. But as a Trumpy supporter and as a devoutly religious person it is quite obvious that she is credulous to a fault, ready to believe in unevidenced claims be they claims about election fraud or invisible, magic creatures living in the sky that she is going to live with when she's dead.

So I take that for what it is. I suspect she had a credulous, xenophobic, fearful, racist streak in her that needs to be guarded against lest we start burning people alive again because they don't believe the right things. Anyone cursed with the need to worship falls into that category.

If there's a lesson here I think it's to recognize that our emotions are just another tool, not something that should do our thinking.
 
T.G.G. Moogly said:
ideologyhunter said:
You're right. My daydream -- and that's all it was -- was that T could be sold on speaking truth to the maniacs as a show of good faith to the investigators that will be on his trail. (Isn't it amazing that we have to talk about this, at all? If a normal human being knew that his words were stirring up a violent movement, he would do everything in his power to put the insanity back in the bottle.)
Click to expand...

It never hurts to have a positive outlook on life. Only when that positive outlook wanes into polyannaish sentiment and behavior is there a danger.

Can I talk about my one sibling for a moment? She is devoutly religious. Don't misunderstand, she is a good person in that she doesn't go around robbing banks or cheating on her taxes or her husband. She worked all her life and paid taxes. She is devoted to her one child and all things considered she makes the world a better place and I love her. But as a Trumpy supporter and as a devoutly religious person it is quite obvious that she is credulous to a fault, ready to believe in unevidenced claims be they claims about election fraud or invisible, magic creatures living in the sky that she is going to live with when she's dead.

So I take that for what it is. I suspect she had a credulous, xenophobic, fearful, racist streak in her that needs to be guarded against lest we start burning people alive again because they don't believe the right things. Anyone cursed with the need to worship falls into that category.

If there's a lesson here I think it's to recognize that our emotions are just another tool, not something that should do our thinking.
Click to expand...

I think there's a bright line that is crossed when credulous beliefs in sky daddies and orange reincarnations of Jesus, morph from dearly held beliefs into motivational sets for outward action.
 
ideologyhunter said:
Joe Biden should ask Trump to address his followers clearly and emphatically on camera to give up their plans to return to Washington in a week. Some of those followers are so wild and crazy that they won't listen. They may still show up. From some of the postings you can read on google, they are in full nostril-flared revolutionary mode. Some of them may show up to commit suicide-by-cop.
But some of the people who mobbed on Wednesday love Trump beyond all measure. At best -- my guess -- a Trump message could peel away some of the numbers and make the demonstrations containable. At worst -- if, say, Trump won't even do this much for the country -- it will make the destruction of Trumpism through impeachment or indictment all that more securable.
Am I in Lala Land? I don't see many voices that these folks listen to, and trust.
Click to expand...

I agree with you in spirit, but I think you've been put into an expected pattern by Biden making statements. Biden has an interest in becoming President. People who oppose him and some independents will see it as self-serving since he gains.

If INSTEAD we modify your idea slightly to have someone else do it, then it could appear less self-serving to the vast majority of Americans. Examples:
A bi-partisan group from Congress read by a Republican in high office
Former Presidents including W
A bi-partisan group of governors
 
They won’t show. There are 30,000 NG in DC. They wouldn’t risk getting their ass blown away. Like their dear leader, they’re ultimately cowards.

They will be back though. Just not quite so soon. Like Nazis in 1923. They’ll regroup
 
They won’t show. There are 30,000 NG in DC. They wouldn’t risk getting their ass blown away. Like their dear leader, they’re ultimately cowards.

They will be back though. Just not quite so soon. Like Nazis in 1923. They’ll regroup
 
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